Saw re-shaping

[Russell Smallwood]

All,

I have several old hand saws, one of which is a miter box back saw that needs to have its teeth completely re-shaped.

I've spent a good bit of time at the sharpening bench and am pretty comfortable re-sharpening a decent set of saw teeth but have never had much success re-shaping from scratch. My efforts with this particular saw thus far have resulted in a mess and I think the teeth need to be filed flat and re-cut.

I have spent a good deal of time on Pete Taran's site and have (in the past) even ordered files from him but I didn't find a lot of info on re-cutting /shaping saw teeth that are a complete do-over.

Anybody have any suggestions? I'd be more than willing to send it out to someone who knows what they're doing, but I haven't been able to locate anyone in the little time I've spent looking.

I'd also be willing to give it a go myself with some proper instruction if anyone has a resource to share.

Thanks.

[Robert Rozaieski]

Don't joint the teeth completely off. Joint them down about half way so you can save the original spacing. Then file as normal, just until the flats on the tops of each tooth disappear. If the saw still needs a little more work, joint it again, and make another pass. It's much easier to do it gradually and preserve the original tooth spacing than it is to cut all new teeth into a blank plate.

[Russell Smallwood]

Thanks Bob,

At this point, the teeth have gotten really, really small (narrow), so much so that I think I'm not the first person who has chewed them up. I may have been trying to re-condition someone else's bad set.

I've tried doing what you suggest, only to be greatly discouraged with the result. Perhaps I need more practice...

[george wilson]

I have filed teeth from scratch many times over the years. I found a little "Burro" saw tooth punching machine early on when I became toolmaker ( previously instrument maker). This was fortunate since we made saws for the whole Historic Area of Williamsburg in due course.

If you can find someone local who can re punch teeth it could be very beneficial. A decent saw sharpening shop should have one.

[Russell Smallwood]

Thanks George,

I think you are confirming what I was thinking; Re-shaping from scratch is probably something best done by someone with a machine. Funny, I thought that I read that on Pete's site somewhere but can't find it now (thought I didn't search very hard).

I'll search the forum for some saw sharpening services. Just in case, anybody come to mind?

[lowell holmes]

Paul Sellers said to use a sawzall blade of the proper tooth count taped to the side of your saw for a filing template to space the teeth evenly.

[Russell Smallwood]

Paul Sellers said to use a sawzall blade of the proper tooth count taped to the side of your saw for a filing template to space the teeth evenly.

Hey now... that is a very, very interesting idea indeed. I might have to give that a go before punting and sending it off.

Thanks!

[Robert Rozaieski]

Don't give up yet. If you need to file in all new teeth into a blank plate, it can be done with just a flie. I've done it numerous times, it just takes some patience, a brand new file and a template for the number of TPI you want. Check out this link for a good explanation on how to do it and some templates you can download for the number of TPI.

http://norsewoodsmith.com/node/76

Don't try to file all the way to the bottom of the gullet all at once. Use the template to mark the position of each gullet. File a couple of strokes at each line to start the gullets. Remove the template and make another pass, filing a couple more strokes at each gullet to deepen them. Then make another pass. Keep doing this until all the teeth are shaped. Then go back, rejoint and sharpen as usual. It's really not that bad, just takes a little patience. And use a new file. You'll chew on one or two entire new corners at least just cutting in the new teeth. Then you use the third new corner to do the final sharpening.

[Jonathan McCullough]

+1 on Bob's comments. That's been my experience. You can also use threaded rod for precise spacing if you eventually find you need to.

[Jim Koepke]

Russell,

Welcome to the Neander Cave.

+2 on Robert's recommendation of http://www.norsewoodsmith.com/

Sadly, on the first page of his site there is an announcement of another saw sharpener leaving us to sharpen saws for those who have left this earth before us.

I have cut teeth from scratch. They did not come out anywhere near looking good, but the saw sure cuts nice. If it came to having a perfect looking saw or a perfect cutting saw, the results are what most of us are seeking. So my saw gets a lot of use in hopes that it will get dull and give me an opportunity to do a little corrective work on the previous tooth cutting. Right now, it looks like it needs a visit to a saw dentist.

My failure may have been caused by trying to cut too much on the first pass. I should have just established the position of each tooth's gullet.

I also have another saw plate that needs a handle and teeth waiting in the wings. It is a late 19th century Disston back saw. So many other things to do before it gets to the top of the list.

On the Norsewoodsmith site, there is a list of topics on the left side of the screen. There is one topic there called the Back Saw Project. Also on the home page there is an article on gullet angles.

I learned from VintageSaws.com, my skills were further honed at Norsewoodsmith.com.

Good luck with this project and keep us informed.

jim

[Russell Smallwood]

Russell,

Welcome to the Neander Cave.



Thanks Jim! Been lurking for a while. I see a lot of familiar faces (signatures) around here from the rec. I was one of the neanders over there for a long time but put down the hobby for a few years. Have been picking it back up, and picking through my assortment of Independence Saws, Knight planes, e-bay Stanleys/Distons and trying to make some sense of it all.

I guess the nice thing about putting down a hobby for so long is that when you pick it back up, you've forgotten what a head start you had.

Thanks to all for the saw filing suggestions, I am off to do some research, then hopefully to spend some shop time practicing.

:)

[Jim Koepke]

I am off to do some research, then hopefully to spend some shop time practicing.

A great way to practice is to buy cheap saws at yard sales and such. then not only do you get practice, you can experiment with different rake angles and tooth per inch variations.

jim