Sanding Marks That Just wont Come Out

[Daner Steel]

I'm working on a cherry bowl, And I cant seem to get some sanding or they may be tool marks out. Its smooth to the touch, But I can still see the marks. I have sanded up to 400, Then I went back to320 and even 240:eek:...then went back up In stages to 400 again, and the marks are still there.
I have run Into this problem before,But this time I'm asking how can I get rid of the marks....there not heavy tool marks there smooth to the touch marks

TIA
Dan

[Allen Neighbors]

Daner, it's hard for us to try to help you fix something that we can't see.
They may be marks caused by the heel of the bevel. Just have to cut them away.
Don't know about the rest.
Sometimes I've gone back to 120 grit and went through the grits all the way, to get rid of sanding marks.

[Charles Wiggins]

Sounds like you need to restart with a larger grit then. Without seeing the marks I am only guessing, but maybe you need to back off to 100 or 120 and work your way back. If you can still see tool marks you might need to start over at #60.

[Daner Steel]

Thanks for the responce guys, heres a pic

[Steve Schlumpf]

If the marks are smooth and not obvious tear-out, then I agree with Allen - sounds like burnishing marks caused by rubbing the bevel a little harder than necessary. You will probably have to start over at 120 grit and work your way through the grits again!

Have fun with it! Sanding is 90% of turning! Or at least it seems that way sometimes! :D

[Steve Schlumpf]

Looks like tear-out to me. Start you sanding over at 120 grit and work through the grits.

[Daner Steel]

Thanks guys heres one more close up....Lots of sanding here today:D
OK I will start off at 100 or so, I do have some 60 grit:eek:, my poor smooth bowl

[Brian Greb]

Hey Daner,

What you have there is transitional lift, it is a type of tare out, it occurs when the grain direction changes, it's an occurrence of mother-nature throwing you a curve-ball... as the others said, start over at a courser grit and go though your sanding steps again. When I have this happen I sand at very slow RPM with 80 grit foam backed sanding paper then work finer, just remember slow speed and stop when the blemish is resolved.

BTW nice looking bowl.

[Steve Mawson]

Yep, you are getting there. Just a little tear out it looks to me. I have had the same problem from time to time. It takes time but it can be sanded out and looks like you are making progress.

[Mike Currier]

As others have said, tear out.

I usually start with 60 grit until the marks are say .25mm deep then move to 120, then to 180 and 280.

[David E Keller]

I agree with the others... definitely power sanding with a courser grit.

[Bernie Weishapl]

Tear out for sure. I would start back with the 80 grit gouges and work my way back up. Light sanding or power sanding with a light touch works best for me.

[Kyle Iwamoto]

+3 for tear out. Sharp tools, fast speed and a light cut? Or my favorite tool, the 80 grit gouge...... Since I can't seem to do any of the aforementioned things.

Easing the heel of the bevel may help?

[Richard Coers]

How wet is the bowl. When I have trouble with that kind of tear out on dry wood, I moisten it a little, let it dry, then start sanding. I am talking just barely moist. Old timers called the process "whiskering". The dampness will also help get some finer sanding scratches out latter in the process. It swells the wood around those fine scratches, then sanding with the next finer grit is easier. Just make sure the wood is dry before sanding again, or you will clog the paper.

[Wally Dickerman]

As others have said, go back to perhaps 120. This time start with oil sanding with the heavier grits. Apply some regular finishing oil. Watco or whatever you have. You'll be surprised at how effective oil sanding can be. Some turners use a soft wax such as Johnson's past wax instead of oil.

If your lathe can be operated in reverse try that. That also can be very effective on a piece that just won't "come clean"

Wally

[Steve Kubien]

Ignore the 120grit stuff. Go back to 60 or 80 grit. Remember, sandpaper is just another cutting tool, no different than a gouge or scraper.

[Fred Perreault]

Daner,
Adequate speed, sharp tools, a light finishing hand, and plenty of sanding gouge. Some wood just does not want to cooperate. It won't cut cleanly, and leaves disturbances in the suface that show up more after sanding some... or a lot. I have trouble such as yours with the large local sycamore. They grow twisted and gnarly on Cape Cod, even the 30"+ trees.

[Joe Adams]

Be sure to clean out the bowl with a tack cloth or vacuum it (or both) between sanding steps. The lower grits may leave particles that continue scratching as you move through higher grades. Also, don't skip ahead too many grades as you move through your sanding schedule.

[Daner Steel]

Its almost done now guys...Thanks a ton for all the responses
I got the scratches out (Tear out) I went back to 60 grit:DGitter done
I always sand In reverse. I have never heard of oil sanding, I will give that a try soon on something else.
I forgot to mention that This was a return, So the wood was fairly dry
I roughed It out 3 months ago, And It was going to be a hat...I got the rim paper thin, so I just cut It off.
This Is one of those jobs that takes for ever....Anyway I have a crack In the base,foot area that I hit with CA as I was going along, but you can see the CA. My plan now Is to burn a decoration on the foot, I'm just waiting for the Iron to heat up
Once again guys ,thanks for the tips

Dan

[Stuart Reid]

In addition to the good suggestions above I would recommend using a sanding sealer on that grain before sanding. It sure helped me out of a couple of hopeless looking situations.

Stu

[Mike Minto]

the bowl may be wobbling as it spins - do you have a steady you can use, in opposition to where you are placing the sandpaper, so as to smooth out the rotation of the bowl where it's being sanded? happens to me, works for me (sometimes).

[Sean Hughto]

I've had good luck addressing this kind of tear out as well as the fuzziness that you can get with some green woods with a french curve scraper. For what is may be worth.

http://www.leevalley.com/wood/page.aspx?c=2&p=32639&cat=1,310,41069&ap=1

Just to be clear, I do my scraping by hand with the lathe off and often with the piece off the lathe.

[Mark Levitski]

Ditto on sanding sealer. I sometimes use a coat of shellac on a troublesome piece, then go back and finish cut it w/ a gouge. BTW, this also helps seal the wood for CA glue to prevent stains.

In his book, Ellsworth describes a slicing cut w/ a bowl gouge that is used in the opposite direction, rim to foot, on the exterior of bowls to get rid of tear-out. Cut as deep as the tear-out with your pass. Against the rules, but works. Then go to shear scraping and sanding.

The finer grits show up what you've missed w/ the coarser. Use care and the proper light so you don't have to return and repeat.

[Curt Fuller]

I didn't notice if you mentioned what you're sanding with. But I know from experience that if you're using sand paper, just hand held with the lathe turning, it's very difficult and time consuming to remove tearout. If you can get a drill and use a series of grits on a soft sanding disc you'll have better results. Power sanding allows you to focus your sanding on the tear out areas and clean them up with the lathe stopped. Then you can finish it up with higher grits with the lathe turning.

[Brad Vaughn]

How wet is the bowl. When I have trouble with that kind of tear out on dry wood, I moisten it a little, let it dry, then start sanding. I am talking just barely moist. Old timers called the process "whiskering". The dampness will also help get some finer sanding scratches out latter in the process. It swells the wood around those fine scratches, then sanding with the next finer grit is easier. Just make sure the wood is dry before sanding again, or you will clog the paper.

I often see this as my wood is very dry. and yes mist the wood.
I often use a cabinet scraper on the spot and then sand out.
I power sand at a slow speed. I have also found that blowing out the dust when changing grits helps too.
Brad

[Frank Van Atta]

I have found that sanding to about 180 or 240, then applying a coat of Johnson's Paste Wax and letting it dry then resanding with the same grit then working up through the grits as normal usually works for this type of problem. If it's really bad you may have to oil or paste wax sand at every grit.