I need to upgrade my TS fence system...

[Michael Dunn]

Hey guys,

I am in need of upgrading my fence system. I plan on building a table saw - router table - storage unit found in the "Table Saw Secrets" by the guys at Shop Notes.

I have the Delta Shopmaster TS300 (I know, a budget saw...) I would really like a Biesemeyer, but I think a $500 fence system on this saw would be overkill ($$$-wise, not functionally).

So I would like some suggestions on a goot T-Square fence and rail system that I could retrofit onto my budget saw and eventually retrofit into a future upgrade of a TS.

Is the Shop Fox system any good? I think I saw it for about $200, that price I can justify.

Any advice is greatly appreciated.

Thanx,

shotgunn

[Brian Muecke]

Delta T-2 is the answer. its a great fence that will not break the bank.

http://www.amazon.com/Delta-36-T30-30-Inch-Fence-System/dp/B000H0R1S2/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=hi&qid=1269304415&sr=1-1

[Michael Dunn]

Sweet, this is it!!!

Thanx man!!!


Delta T-2 is the answer. its a great fence that will not break the bank.

[scott spencer]

Michael - At 22" deep, the TS300 isn't quite full size (standard is more like 27"d), so make sure whatever fence system you get is compatible with that saw. Most of the front locking fences should be. I'd think something like the Delta T2 at $150 is a good value on a good fence, and would be a reasonably expenditure for that saw.

[Kyle Iwamoto]

If you're doing a TS/router table in 1 unit, I would highly reccomend the INCRA system. It is very precise, and repeatable. You can pick up the basic system and slowly expand as funds and your skills allow. The major drawback to the full on INCRA fence, is it requires a LOT of space to the right of the saw. Don't know if it will fit your saw, since I know nothing about it. Check it out. Web search costs nothing.:) They have tons of video clips. The basic fence runs 370 at Amazon. Not too bad an investment. Despite it's looks, and being made of aluminum, it is a very stout fence. The router fence system is truly an amazing system. You can make dovetails inside of dovetails, (purely decorative) since you can repeat any cut.

[Jim Rimmer]

Michael - At 22" deep, the TS300 isn't quite full size (standard is more like 27"d), so make sure whatever fence system you get is compatible with that saw. Most of the front locking fences should be. I'd think something like the Delta T2 at $150 is a good value on a good fence, and would be a reasonably expenditure for that saw.
I put a T2 on a Craftsman that was only 20" deep. I left off the back fence and cut a square of lexan and used superglue to attach it to the bottom of the fence. It seems to work OK; haven't used it a lot (a sad story on another thread - the saw burned up and has since been converted to a router table). I think you will really like the T2.

[Michael Dunn]

My plans involve increasing the table depth to 37". With this outfeed expansion I think this fence will be absolutely perfect. I have only read two negative reviews about it so far.

The fence handle sdrops down requiring you to hold it up when changing the fence location.

Two remedies are:

1. Use a small rare earth magnet to act as catch.
2. Remove the bolt and install a washer to increase tension on the handle.

I have also read that craftsman table saw require drilling new holes in the rail. I own a delta, this should not be a problem.

I think I am gonna go for it. I only wish it gave me a bit more rip capacity.

Thanx guys!!!

shotgunn



Michael - At 22" deep, the TS300 isn't quite full size (standard is more like 27"d), so make sure whatever fence system you get is compatible with that saw. Most of the front locking fences should be. I'd think something like the Delta T2 at $150 is a good value on a good fence, and would be a reasonably expenditure for that saw.

[Michael Dunn]

I guess it is in our nature as woodworkers (and as men) to always NEED somethings better...

What reasonable $$$ options (if any) might there be for me to upgrade my saws motor? RIght now I think it is perhaps 3/4HP, maybe 1HP, direct drive.

If I were to come across a sweet deal on a more powerful motor how feasable would it to retrofit it into my saw and also switch to a belt drive assembly?

Thanx,

shotgunn

[Tony Bilello]

There is a lot more that goes into a good table saw than just horsepower or a fence. I think if you really feel like you need to upgrade your motor or fence, you might really want to reconsider and upgrade to a better saw that is engineered for a bigger motor and fence system.

[Bob Wingard]

I know this isn't exactly the swap & sell forum, but, since you asked .. .. I have a Biesemeyer 36-B30 .. T-Square Fence/Extension Table/Leg Set that I'd sell for $250. It is new-in-the-box. Never been opened. I'm in S.E. Tennessee .. don't know where you are or what shipping might be. Lemme' know if you're interested.

[scott spencer]

...I think I am gonna go for it. I only wish it gave me a bit more rip capacity.

Thanx guys!!!

shotgunn

You might be able to slide the front rail tube over more to the right, hence stealing some rip capacity from the left side of the blade and shifting it to the right side for additional rip capacity there. This may require you to add an extension table on the right side, and it'll definitely require you to relocate or replace the tape measure on teh rail.

With that said, I'm wondering along the same lines as Tony. All the plans you have will improve your saw, but it's not going to improve it's basic bones. You can add to $200-$300 worth of improvements, but it'll still going to be a smallish direct drive saw with a universal motor that's hard to adjust, and isn't worth fixing if the motor quits....a motor upgrade isn't feabible, as it's a proprietary design for the TS300. I can't help but wonder if selling your current saw for $150-$200, and adding the planned "improvement funds" to a new saw that's full size with a belt drive induction motor wouldn't put you farther ahead in the long run....you'd gain power, reliability, stability, accuracy, smoothness, ease of use, and resale value.

...Grizzly has the Shop Fox W1725 (http://www.grizzly.com/outlet/SHOP-FOX-1-1-2-HP-10-Left-Tilt-Contractor-Table-Saw/T21853)(Grizzly item T21853) full size 1-1/2hp belt drive contractor saw with the Shop Fox Aluma Classic fence (it's at least on par with the T2 IMO) and a heavy duty miter gauge for $425/$519 shipped.

Food for thought...

[Michael Dunn]

I do appreciate the advice. I agree, however, something in me tends to be an all or nothing type guy. If I were to sell my current TS and buy the Shop Fox... I would end up just getting something even better like the G0661. Before I saw this post, I actually pulled the trigger online for the Dela T2. $155 shipped.

Honestly, right now, I don't even do much that is beyond the power capacity of even my weak motor. I recently upgraded from the P.O.S. stock delta miter guage to the Incra V120 ($60 @ rockler) I have been seeking to improve my accuracy and speed of adjustments. I think that for what I have and what I am doing (at the moment I am currently building shop jigs, storage and furniture.) I have what I need. The V120 has massivley improved my cross cutting accuracy. I plan to build the usual aux attachments for the miter guage as well. This T2 fence should offer the same improvement for my ripping as well.

I was just being a bit foolish and perhaps greedy asking about the motor upgrade. I figured if it is even remotely possible and cheap ($$) I'd try it.

I actually fairly content right now. I took some measurements and determined that my shop would be REALLY cramped if I had a 50" rip capacity. I do plan on adding table space to the left and right of the blade. The table top length will be 60" when I am through, any larger than that and I would essentially cut my shop in half and would have to move stuff around more than I'd like just to get to the other side.

I'll post some pics when I am finished with this project.

Thanx,

shotgunn


You might be able to slide the front rail tube over more to the right, hence stealing some rip capacity from the left side of the blade and shifting it to the right side for additional rip capacity there. This may require you to add an extension table on the right side, and it'll definitely require you to relocate or replace the tape measure on teh rail.

With that said, I'm wondering along the same lines as Tony. All the plans you have will improve your saw, but it's not going to improve it's basic bones. You can add to $200-$300 worth of improvements, but it'll still going to be a smallish direct drive saw with a universal motor that's hard to adjust, and isn't worth fixing if the motor quits....a motor upgrade isn't feabible, as it's a proprietary design for the TS300. I can't help but wonder if selling your current saw for $150-$200, and adding the planned "improvement funds" to a new saw that's full size with a belt drive induction motor wouldn't put you farther ahead in the long run....you'd gain power, reliability, stability, accuracy, smoothness, ease of use, and resale value.

...Grizzly has the Shop Fox W1725 (http://www.grizzly.com/outlet/SHOP-FOX-1-1-2-HP-10-Left-Tilt-Contractor-Table-Saw/T21853)(Grizzly item T21853) full size 1-1/2hp belt drive contractor saw with the Shop Fox Aluma Classic fence (it's at least on par with the T2 IMO) and a heavy duty miter gauge for $425/$519 shipped.

Food for thought...

[scott spencer]

I'd hold onto that original fence in case you ever do upgrade the saw, then you can keep the T2. Good luck with it.

[Michael Dunn]

Definitely, I hardly ever throw anything away. One day I will move on from this saw. If I get a REAL good saw I may sell my current saw w/ the T2 installed, perhaps I'll get a bit more for it.

Thanx,

shotgunn


I'd hold onto that original fence in case you ever do upgrade the saw, then you can keep the T2. Good luck with it.

[George Sanders]

Four years ago I bought a Mulecab accusquare fence for my 20" deep craftsman contractor saw, made in the fifties. I actually paid more for the fence than I did for the saw. I knew that the saw was worth the upgrade because it is built like a tank with all that cast iron. I found a 27" deep saw for $40 and called Mulecab to ask if I could buy just the fence extrusion to upgrade the saw. They said yes and I now have a very accurate fence on a deeper saw without breaking the bank.

[Jim Rimmer]

In response to some of your later posts:

1. I have put a rare earth magnet on my T2 because the handle drops and I run into it. Seems to work OK.

2. I was upgrading a direct drive C-man TS when I bought my T2. I had also purchased an Incra miter. Then the motor burned up. No replacement from Sears available and repair was mucho $$$. Lesson learned from that one: check all the warning signs (even though they may be hidden) on your saw. Seems I had a position sensitive swithch with the warning label on the bottom.

3. When mine burned up I bought a G0661 and couldn't be happier.

[Michael Dunn]

Jim,

Thanx for the tips. I am unclear on what you mean by the 'position sensitive switch'. What was it that caused your motor to burn up?

Thanx,

shotgunn


In response to some of your later posts:

1. I have put a rare earth magnet on my T2 because the handle drops and I run into it. Seems to work OK.

2. I was upgrading a direct drive C-man TS when I bought my T2. I had also purchased an Incra miter. Then the motor burned up. No replacement from Sears available and repair was mucho $$$. Lesson learned from that one: check all the warning signs (even though they may be hidden) on your saw. Seems I had a position sensitive swithch with the warning label on the bottom.

3. When mine burned up I bought a G0661 and couldn't be happier.

[Jim Rimmer]

Jim,

Thanx for the tips. I am unclear on what you mean by the 'position sensitive switch'. What was it that caused your motor to burn up?

Thanx,

shotgunn
Exactly. It's been a while but in a nutshell, there was no starter capacitor but a gravity/spring relay that provided surge current to start the motor.(Full technical explanation is more complex, but chaninging the position killed my saw) When I moved it from vertical to horizontal to accomodate the new fence, the surge current never turned off and burned up the winidings. The warning label which I found later was on the bottom of the switch.

[Jim Rimmer]

It took a while but here is the link to the post about my motor burning up. More detail and a lot of good input from knowledgeable Creekers. There are other threads about my refurb if you care to search.
Wrong diagnosis and dumb move by me (http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?t=117672)

[Michael Dunn]

I am nearing completion of my new table saw/ routing center. I am wondering how big of a pain it would be for me to shift my new Delta T2 fence over to the right to give me a greater rip capacity.

Should I peel off the adhesive tape measure and apply my own? As far as I can remember I do not think that I have ever put my fence to the left of the blade.

What are some uses of putting the fence on the left side? I would like to consider doing this, but I need to know what I may be missing.

As always, any tips are more than appreciated.

Thanx,

shotgunn