TK806-atb or TK806-tcg ?

[john bateman]

I plan to buy one of these Avanti closeout blades at Rockler.
There is a specific cut I want to try to improve upon. It involves straight and bevel crosscuts on mdf which I have previously veneered...which includes a rounded over edge. The photo doesn't show much detail, but gives an idea of what I'm doing. This time I'm using zebrawood veneer, but I also use many other types.
http://members.verizon.net/%7Epecker/zebra.jpg

I'm currently using a TK406, which is 60 tooth ATB. I'm getting small amounts of chipping and tearing of the veneer, particulaly during bevel cuts. The worst case is when the roundover is on the trailing edge of the cut.

I have my saw tweaked to near perfection, so I think it comes down to getting the correct blade. But I have no idea whether the ATB version or the TCG version would be the better choice.
http://images.rockler.com/rockler/images/34146-01-500.jpg
http://images.rockler.com/rockler/images/39866-01-500.jpg

If anyone can educate me on this matter I would be most appreciative.
And please don't tell me to get a Forrest. I have plenty of other expensive blades already...I just want something for this specific application.

[Van Huskey]

The triple chip grind Laminate/Malamine blade is the one for this task.

[john bateman]

Thank you. I wish a few others would chime in. There used to be a Freud guy who posted here regularly.

[scott spencer]

I always thought that the Hi-ATB grind offers the cleanest slicing and lowest tearout of any grind, while the TCG offers the most durable tips. I'm not sure how steep the bevel on the TK806 is, but 40° would be best in this situation IMO.

[Greg Portland]

I use a TCG blade on laminate quite a bit and feel that it is your best option. You can go to Freud's website and ask them a question if you want further confirmation. A better setup would be a saw with a scoring blade prior to the main blade (i.e. many Euro saws).

[Brian Gumpper]

The 80T blade may help in general. I would think the ATB would give the better cut of the two while the TCG will last longer as Scott mentioned.

I don't know how to explain it but the way the blade addresses the rounded over section may have something to do with the chipout. You could try putting a piece of blue or green tape over the veneer where the saw blade cuts and see if it helps.

I personally would try the ATB first if quality of cut is what you're after. A steep bevel like the Hi-ATB would be best but would dull the fastest. That's not one of your options though.

I think when you see these blades recommended for melamine and laminate, chipboard it's for longevity not best possible cut.

[Mike Hoyt]

I can only speak from my experience with the 80t hi-atb grind but it has been flawless for me. Absolutely no tearout at all with this blade even when it exits the plywood. I can say though that before I placed this blade in service I tuned up my saw due to that same type of blowout you had described. I found that my blade was toed out and that I would get a burn on the tail end of all my crosscuts. Fixed that and tossed the new blade in, what a differenced no burn or tearout.

Mike

[john bateman]

The 80T blade may help in general. I would think the ATB would give the better cut of the two while the TCG will last longer as Scott mentioned.

I don't know how to explain it but the way the blade addresses the rounded over section may have something to do with the chipout. You could try putting a piece of blue or green tape over the veneer where the saw blade cuts and see if it helps.

I personally would try the ATB first if quality of cut is what you're after. A steep bevel like the Hi-ATB would be best but would dull the fastest. That's not one of your options though.

I think when you see these blades recommended for melamine and laminate, chipboard it's for longevity not best possible cut.

You bring up an interesting point. I had always assumed that blades recommended for "melamine and laminates" were because the blade was less likely to chip the fragile coatings on the particle board substrate.

But maybe they're just "recommended" because they don't dull so quickly on these manmade products.

[Larry Frank]

+1 on the hi-ATB. I bought one a couple of months ago and could kick myself for not getting it sooner. With hardwood veneer plywood and a zero clearance insert there is no splintering at all.

[Lee Bidwell]

I also agree that the Hi-ATB will give you less tear-out, as long as you keep it sharp. I have a CMT 80T thin kerf Hi-ATB (made in Italy, it may even be the same blade as the Freud), and it leaves a very nice edge.

Another thought regarding tear out on the rounded over portion of your stock: you might be able to attach a cove-shaped piece that matches the round over to the back fence of your crosscut sled (assuming you are using a sled). This will effectively give you a "zero clearance insert" all the way through your cut.

[glenn bradley]

This is an interesting discussion. I too thought the main purpose of TCG was to extend life when cutting laminates. I run the Freud HIATB blade you are showing and have for about 5 years. I keep a pair so one is available while if the other is out for sharpening. I would check Freud and other sites for the science-guy answers.

[Lee Bidwell]

This reference (http://www.dekalbsaw.com/glossary.html)gives some nice info, and also agrees that Hi-ATB will give you less tearout in your application:

"For slicing across fibers, triple chip teeth cut somewhat rougher than alternate bevel tips."

Lee

[john bateman]

Well, I ended up getting this one:
http://images.rockler.com/rockler/images/34146-01-500.jpg

and made a few test cuts on my zebrawood veneered sample.
I wish my camera could take decent closeups to show, because the difference in cuts was substantial. The only place that showed any chipping at all was on the curved edge when it was at the trailing position. And then, only on the bevel cut.

I think a piece of blue tape there would eliminate even that. Or maybe a cove shaped backer, like someone suggested.
For $30 I'm quite pleased.

Thanks for the advice from all.