Freud Diablo dado set Model # DD208 Issue

[Rob Holcomb]

For those of you that have or are thinking about buying the Freud Diablo dado set Model # DD208 that is sold at the BORG, you might want to re-think that purchase. Last fall I bought the set and used it for the 3rd time today. Previously, I used it on plywood when I was making shelves in my shop and my rolling cart for my miter saw. Today, I needed to cut a Dado in a piece of 3/4" pine and while doing so, one of the carbide teeth broke off. I never knew it happened until I was removing the set to put my normal blade back on. I found the tooth inside my cabinet saw. For a $100 Dado set from a company that is known to be a good company, I'm not real happy. I've had the set too long to return it so I guess wasted the money!

http://www.robholcomb.com/diablo.jpg

[Walter Plummer]

Don`t panic, it can be re-toothed. Any saw sharpening service should be able to replace it or send it to the factory.

[Jack Wilson]

Don`t panic, it can be re-toothed. Any saw sharpening service should be able to replace it or send it to the factory.
Yeah, this is definitely a phone call issue, CALL Freud. They should stand behind their product.

[Dave Sweeney]

I too think that Freud will step up and take real good care of you.

[Tony Bilello]

I went to a woodworking meeting about 6 or 7 months ago and the meeting was given by 2 men from Freud. One was customer relations and one was from sales. The most important thing I got from the meeting was as I suspected......If it has the FREUD DIABLO name it is specifically made for discount houses like Home Depot. The Diablo label is far superior than anything else Home Depot carries, but it is bottom of the line for Freud. I am very anti-BORG. I keep telling everyone that at Home Depot, you are throwing your money away. Their discount prices are sometimes just a few dollars different than a good product and some times HD is even higher.
If you dont believe me about the Freud Diablo label, call Rockler or Woodcraft or any reliable tool dealer and ask them if they have Freud Diablo and why not.

[Victor Robinson]

Thanks for the warning but hopefully Freud takes care of you.

For someone looking for a cheap dado set, I see/hear no reason to shy away from the Oshlun.

[Glen Butler]

I recently warrantied a freud blade, and they didn't even ask for a receipt or purchase date. It does say on the bottom of the RMA slip that proof of purchase is required, but as I recall I failed to include one. Good luck to you.

[Bill Huber]

A $100 dado set is not that expensive, just look at the cost of some of the top of the line sets, over $200.

I guess one tooth out of a few million is not that bad, I have that dado set and have had no problem it at all.

I would not worry about it and just call Freud about it, I am sure they will fix it.

I bought a Woodworker I for my old saw, it was an 8", I had it about a month and had not really used it that much and it lost a tooth so it can happen to any one..... and yes Forrest fixed it at no cost.

[Dan Friedrichs]

...the most important rule: Wear your safety glasses...

[johnny means]

For those of you that have or are thinking about buying the Freud Diablo dado set Model # DD208 that is sold at the BORG, you might want to re-think that purchase.
I've had the set too long to return it so I guess wasted the money!

http://www.robholcomb.com/diablo.jpg

I don't think that blasting Freud for this is fair. Tooling breaks from time to time. It's not like several teeth fell off, which would be indicative of some real quality issues. No one knows what that cutter was exposed to in the store while hanging on the rack.

I used the exact same set in a professional setting for years without a problem. I probably cut several miles of dadoes and would still be using it now, if it hadn't gotten lost while moving.

Maybe before warning others not to buy something, one ought to ask if others have had similar problems.

Not to mention that a hundred dollar dado set is not any where near top of the line. IMO this set is one of the better deals out there in tooling.

Also, no you didn't waste your money. One tooth will not have any noticable affect on the dado sets performance.

[Dave Lehnert]

Is this the same set Lowe's clearanced out a few months ago for around $49?

[Chris Kennedy]

I have had this dado stack for five years, and used it a whole mess of times without any trouble. No quality control is going to be 100%, so a bad tooth got through. One bad tooth is not a sign of a defective product in general.

Cheers,

Chris

[Karl Card]

i have an avenger dado set that i got for cheap locally from an ex cabinet maker and he told me up front that it had a tooth missing and that it would not hurt what I was putting a dado cut into.. For the price I got it at and being my first set I am ok with it.. I have a freud diablo 10 inch saw blade also that i got in a deal and the guy hated it but I rather like it also. Sometimes people cut a certain way where a blade might not be all that bad for the next person but just doesnt suit them...Being new I pretty much try anyhting i can get a good deal on..

[Rob Holcomb]

I don't think that blasting Freud for this is fair. Tooling breaks from time to time. It's not like several teeth fell off, which would be indicative of some real quality issues. No one knows what that cutter was exposed to in the store while hanging on the rack.

I used the exact same set in a professional setting for years without a problem. I probably cut several miles of dadoes and would still be using it now, if it hadn't gotten lost while moving.

Maybe before warning others not to buy something, one ought to ask if others have had similar problems.

Not to mention that a hundred dollar dado set is not any where near top of the line. IMO this set is one of the better deals out there in tooling.

Also, no you didn't waste your money. One tooth will not have any noticable affect on the dado sets performance.

Whoah! I didn't tell anyone not to buy the set or any other Freud product. I said to re-think the purchase and I didn't "Blast" Freud. I said I wasn't happy about spending $100 on something that broke the third time it was used. I apologise to this forum and it's users for bringing this to your attention. The thing I liked about this forum and it's members was how different I thought it was from most others. Smart, intelligent, helpful people. Now that I've been attacked for making this post, I'll just stay in the background. Again, I apologise to those I have offended.

[Rob Holcomb]

Whoah! I didn't tell anyone not to buy the set or any other Freud product. I said to re-think the purchase and I didn't "Blast" Freud. I said I wasn't happy about spending $100 on something that broke the third time it was used. I apologise to this forum and it's users for bringing this to your attention. The thing I liked about this forum and it's members was how different I thought it was from most others. Smart, intelligent, helpful people. Now that I've been attacked for making this post, I'll just stay in the background. Again, I apologise to those I have offended.

[Stephen Edwards]

I'm not offended. However, I think that to be fair to Freud, or any other company, the preferable protocol would be to first contact the manufacturer to see if they will resolve the issue to your satisfaction. Then, by all means, please share the experience with the forum.

Respectfully,

[Lee Schierer]

Whoah! I didn't tell anyone not to buy the set or any other Freud product. I said to re-think the purchase and I didn't "Blast" Freud. I said I wasn't happy about spending $100 on something that broke the third time it was used. I apologise to this forum and it's users for bringing this to your attention. The thing I liked about this forum and it's members was how different I thought it was from most others. Smart, intelligent, helpful people. Now that I've been attacked for making this post, I'll just stay in the background. Again, I apologise to those I have offended.

Before this thread gets out of hand, how about calling Freud and talking to customer service. Based on my personal experience with them they will send you a brand new blade when you return the one you have. I broke a tooth on a Freud blade while doing a 45 degree miter cut across a panel, when the cut off jammed between the throat plate opening and the blade. It took two teeth out of a brand new blade. Freud replaced the entire blade free of charge. I never used that throat plate again.


It is entirely possible that someone dropped your blade set during handing at the retail outlet and damaged the tooth.

[Myk Rian]

I'm not offended. However, I think that to be fair to Freud, or any other company, the preferable protocol would be to first contact the manufacturer to see if they will resolve the issue to your satisfaction. Then, by all means, please share the experience with the forum.

Respectfully,
I completely agree.
It's like crying wolf when there is none.

[Rob Holcomb]

This from Freud in response to my email to them.

"The tool is covered under a limited lifetime warranty against defects in material and workmanship but does not cover tools that have been abused, misused, modified, or sharpened. It also does not cover normal wear and tear. If you want to send it in send it by UPS to Freud Technical Services 218 Feld Avenue, High Point, NC 27263 we can look at it but it will be difficult to determine the cause of failure since it has been used. Be sure to include a note about your problem with the return address and a daytime phone number".

What kind of response is that? It wouldn't fail unless it was used!

[Stephen Edwards]

If you've only used it a few times, they'll be able to know. Honestly, I think that the general consensus among many users of Freud blades and router bits is that their service has as good a reputation as most of their products.

I were to send it in, and I would, I'd be sure to include the tooth that came off in a separate little baggie.

My two cents............

[Matt Meiser]

Sounds like a canned response by an admin to me--which is pretty much what you can expect from any major company via email. If you want real tech support, you need to call.

I had the warranty on a Freud Diablo blade handled at the customer service desk at Home Depot, but that's been a few years. Plus if I understand, the Diablo blades at Home Depot today don't have the Freud name.

I don't think anyone here is saying you can't be unhappy your blade failed. What people are saying is that your first step should be making a reasonable attempt at resolving the problem with them through normal channels.

[Ed Harrow]

...

I don't think anyone here is saying you can't be unhappy your blade failed. What people are saying is that your first step should be making a reasonable attempt at resolving the problem with them through normal channels.

Or, another way, it's best to try a bit of diplomacy before firing off a broadside. Just sayin'. ;)

[Thomas Allan]

Sounds like it might've just been a freudian slip :D

[Michael MacDonald]

hey rob... don't sweat it. I am new around here, and I have already seen a few conversations about how to approach product complaints... it is a touchy subject. The 'net etiquette on this sort of thing is sometimes a difficult judgement call--post first and then go to the company, or go to the company first... and by the time it is resolved not much reason to post. (I would lose motivation myself... best to post when your hot and ticked off.)

My suggestion is to follow-up with Freud, get your best solution (hopefully they just send you a new blade or a whole new dado set) and then report the results back on this thread just to close out the story. I, for one, would like to see how they approach this.

I will say to all those complaint-poster bashers out there, I have on several occasions started to post something and backed off at the last minute... figuring I didn't need advice on how to approach the company and that I would just be whining online if I even mentioned it before I dealt with it... not sure if that creates a disservice to all those who would like to hear the story and the differing opinions... but in my opinion this is a good thread because of the various opinions on Freud and their products, and bashing rob for his being pissed off doesn't make the thread all that much better. (well, maybe a little)

[Larry Edgerton]

I've lost teeth on my custom Forrest set that was over $400. It happens.

You said you were cutting plywood, and you never know what is inside a piece of plywood, especially if you bought the plywood at the Borg. Chinese plywood is full of junk. Try cutting a piece of particleboard sometime in dim light, you will see sparks flying off of the blade.

As others have said that line from Freud is their low line, but still decent. I have one of those sets for material that I do not want to run with the Forrest and it does a decent job.

My point is you can not condemn a tool on this one point, because you have no idea what made it break. I have seen bolts imbedded in Chinese plywood, and even good plywood will ocasionally have impurities. Blades do not last forever, it just sucks when they get hit right away, but that is one of the realitys of woodworking.

[glenn bradley]

Glad there was no injury. Good thing dados are captured cuts, eh? I haven't seen Charles McCracken here for awhile and hope he is doing OK. All that being said, as others have stated, I believe a phone call to Freud will resolve your issue. BORG bashing aside, I do buy my Norton 3X sandpaper at HD as they sell it and Lowe's does not. Lowe's used to be good for certain products that I now get elsewhere as Lowe's has quit Freud and started carrying the Porter Cable stuff. OK, OK, so I guess I am BORG bashing.

[Charles Robertson]

Whoah back at ya. Got the same set. I've had great luck with Freud products. Use the 7&1/4" Diablo Thin Kerfs in my Unisaw all the time. They make a great product. My set says it has a lifetime guarantee. Don,t think you will have a problem getting it repaired/replaced thru Frued. I personally appreciate any "heads-up". Whether I use it or not is up to me. The responses you see here are as it should be. It's what makes coming to this site interesting. Everyone is polite (thank you moderators), we just don't always agree. So, with that said, keep on keepin on. Don't stay in the background, you can't help me or anybody else if all you do is lurk. I appreciate all the help I can get.
I did take affront at your insinuation that maybe I am smart, intelligent, and helpful. After all, I am a woodworker.
Glad your part of the club.
Charles/Al

[Tom Walz]

Mr. Holcomb

I am on your side on this. I do a lot of braze failure analysis. A few articles are up at http://www.carbideprocessors.com/pages/Brazing.html (http://www.carbideprocessors.com/pages/Brazing.html)

A tip coming off can be dangerous. I am currently working with an engineer on a case where a user was blinded by a piece of carbide. (He was not wearing glasses.) This doesn’t happen often but it does happen. I think warning others here of a danger is entirely appropriate.

It is entirely possible to determine the cause of tip loss after a tool has been run a long time. Typically tip loss does occur relatively soon.

About W.D. Quinn
They are a well established tool service company with a national reputation for excellent work. There are a few tool companies in the US that can make a tool work better than new and they are one of them.

[Ellen Benkin]

I believe Freud has a lifetime guarantee. I had a similar problem and contacted them. They told me to ship the set to them (at my expense) and they returned what looked like a brand new set to me. Since I had my set for a couple of years. that seemed like a very reasonable offer.

[Loren Hedahl]

Obviously you have a win-win situation here.

Ship it to Freud. If they repair/replace it, all's well and you've won.

If they ship it back un-repaired, ship it to Quinn and for sure you will get it back as good as new. So, you've still won.

Concerning the Borgs -- I have both HD and Lowes within 2 miles. I patronize them because they are convenient and pay taxes to help support the local government here, just as I do. They also employ local folks to staff their stores. Since I have a heart condition, almost every morning I park in one of their parking lots and take an hour walk on the sidewalks around the small town here, then slip into the store to pickup something many mornings.

While perhaps 90 percent of their stuff is of a quality that is just fine for what I'm doing, there are times when I pass and gladly drive an hour or more to pay the extra for the quality I want. Rather than blame the Borgs, I consider it my "little vacation". I turn up the stereo in my pickup on the way, spend some extra time relishing the expensive 'eye candy' tools at the specialty store and sometimes spend a bunch of bucks indulging myself on something I don't really need, but really want.

Anyway, have a great day -- and when this gets resolved, don't forget to report back -- we're interested in how it all turned out!

[Charles Krieger]

I had a great experience with Freud.

I was using the Freud 208 dado set with shims. When I was assembling the stack a shim fell into the acme threads on the arbor of my saw and when I tightened the arbor nut the shim prevented the back part of the stack from tightening up. When I started the saw I heard a clunk and immediately knew what had happened. Several teeth on the chippers were damaged (chipped). I took the set to my local carbide sharpening/repair service and the cost was going to be about the same as a new set.

I purchased a new set (upgraded to the “Super Dado SD508”) and mentioned to the salesperson that I had ruined my previous set and explained how it happened. He said bring in the old set and he would talk to the Freud sales people about it. About two weeks later the salesperson in the store called and said he had a brand new replacement set for me.

This was my fault not Freud’s, and I did not expect any compensation for the damaged set, however both the salesperson at my local store and Freud went way beyond the call of duty to take care of a customer.

With service like that I have become a Freud fan for sure. By the way in their respective price ranges I think both sets are outstanding. I also use and like the Freud Premier Fusion saw blade. I have compared the Fusion to a friend’s Woodworker II and actually like the Fusion slightly better. Your mileage may vary, as the results are very close.

[Rob Holcomb]

My post was solely for the purpose of showing what happened and that I wasn't happy about it. I wasn't warning anyone to stay away from Freud products. I was simply saying that I bought a product, it failed after the third use and to re-think what they purchase. This set is Freuds lower end model. There's a reason its sold at the BORG and other places and costs $99.00 I'm not about to think I know why it's considered a lower end Dado set. I'll leave that up to professionals. As a result of this post, it turned out to be a "taking sides" issue. That was never meant to be the intent. I come to this website to learn, to get ideas, to become better at what I love doing. Some of you provided your opinion of what I should do about it, some of you shared your own experiences, some of you shared what I should have done first. Others attacked me for making the post in the first place. That's why I will be a lurker rather than a contributor here. If the general consensus is that I should have taken another approach, that's fine. Articulate that in a manner that isn't attacking in nature and demeaning to me and my intelligence like many did in replying to my post. I won't learn anything from someone who chooses to chew me out. I chose to join this website because the membership seemed diverse and knowledgeable. I also joined this website because it appeared people were friendly. Now I'm not so sure about some of you.

[Charles Krieger]

Rob, I hope you will not fade into the background here at Sawmill Creek. I hope my post was in no way offensive to you. I was just relating my experiences with Freud and Freud products which have been excellent. I certainly do not take your comments as offensive to me or even to Freud for that matter. I have absolutely no connections to Freud other than being a satisfied customer. Your experience is understandably different than mine.

I have also found Sawmill Creek to be a very helpful group. Please give it a second chance and I think you will find most people here meet the expectations you originally had for the site.

Good luck in your woodworking endeavors.

[Bill White]

My post was solely for the purpose of showing what happened and that I wasn't happy about it. I wasn't warning anyone to stay away from Freud products. I was simply saying that I bought a product, it failed after the third use and to re-think what they purchase. This set is Freuds lower end model. There's a reason its sold at the BORG and other places and costs $99.00 I'm not about to think I know why it's considered a lower end Dado set. I'll leave that up to professionals. As a result of this post, it turned out to be a "taking sides" issue. That was never meant to be the intent. I come to this website to learn, to get ideas, to become better at what I love doing. Some of you provided your opinion of what I should do about it, some of you shared your own experiences, some of you shared what I should have done first. Others attacked me for making the post in the first place. That's why I will be a lurker rather than a contributor here. If the general consensus is that I should have taken another approach, that's fine. Articulate that in a manner that isn't attacking in nature and demeaning to me and my intelligence like many did in replying to my post. I won't learn anything from someone who chooses to chew me out. I chose to join this website because the membership seemed diverse and knowledgeable. I also joined this website because it appeared people were friendly. Now I'm not so sure about some of you.

OHHHHHHH! Rob, I think that the posts were more to help. Toughen up the skin old boy. :D
Bill

[Dave Lehnert]

The e-mail from Freud is what one would expect from a company.

Rule one never tell a customer what you will or will not do without seeing the product in person. I use to sell lawn mowers retail. Customers would call and say they just used the mower for about 20 min and just stopped. I would agree to exchange it for a new one. They would come in and the mower looked like it was used to mow 100 acres. Packed with wet grass, the blade bent to hell hitting rocks, low on oil and air filter missing. The would argue "You said you would give me a new one" No matter how much a person pushes an issue ON THE PHONE I will never give them an answer till I see it.
Sad we had to be that way but was forced to.

I bet if you sent it in they would take care of it just as long it was not used to cut bricks.