Wood Chisel Survey for Beginners (Revised For The Record)

[Bob Smalser]

Okay, here I go yet again -- but I just have to ask:

Butt chisel vs. bevel edge chisel -- how are they defined and what's the difference?

Mortise chisel vs. sash (?) chisel -- again, how are they defined and what's the difference?


That’s OK…some of it still confuses me these days as there is some overlap between types. This is just my take on it as terminology by trade and era varies a bit:

Bevel edge doesn't mean much per se, as even some firmer and framing chisels have them....it merely allows getting into a tighter corner. Neither does socket or tang handles, although the larger chisels are generally socket chisels, as are many high-grade chisels, as sockets are considered a better design as handles are easier to replace, but cost significantly more to manufacture. To call a chisel a “socket” chisel with no other descriptor is a common mistake today, often by people who should know better.

http://pic3.picturetrail.com/VOL12/1104763/5090019/64890070.jpg

Butt Chisel: Any short chisel, usually with bevel edge and design suitable for paring and striking with 30-degree bevels. A finish carpenter or shipwright’s pocket chisel easy to store with a major role in hanging doors and all around trimming. Usually tang handles.

http://pic3.picturetrail.com/VOL12/1104763/5090019/72454914.jpg

Bench Chisel: Longer chisel for workbench use. Paring and light chopping, usually with 30-degree bevels and beveled edges.

http://www.tools-for-woodworking.com/ProductImages/chisels/122351.jpg

http://www.leevalley.com/images/item/woodworking/chisels/85s0301g1.jpg

Paring Chisel: Long, thinner chisels not designed for any striking, only paring with 20-25 degree bevels. Some have "cranked" handles for clearance and were primarily used by pattern makers making negative patterns in soft pine. Others are skew cut to reach into corners, and a “dovetail” chisel is diamond-shaped to clean female sliding dovetail sockets. Usually with tang handles.

http://pic3.picturetrail.com/VOL12/1104763/4959362/63036333.jpg

Firmer Chisel: Usually the same length as bench chisels but of thicker, heavier steel, usually straight sided. For paring and striking with 30-degree bevels. Usually with socket handles.

http://pic3.picturetrail.com/VOL12/1104763/4775424/60398418.jpg

Framing Chisel: Larger, longer chisels usually an inch or larger wide. Some were designed for paring with beveled edges and 20-25 degree bevels and some for striking with square edges and 30-degree bevels. Usually with hooped, socket handles.

http://www.tools-for-woodworking.com/ProductImages/chisels/041710.jpg

Corner Chisel: A framer forged into a 90-degree angle to clean out corners. Generally 30-degree bevels. Usually with hooped, socket handles.

http://pic3.picturetrail.com/VOL12/1104763/5090019/72455620.jpg

English “Pigsticker” Mortice Chisel: Ward and other makers. A short, stubby, fit-in-the-tool-chest, tang-handled mortise chisel with unhooped handle designed for striking. All mortise chisels are generally straight sided…some have some taper for ease in popping out chips. All with 35-40 degree bevels.

Continued…

[Bob Smalser]

http://www.tools-for-woodworking.com/ProductImages/chisels/041725.jpg

Sash Mortise Chisel: Medium length mortise chisel for bench use, generally with unhooped handles. “Sash” comes from window factories, and there is some confusion describing medium length and long length mortise chisels as factories generally used the longer chisels but the medium ones are often called “sash” chisels.

http://www.leevalley.com/images/item/woodworking/chisels/55j0506s1.jpg

German Pattern Mortise Chisel: My term for them as they don’t fit other descriptors. Heavy, untapered blades and hooped, tang handles.

http://pic3.picturetrail.com/VOL12/1104763/5305809/67802788.jpg

Millwright or Factory Mortise Chisel: Very long, very heavy mortise chisel designed for heavy striking with heavy, hooped handles. Many were 16” long and often made by manufacturers like New Haven Edge Tool who specialized in large chisels. Always with hooped, socket handles.

http://pic3.picturetrail.com/VOL12/1104763/3302197/42016002.jpg

Slick: A large, very heavy 2-4” framing chisel with long handle up to 24” designed for paring large timbers with 20-25 degree bevels. Never struck. Always with socket handles. These and the heavier framing chisels are dangerous and should have protective edge covers made.

Buying old chisels, you can expect to see many combinations, as handles are interchangeable and chisels are often converted to other uses as they wear. The butt socket chisel in the top left picture was originally a well-worn DR Barton firmer I converted, and the skew parers below were originally socket bench chisels of many flavors:

http://pic3.picturetrail.com/VOL12/1104763/5090019/72454940.jpg

From my observations in buying up lots of cast-off chisels to make up sets, anything marked "Stanley", "Witherby", "Winchester", "Chas Buck" or "White" is going to a collector for too high a price....along with some Swan's. Greenlee, older (not newer) Buck, New Haven Edge, Ohio Tool, DR Barton, Underhill, Union Hardware, GI Mix, Shapleigh Hardware, Eric Anton Berg, Dickerson, Gillespie, Dixon, PS&W or PEXTO, Robt Duke, Merrill, Butcher, Hibbard OVB, Simmons Keen Kutter, Lakeside and several other old makers are every bit as good as the collector prizes and are much less expensive. Most unmarked chisels of that era were usually made by one of the above makers and are also generally excellent.

The only really poor socket chisels I've observed buying are newer Craftsman (older socket Craftsman were made by Greenlee) of too-thick, modern, gummy, shiny chrome-vandalium steel...and some "Eclipse" brand and Stanley Defiance that won't take an edge.

The bad news in making up sets for yourself is that used tool dealers rarely understand any of the above and you have to look at each and every listing in detail. The good news is because of that ignorance and the minimum number of name brands collected, all of the others, including many of the rarer types are dirt cheap.



Pictures other than mine are from Harry Miller, Lee Valley and Highland Hardware.

[Bob Powers]

Wow!!!!!!!

[Frank Pellow]

Thanks for the very well illustrated lesson Bob.

[Gene Collison]

Nice Job Bob, thanks again for posting :):)

Gene

[nick kaplan]

thanks for the time spent in the edecational thread. i have been spending a lot of time on ebay looking for chisels...i have no idea what is a reasonable price for the types of chisels listed in ur post. is it fair to assume that if it's old it's good? could u give a price range that it reasonable for chisels so that a uneducated newbie like me doesn't get ripped off. i'm not interested in new tools and am drawn to the oldie but goodies. thanks! -nick in virginia

[Bob Smalser]

That article was expanded and published in FWW mag, and is available on-line at the Taunton Press site.

Here's the part of the same article that addresses your questions but was edited out. Magazines are in the business of catering to advertisers who sell you new, not used tools. ;)

I can't talk to price. Mostly I bought chisel lots like the one shown below, rehabbed them all and sold off the excess. The chisels I kept then penciled out real cheap if you don't count labor. But I've paid as much as 60 bucks for an odd-sized Witherby millwright chisel I needed to fill out a set, too. Cost depends mostly on you.


Should I buy older, used chisels?

http://pic20.picturetrail.com/VOL12/1104763/5090019/64842844.jpg

Depends. For newcomers it can be problematic, as you need good tools to use now but have not yet acquired the skills needed to rehabilitate abused antiques into something useful:

http://pic20.picturetrail.com/VOL12/1104763/3302197/62367827.jpg

If you already have good grinding and honing skills and can also make handles, then flea markets and local and on-line tool auctions are an inexhaustible source of top-quality, high-carbon tools; often at prices less than you’d pay for the equivalent quantity of raw tool steel. Of course, you are trading your labor and rehabilitation skills for the money you save – and the labor can be considerable. I’ve done a bit of this at various auctions for myself and for tradesmen friends who don’t use computers, and I’ll share what I’ve learned.

As long as the chisel is old, factory-made, and intact with good length remaining, I’m not too concerned about condition short of severe pitting. For me, blade backs are easily ground on the belt sander to flatten and remove pits, sockets can be repaired, steel can be polished and blued to hide rust staining, and handles are easily made on the lathe. Anything marked "Stanley", "Witherby", "Winchester", “James Swan”, "Chas Buck" or "L&IJ White" is generally going to a collector for too high a price unless they are part of large, handleless lots. Older (not newer) Greenlee and Buck Bros, New Haven Edge Tool, Ohio Tool, Crossman, DR Barton, Underhill, Union Hardware, Jennings, Sargent, GI Mix, Shapleigh Hardware, Eric Anton Berg, Dickerson, Gillespie, Wye, Dixon, PS&W or PEXTO, Robt Duke, Fulton, Merrill, Butcher, Stiletto, Hibbard OVB, Simmons Keen Kutter, Lakeside and several other old makers and hardware store brands are every bit as good as the collector prizes and are much less expensive. Most unmarked chisels of that era were usually made by one of the above makers for a hardware distributor and are also generally excellent.

The only really poor socket chisels I've observed are newer Craftsman (older socket Craftsman were often made by Greenlee) of shiny, chrome-vanadium steel, some "Eclipse" brand and the occasional Stanley Defiance that refuse to take an excellent edge. Also, used tool dealers rarely know their wares well, and you have to look at each and every listing in detail to find what you need.

Having rehabbed around 200 of these old chisels and gouges over the past several years, I'll offer a quality opinion based on the ones I've used:

Top-Tier:

Witherby
Swan
Gillespie
New Haven Edge gov't contracts marked "USA" or "USN"

Hard to Call between First and Second....but always most excellent:

DR Barton
PS&W or PEXTO
Greenlee thin paring chisels
Buck gouges


Second-Tier:

Stanley
Stilletto
Ohio Tool
New Haven Edge
White
Older Buck (older chisels will have sockets, which went out around the time forging did)
Older Greenlee
Older Craftsman made by Greenlee
Winchester
Wye
Chas Buck
Douglas (precurser company to Swan)
GI Mix
Eric Anton Berg
Underhill
Jennings
Sargent
KeenKutter
Hibbard OBV
Dixon
Robt Duke
Fulton
Merrill
Butcher
Lakeside
Union Hardware
Dickerson
Shapleigh Hardware (Diamond Edge brand)

Third-Tier (Don't buy)

Stanley Defiance
Eclipse
Newer Greenlee, Buck or Stanley socket chisels made in the 1960's and later.
Any chisel with a vanadium finish like used on today's mechanic's tools.

Al the hardware store brands were made by a larger chisel manufacturer. Greenlee seems to have made a lot of them. One store bought from Witherby....Shapleigh?...but I don't remember which one. Shapleigh bought Sargent planes as house brands, and may be the one whose chisels were made in Winsted, Conn.

[Mike Henderson]

Bob - thanks for the information. One question: You mention that the slicks were never struck, but the pictures you show have a couple of the slicks with hooped handles. Seems you wouldn't hoop a handle unless it was to be struck. Or were those handles replaced by someone who didn't know?

Mike

[Bob Smalser]

http://pic3.picturetrail.com/VOL12/1104763/3302197/42016002.jpg

I coulda been more clear I guess. That's a slick framed by two 1 1/2" framing chisels, the "heavier framing chisels" the text refers to.

[James Mittlefehldt]

Where does Ohio Tool fit into your hiearchy Bob I see quite a few of those on that auction site and they sometimes turn up here?

[Ralph Okonieski]

Excellent tutorial. The pics and text are well done. It is very useful. Thank you.

[Bob Smalser]

Where does Ohio Tool fit into your hiearchy Bob I see quite a few of those on that auction site and they sometimes turn up here?

Right in the middle. I've had several go through here. Good tools.

[Martin Cash]

Hi Bob,
Thanks for the tutorial. It is excellent.
In Australia we don't see as many of these brands as we see English makes - our heritage I guess.
I have just picked up some socket chisels that are clearly of US origin and among them are the following:
Rockford
Bridge Tool Co
Globe and
True Value *

Have these crossed your path and where would they fit in the above hierarchy?
Many Thanks
MC

[Martin Cash]

Hi again Bob,
Here is a picture of the chisels mentioned above.
The brands are (from the top):
Globe
Rockford
Bridge Tool Co
True Value
and a No Name chisel with a butchered sharpening job.
I am thinking that only the bottom two have original handles, but maybe also the Rockford, but it looks too new.
Bob,
you have mentioned that these could have been made by one of the major manufacturers.
Perhaps the pictures will lend a clue to their home of origin.
Thanks in anticipation.
MC

[Bob Smalser]

Here's your hardware-store-brand chisels by their original makers.

http://www.sawmillcreek.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=95744&d=1219990112

http://pic20.picturetrail.com/VOL12/1104763/5090019/332356968.jpg

From top to bottom:

1) Stanley. No doubt about yours. Nobody else ground them like that.

2) Unmarked. Looks like a numkber of brands.....the narrow chisels are difficult to ID.

3) Unmarked Greenlee. But studying the pic yours could also be a Witherby.

4) Greenlee. I'd give yours a 90%+ chance of being Greenlees, as they were one of the larger factories in business through the 1960's and made a lot of hardware store brands.

5) Douglas. But no telling with narrow sash chisels like these.

[Martin Cash]

Many Thanks again Bob.
It is great to have an online encyclopedia like you handy.
You are a champion.
Gratias
MC

[Peter Rudy]

Hello Bob

What an amazing article - I learned more in 10 minutes than in hours of trolling.

Questions:

1. You said: DON'T BUY: Newer Greenlee, Buck or Stanley socket chisels made in the 1960's and later. (Did 'socket' apply to Stanley or all three makers?)

And How do you distingush 1960's Greenlee, Buck or Stanley socket chisels from older chisels? Is it a logo change? Such as the stylized Greenlee horseshoe logo vs the straight text; or the Buck Bros stag logo vs the "-Buck Bros.-"?

2. Stanley Socket chisels without a 750, or 720. What is the difference between marked on the socket Stanley 750's and identical looking Stanley's that simply say: Stanley Made In USA.

Many thanks!

[Gary Herrmann]

I don't know if this is accurate, but I have several Greenlees - I think they're firmer chisels. A couple of them are made from shinier steel. They also seem to not quite as thick as the others. I wonder if that marks them as newer?

I don't recall how or if the logos differ, but I can look when I get home. I'm sure there will be some differences, since I have a mixed bag, er roll of chisels.

[Bob Smalser]

1. You said: DON'T BUY: Newer Greenlee, Buck or Stanley socket chisels made in the 1960's and later. (Did 'socket' apply to Stanley or all three makers?)

And How do you distingush 1960's Greenlee, Buck or Stanley socket chisels from older chisels? Is it a logo change? Such as the stylized Greenlee horseshoe logo vs the straight text; or the Buck Bros stag logo vs the "-Buck Bros.-"?

2. Stanley Socket chisels without a 750, or 720. What is the difference between marked on the socket Stanley 750's and identical looking Stanley's that simply say: Stanley Made In USA.



Don't worry about it. The differences are small and there weren't enough socket chisels made in the 60's and later that even finding one is common.

And a Stanley is a Stanley as the steel all came out of the same pot. I find they are hit or miss on steel quality without regard to markings.

[Peter Rudy]

Thanks Bob. I will do my best not worry.

Given that Stanley, Swan and Witherby etc are sought by collectors, what makers would you suggest for a serious user?

I have been taking fine woodworking classes for a year. After cutting a fair share of dovetails (one joinery class required one a day) I want to move up from my Marple Blue Chips. Getting a set of LN would be too easy. Would appreciate your suggestions.

Noticed in the first part of your original posting the photo of the Footprint bench chisels. My wife is English and I have picked up some older Footprint tools in the UK. You do not hear about them much in the US. Your thoughts?

[Bob Smalser]

My concern is you not get wrapped around the wrong ideas. Greenlees remain an excellent value, as do Buck.....both of which have just as many good chisels in the pile as Swan, Witherby or Stanley. But Blue Chips will still do the job, and doing the job is the important part.


As do Footprints for that matter. The set you mention I used to 30 years before eBay came along and I could pick up oldies easily. Excellent chisels, on a par with today's Ashley Iles.

[Erik Manchester]

Bob,

I have acquired a fair number of old chisels from many of the manufacturers that you mention and I intend to restore them as I get time. I have often looked (without success) for a good online reference of the makers marks for the more popular brands of old tools (Witherby, Swan, Buck, etc) that show their evolution on a timeline.

Both Witherby and Swan have many different marks and I have found quite a few examples in many different places, but not in a single convenient location. Are you aware of such a source online, or must I buy a reference book that would undoubtedly have lots of info?

Any help gratefully appreciated,

Erik

[Bob Smalser]

Are you aware of such a source online, or must I buy a reference book that would undoubtedly have lots of info?


http://www.oldtoolsshop.com/z_pdf/1WinstedEdge/WinstedEdgeTools-ne.pdf

http://www.davistownmuseum.org/bioSwan.html

http://www.davistownmuseum.org/bioBuckBrothers.html

http://www.davistownmuseum.org/bioBarton.html

http://www.sydnassloot.com/Brace/PSW.htm

http://www.thckk.org/

[Gary Herrmann]

I'm thinkin thats a yes. Great resources. Thanks Bob.

[Erik Manchester]

Bob,

Thanks a bunch for the online resource links. I am trying to build a timeline for some of the more popular brands that have been around for quite a while and everything helps. As I am overseas at the moment I have time for online searches and trolling e-bay, however making shavings will have to wait until next year.

Thanks again,

Erik

[Shawn MacRitchie]

Hi Bob,

I would like to whole-heartedly echo the appreciation of you sharing your wealth of experience. I am a latecomer to the woodworking world. It had always been a desire of mine to take up woodworking and finally about a year ago, my wife and I purchased a house that had a respectable place for a shop. So after a little over 20 years of dreaming I am able to realize that desire. Not to be too schmaltzy, but I honestly feel that I have finally made it to my home port after being adrift for way too many years. I especially enjoy the great sense of community amongst woodworkers and most notably the willingness of experienced craftsmen such as yourself, to share their knowledge. So again, Thank you.

I have been actively involved in music as an instrumentalist for most of my life (not professionally mind you, but seriously active none the less) and I mention this only to express that I have a very special appreciation for edged hand tools because of the control and tactile feedback they engender. I get a special sense of satisfaction (and the requisite, occasional frustration) from what little, true hand work I have done so far. Part of this is also the acquisition of quality old tools and the act of refurbishing and tuning them up (as opposed to the sometimes mind-boggling do's and dont's of "restoring" as defined by collectors). I feel a certain romantic sense of legacy in continuing their working life and respect the pride of craftsmanship that is often exemplified by the quality of many of the old tools compared to the vast majority of the commonly produced tools of today (with notable exceptions of brands I can't afford).

Anyway, without rambling too much more, I will get to the meat of my post. I thoroughly enjoyed your contribution to the Fine Woodworking Hand Tools special and am even more glad you have filled back in the casualties of the editing process, here. It is a tremendous resource to me as an acquirer of "users". I have picked my fair share of crap, due to ignorance on my part, and only discovered it as I am tuning it up or worse, when I put it to wood.

In reference to your descriptions of the varieties in the mortising family of chisels, you mentioned the long chisels once used in sash production work. I am concentrating on developing some good, basic mortising skills and would like to make the right choice in the style of chisel to use and am attracted to the leverage these could provide. From a functionality standpoint, what differentiates a longer, straight-sided firmer and one of these? And in the same vein, what would you recommend for mortising and/or what are the advantages of a registered mortise chisel vs. the long, sash-production chisel vs. a quality, longer, straight-sided firmer with a mortise-friendly bevel? And as a side question, what angle do you personally sharpen to for mortising? Unfortunately I do not have the budget and more importantly, do not yet have the skill level to have a large stable consisting of dozens of chisels for very specific tasks. However, I am a firm believer in the right tool for the right job and can be diligently resourceful enough to build my arsenal if you can help by pointing me in the right direction.

Also, in my trolling efforts acquiring tools, I have picked up a 1/4" socket chisel, at a price I could not refuse, labelled simply Hibbard on the socket and underneath that, True Value. I have read up on Hibbard's history and know that they created the True Value brand and am curious if this chisel is from a different product line than the OVB labelled chisels you and other sources have described. In addition I am curious about its best use. The blade portion itself, not including the socket is 6-1/4" long. It is a little unique to my eyes because proportionally it is like a sash mortise chisel, fairly thick from front/top to blade back and with the same type of taper a sash mortise chisel has. The unique part is that it has a very slight bevel similar to a beveled bench chisel. So slight that it leaves fairly substantial flat sides. What is the intention of this design and what tasks would it be best suited for?

Lastly, I have read your article on making handles without a lathe. I am not quite ready to venture into turning yet and your process detail in the article makes me confident that I can accomplish this with some practice. In the article you described how to mount a brass ferrule. Some of my chisels and in some of the pictures you have provided, leather washers are used instead. In what type of use are these more advantageous and how do you incorporate these into the handle making process?

I realize this is a long post, but I was feeling "wordy" tonight.

Thanks,
Shawn

[Derek Stevens]

Not trying to bump an old thread, but just wanted to throw props to Bob. great summary on chisels, nicely illustrated. Did you make your own leathers for the slick/ framers?

[Clark Magnuson]

I am grateful for this thread. It led me to this sawmill creek forum with Google.

I found a wood chisel in a junk pile about to be thrown out.

It had no handle and had been pounded on the metal opening in the rear until it was peened over. The other end was blunt.

I cleaned off the rust.
I sharpened it.
I cut off the peened over part.
I made a handle of Iron Wood with a 6 degree taper on each side.
I made a steel hoop for the rear with a 0.8 degree internal taper on each side.

[George Sanders]

Thanks for the info Bob. Apparently, from you list, I have been collecting good brands. I don't have a complete set of anything yet, but I have enough good users to get the job done. I have noticed that at least in my area good chisels are getting pretty scarce. I just don't find them at auctions or yard sales anymore.

[Van Huskey]

Thanks for the good information, I have enjoyed the thread.

[Robert Clarcke]

Thanks for sharing Bob

http://dailydigitaldeals.info/wp-content/uploads/2012/01/11/10/buy.gif