Stanley smoother prob

[Chas Fuggetta]

G'morning Creekers. Well I decided it was time to tune my stanley smoother yesterday. I've had it for about 3 years and never tuned due to inactivity.

Anyway, I got the sole reasonably flat, within about .001" except at the heel and toe, where it goes up to about .0025" for the first .5" or so. Anyway one of the problems I've had with it is that whenever I make a cut adjustment, it's VERY inconsistent. If I get it to take off a .005" shaving and I adjust it a small amount, it can and has gone completely up off the worksurface and has dropped down to where it wants to try and take off a .02" shaving.

I took off the iron to check the frog and the dang thing was at least .020" out of flat. I did some sanding on it to try and bring it down and got it to about .005" cupped. Apparently that's not close enough because after doing that I still got an inconsistant adjustment. Is .005" not close enough or is there something else going on here?

Thanks gang!

Regards,
Chas

[Eric Brown]

Look at everything because the problem(s) could be compounding. For instance the lever cap should contact well across the blade. The chipbreaker should contact well across the blade. The frog must be bedded to the sole.
I suggest stripping it down and checking each part, fixing as you go along.
There are many posts in the forum as to how to do this.
Good luck. Eric

[James Taglienti]

Start your tuning in the most basic format possible. Align the frog so it is in line with the back of the mouth opening. Sharpen the iron square or very slightly cambered if you can. Also on many vintage irons, both sides need a little lapping, ie the side that cuts and the side that rides on the frog. Also ensure that all mating surfaces are clean.

[Tim Put]

How are you adjusting the depth of cut? Are you accounting for adjuster backlash?

[Chas Fuggetta]

Just got done tinkering with it again. The frog was not quite flat from left to right. Fixed that. Checked the mating surfaces...they looked good. Sighting down the iron with the chipper on it...bowed like a recurve. The screw holding the chip breaker to the iron was tight and caused the iron to bow quite a bit. I took it apart and could see a slight bow in the iron due to the chip breaker screw. I straightened out the iron and put it back together with considerably less presser. There was still a slight bow due to the chip breaker, but it was minimal. I put the whole thing back together and tried it out. Got down to .001" shavings. Made some adjustments and there were NO surprises.

I think it was a combination of the chip breaker bowing the iron and the front portion of the frog not being flat left to right. Seems to be ok now.

Should I grind down the front portion of the chip breaker so I can tighten it more without bowing the iron?

[Jim Koepke]

Chas,

It would be helpful to know more about the plane that is giving you a problem. Maker, model and date are a good start. If you have a way to post pictures, that can also be helpful.

It is a lot to read, but if you have a bit of time, check these posts by Bob Smalser and me from the Neander wisdom/FAQ thread:

http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?t=5867

http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?t=114373

Then there are a few things to consider about adjusting the blade. There are a few different ways to do this. Non of them are more right then the other, it is what works best for you that is the best way.

Lie Nielsen has a video to help:

http://www.youtube.com/user/LieNielsen#p/u/2/O4Lp5FzwxbU

My method is different. To adjust my planes for cut, a piece of scrap is held in one of the bench vises. The blade is usually in the retracted position, then while sliding the plane along the wood, the adjuster is turned to lower the blade. As soon as any shaving appears, the adjusting is stopped and the blade is checked from side to side to set the lateral adjustment. When the blade is cutting even from side to side, then the depth can be set for the task at hand.

There may be a few things that are preventing you from getting to this point and most of them are covered in the second link above.

A quick check would be to make sure the screw on the cap iron is tight. If the cap iron can slip, you will never get a correct adjustment. My suggestion is to set the cap iron and blade assembly on its side on a hard surface to tighten the screw. This will give better leverage and help to avoid slips that could cause an injury.

Also, your adjustment will be usually stay set if the adjustment is set "pushing" the blade as opposed to retracting the blade.

If you have more questions, please ask.

jim

[Jim Koepke]

Just got done tinkering with it again. The frog was not quite flat from left to right. Fixed that. Checked the mating surfaces...they looked good. Sighting down the iron with the chipper on it...bowed like a recurve. The screw holding the chip breaker to the iron was tight and caused the iron to bow quite a bit. I took it apart and could see a slight bow in the iron due to the chip breaker screw. I straightened out the iron and put it back together with considerably less presser. There was still a slight bow due to the chip breaker, but it was minimal. I put the whole thing back together and tried it out. Got down to .001" shavings. Made some adjustments and there were NO surprises.

I think it was a combination of the chip breaker bowing the iron and the front portion of the frog not being flat left to right. Seems to be ok now.

Should I grind down the front portion of the chip breaker so I can tighten it more without bowing the iron?

Isn't this the way of life. You found part of the problem while I was typing my original response.

Instead of grinding the front of the chip breaker, it may be better to bend it a little. This is easy but tricky.

I suspect a lot of cap irons (chip breakers) were made to increase their pressure on blades because of the old, "if a little is good ten times as much will be better," philosophy so prevalent in modern thought.

The part behind the cup of the cap iron should be flat. If not, tend to this first. I have set cap irons flat on a piece of hardwood and then with a piece of wood at least as wide as the cap iron held just behind the bow give a blow to the piece of scrap to help remove the cap iron's application of pressure. I have also mounted the body in a vice and tapped the top (area of the bow that mates to the blade) to straighten them out.

What ever works will do. Just be aware that more adjustment to the mating area may be needed.

jim

[bridger berdel]

Just got done tinkering with it again. The frog was not quite flat from left to right. Fixed that. Checked the mating surfaces...they looked good. Sighting down the iron with the chipper on it...bowed like a recurve. The screw holding the chip breaker to the iron was tight and caused the iron to bow quite a bit. I took it apart and could see a slight bow in the iron due to the chip breaker screw. I straightened out the iron and put it back together with considerably less presser. There was still a slight bow due to the chip breaker, but it was minimal. I put the whole thing back together and tried it out. Got down to .001" shavings. Made some adjustments and there were NO surprises.

I think it was a combination of the chip breaker bowing the iron and the front portion of the frog not being flat left to right. Seems to be ok now.

Should I grind down the front portion of the chip breaker so I can tighten it more without bowing the iron?

is this the factory iron and chipbreaker? it doesn't seem like the iron is supposed to be thin enough to be bent by the chipbreaker. maybe consider upgrading to a modern thick blade like hock or so.

[Jim Koepke]

is this the factory iron and chipbreaker? it doesn't seem like the iron is supposed to be thin enough to be bent by the chipbreaker. maybe consider upgrading to a modern thick blade like hock or so.

Most Stanley bench plane blades can be bent very easily. Most that I have seen are laminated with a thin piece of hard steel in the cutting area and the rest is a softer steel.

jim

[James Taglienti]

I would try not to take too much material off of the chipbreaker. There is a delicate balance between chipbreaker location and depth adjustment... more delicate than I had anticipated when I started grinding one a while back, I ended up needing a new chipbreaker.