Finally did it-cut out a printed graphic!

[Larry Bratton]

Maybe some of you are already doing this but I had tried numerous times to cut out a graphic I had printed on paper. I could never get a good result. I finally figured out that my home start position must be off. This can be adjusted through the Epilog EXT's calibration menu. I determined this (with some help from Epilog tech support) by setting a vector cut 1"over and 1" down in Corel. When I did it, it was off a good bit (almost an 1/8"). Tech helped me recalibrate it.

I then got a great result by using Center to Center engraving. I started with my graphic in Corel Draw. I print from Photoshop to my wide format printer, so I exported to PS. Printed the graphic. Then, took the printed image, measured it carefully and located the center of it. Set the laser home position to the mark I made for center.

Then in Corel, I made certain my graphic was exactly the same size as the printed version. Then I created a boundary. If you have inside cutouts, you will have to put a boundary around them also. (In some cases you might have to use the bezier tool). You want to reduce your page size down to slightly bigger than the graphic (center to center doesn't like page sizes a lot bigger than the graphic). Set up the driver to use Center to Center engraving, vector of course. Be sure your page size is set to the same as in Corel. Then print it. I suggest running the red line pointer with the lid open first to check everything.

There are many uses for this. You can make great looking decals and transfers. We made a great looking transfer on to a big piece of denim (dark fabric) using the laser to cut out the transfer paper. I have a request from a customer to cut out logos on Phototex. I'll post some pictures tomorrow when I get back to the shop and get them done.

Edit: This works with my Epilog driver, I assume the other mfgs drivers have a center to center feature or similar.

[Emily Wilson]

I am glad to find this information, this is something I had wondered about how
to do, Thank you for your post!

Emily Wilson
Sculpture

[Larry Bratton]

Emily:
I was beginning to wonder if anyone had any interest in this topic. I have read several times of the interest in being able to use the laser for this purpose, but not having a lot of success with it. It is going to be especially useful to me for cutting logos out of Phototex. In case your not familiar with that product, it is a fabric that has a patented adhesive that allows for it to be easily removed and replaced. Here is a link
http://www.phototexgroup.com/ Glad it was of interest to you.

[Steve Clarkson]

Larry,

It was of interest to me. But I assumed that it was one of those things that could be done better with a different tool (ie. a plotter or vinyl cutter).

[Rodne Gold]

The only issue with doing this is registration and one can either make a jig for this or do it this easy way.

Make a base that is bigger than the paper , use 2 dowels or whatever you want that will hold a piece of petg or some other thin clear laser friendly plastic in place.
Run the cut at high speed , low power on the plastic to mark it. Place the paper/graphic under it , position the paper/graphic so the marked image on the plastic lines up with the cut lines (easier to do if you make some finger holes in the petg)
Carefully remove the petg so as not to disturb the positioning of the item under and send the same cut file at correct settings to cut.
Doing it this way means you dont have to bother about positioning your print or applied print on the page or substrate - there are no skewness issues etc as you are lining up the item with the correct cut and it's easy to do visually.

[John Noell]

Maybe I am missing something, but I simply add registration marks at the corners of my graphic when I print it (with the upper left mark at "home"/upper left), then place in laser and run a light vector for just the reg marks (in a separate layer). If it does not cut at the exact right distance down and over I can easily adjust the cut file to match. Once the four corners match, I am ready to cut out the graphic. We do this for stand-up photos mounted on light board and photo puzzles.

[Rodne Gold]

There are many ways to set up registration for printer to laser kisscut/cut applications.
4 pt registration works well , we used to cut sheets of vinyl decals printed on A4/3 pages but just used 2 reg marks , upper left and lower right.
Its easier to move the target piece with a given cut than to compensate in a cdr file tho, hence the clear overlay thing.

[Martin Boekers]

I usually only cut individual items a quick and easy way, whether it be larger are smaller is to take a square piece of scrap line it up firmly to the top corner of the laser bed, cut the vector shape and size I need, then visibly position the print to the backside and tape in place. Then I reposition the piece back to the same corner and cut.

Maybe not the most efficient way, but for one ups I get them in and out quickly.

remember to adjust focus for the second cut.


Marty

[Richard Rumancik]

Rodne mentions that it is easier to move the material to match where the cut will be, rather than tweak the Corel file. I would tend to agree; it is pretty hard to accurately measure how much the image is "off" and after a few iterations you may have damaged the registration marks on the graphic. If the alignment is not very critical it will work okay. As far as trying to register off the rulers - don't even think about it.

When I do this, I apply registration marks to the printed item; usually I use crosshairs (like a "+" sign). You need a minimum of 2, but 4 allows a double-check/optimization as there may be a bit of distortion and shinkage.

Then I would use one of two methods to prepare the printed graphic: (a) Punch a hole in the centers of the "+" using a .25" paper punch - it doesn't need to be exactly centered or (b) trim the edges of the graphic with a shear/scissors at 45 degrees so that it cuts through part of the "+" sign - making it "bleed" to the edges.

Then on your fixture board, draw the same 2 (or 4) targets. (The fixture board needs to be securely fastened to the laser table - screwed or clamped.) Place the prepared graphic so that the registration lines on the graphic match with the lines on the fixture board, and tape it down. Then when you plot the vector shape you will be right on. You can get surprisingly good accuracy with this method.

If you are cutting right through the graphic, you may need to relieve the fixture board so you are "air" cutting. This can be done when you create the targets on the fixture board.

[Larry Bratton]

Thanks guys, some good tips there. It was my intent to set up a jig for quantity. Once I have the printed output consistent, it would just be a matter of dropping it into the jig.

[Kim Vellore]

Alignment is the easy part and there are many good ideas here,the bigger problem is the scaling of the printer and the laser is not the same. I have to expand in one axis and skew in another to get it all aligned. it took me a while to get the numbers right. Once you know the scaling and skew relation for the printer and laser it is just a routine and alignment after that.

Kim

[Larry Bratton]

Larry,

It was of interest to me. But I assumed that it was one of those things that could be done better with a different tool (ie. a plotter or vinyl cutter).
Steve:
You of all people..your inquisitive mind should have told you to give this a shot. After I got it worked out, I am excited to be able to use it. Yes, a plotter that reads registration marks could do the same thing, but I don't have one of those and I want to use my laser every time I can. This Phototex stuff I am speaking of is tough to cut with a plotter too. It's a fabric like stuff on an adhesive with a release liner. I cut through the fabric and the release liner to make stick on logos, wall stickers etc.

[John Noell]

Its easier to move the target piece with a given cut than to compensate in a cdr file tho, hence the clear overlay thing. My problem was the distortion from the laser printer. Hence, I need to compensate proprotions and reg marks make that possible. Not too fiddly if you use a ruler and calculator after first test cut.

[Larry Bratton]

My problem was the distortion from the laser printer. Hence, I need to compensate proprotions and reg marks make that possible. Not too fiddly if you use a ruler and calculator after first test cut.
I don't print from a laser printer for this purpose. I print with a wide format (44") Canon Image Prograph printer. I use an Adobe Photoshop plugin that allows me to print directly from photoshop to the printer without a RIP. The plugin has allows a lot of control over placement of the image in the media, sizing etc.

I use Epilog's Center to Center driver feature when cutting this stuff out. Measure the center of the printed graphic, set home to that mark, match the size in Corel and cut it.

[John Noell]

I print with a wide format (44") Canon Image Prograph printer. Now I'm jealous.

[Rodne Gold]

Wouldnt it be better to compensate when printing and send the correct cut to the laser?
Some lasers will also allow a calibration of the x/y axis so it can cut perfect squares and 100% round circles etc - you can use this to your advantage too when cutting uncompensated printer output (if you have it)
If you are having significant skew when printing then the paper feed might be a bit dodgy.
I have used my roland wide format , a canon a3 photoprinter , epson 1290 , epson a4's etc to my laser and havent had distortion issues , never used a laser printer tho , maybe they have other issues.

[Larry Bratton]

I never have a distortion issue with the Canon printer. Haven't done this operation using laser print output. May have occasion to in the future, if so, I will be watching out for it. I'm sure their may be more ways to do this, but I am pleased to find my method works for me and by virtue of getting it to work, I got a nice project cutting out logos for a customer.
Thanks for sharing all these great ideas. You guys are the BEST!!!