Better sandpaper???

[Joe Shinall]

2 Questions:

I usually buy Norton sheets for hand sanding and I buy the Gator packs from Lowe's for my orbital sander. Is there a brand of sandpaper that is better than the other in anyone's opinion? I don't have a problem with either the Gator or the Norton. Just wondering.

Also wondering if there is a rule of thumb as to how much in grit should you jump up each time. I usually use a 80 for rough projects then to a 120 then 180, 220, 320, and 400 or 600 if necessary. Is that overkill using so many sanding grits?

[glenn bradley]

There are many upper end abrasives; Klingspor, Mirka and others. I have tried a few but seem to come back to Norton 3X for discs and sheets sold at Home Depot. It's convenient enough and is a great way to spend those gift cards from people who don't realize that Home Depot isn't a woodworking store but, wanted to give you something nice. That way when they ask, I can truely say "Thank You" for the gift card ;-)

P.s. No, that is not overkill to use that many grits. If you need to go to 600, you want to work your way up through the grits. That way you don't get those surprise swirls that show up once the finish hits. As to whether you need to go to 600, that depends on the project. Most face surfaces I go to 150 180 or 220 depending on the material and what I plan to top it with. For end grain burnishing or other special requirements, 400 is good for me with 600 used on ebony accents and the like. HTH.

[mark kosse]

I have to admit I do like the Norton 3X better than most papers so there must be a little difference. As far as overkill, maybe not, but I rarely use anything other than 100, 220 and sometimes 400 for final coats of really fine stuff. As usuall, my.02. Mark

[Scott Francis]

I haven't had much success with any ROS discs other than norton 3x use them all the time. The yellow norton discs aren't awful but wears out much quicker. I don't like the gator grit ROS discs at all, bought a few at Lowes and took back all but the pack i opened. Haven't had any experience with the upper level abrasives.

I would say to try a few and compare, did this myself and thats when i decided to return the gator grits.

I don't have any problems with the gator grit sandpaper sheets, they seem to work fine, just don't like the discs.

[Kyle Iwamoto]

I am a firm believer in good paper. Norton is okay. I use it in my ROS.

I would stay away from the cheapo *mart and off brands, because, IMO the quality control sucks. I had some 80 grit ROS pads and unknown to me, it must have had a 30 grit rock in it. Made these swirls that I didn't see until that first coat of finish.:mad:

IMO, the good paper lasts a lot longer, and cuts way better. Most important, the grit is very consistent. There are pros that say use sandpaper like you didn't pay for it. I guess you could go that way too. I user Rhyno dry, and love it. Any good paper IMO is worth the investment.

My answer to your other question is that you cannot sand with too many grits. You can however, skip a grit and spend twice as long with the next grit.:)

[Mike Konobeck]

I really like the Norton and 3M. 3M is good but a little more expensive depending on where you get it. I live in MN so everything is 3M (headquarters is here). My wife worked there for a little while and I have to say that the company store was a GREAT place to pick up sandpaper cheap. Wish I still had that in.

Most of what I have read on finishing says that going past 220 is kind of a waste. I HATE sanding so I like to believe that but typically will go up to 400 on finer projects. For furniture I don't go past 320. If the surface is too smooth then some finishes don't adhere like they should. So they say. I am not an expert but have just been studying finishes A LOT because I have a slap of waterfall bubinga that I don't want to screw up.

[Richard Dragin]

I am amazed that 5 people in a row approve of the Norton paper. I get the feeling none of you guys have ever tried Klingspor or Industrial Abrasives paper. For me it was night and day, the Norton left swirl marks that cost a lot of time. I use Industrial Abrasives and 100 cuts like Norton 60. I can skip to 220 and not have swirls marks. I know it isn't recommended but it works.

[Keith Westfall]

I use Industrial Abrasives and 100 cuts like Norton 60.

For us northern'ers (Canada) anyone know where it might be available at up here?

Norton available at the HD...

[Darrell Bade]

I have had the best luck with paper from Klingspor. I do buy the "C" weight paper which is more expensive but seems to last much longer. I tried some of Gator form Lowe's, was not impressed at all with it.

[Tony Shea]

I too am surprised by the people who are happy with Norton paper. I have had terible luck with it compared to others such as Klingspor. Norton just doesn't last for me and seems to be somewhat inconsistant as far as grits are concerned. I have abondonded all use of Norton paper even with the convinence of heading over HD and grabing a few sheets. Try Klingspor, you wont be disapointed. And while you're at it grab some stearated (self lube) paper for sanding between coats of finish. Amazing what self lubed paper will do with sanding between finishes. No more little buggers building in the paper.

[Matt Day]

I haven't tried Klingspor and have been very happy with Norton (sheets and discs). I have never seen any swirl marks from Norton 3X. It seems to take about 3 times more time to use Gator brand than Norton, and I've seen swirl marks with Gator. I swore it off a couple years ago.

Maybe I'll try Klingspor next just to see if I can tell a difference.

[Kent A Bathurst]

My preferences:

ROS - Mirka

Sheets - Klingspoor's. Very good paper, plus one benefit that I really, really like - all the way down to 80g (and everything higher) can be had in A-weight paper. Much much easier to use with sanding blocks and bare hands than that C-weight stuff.

Sequence - assume jointed and/or planed surface: 120-150-180, or just 150-180, depending on species. For the tough stuff like QSWO, with residual tearout and harder than granite (it seems) I go 100-120-150-180.

Nearly always use shellac anymore, so anything above 180 is a waste on bare wood. Higher grits used in finishing and rubbing out.

If I am using dye, I'll go 220-320 on endgrain to burnish + limit absorption.

[Andrew Gibson]

I have been using the 3M 3x stuff. I picked up the big packs at woodcraft at 20% off a few weeks ago, even the guy who worked there was surprised at the prise. I have 120, 150, 180, 220. I also have some 320 but not a big pack. If I have to use anything harsher than 120 I use a different tool. I also do all my sanding by hand and find that 220 by hand gets me where i need to be.

Some day sanding will be replaced by scraping and planning in my shop, Hopefully.

[Tony Bilello]

I use 3M and mostly their 'open coat'. The weight of the paper has lots to do with how long it lasts. I light weight like 'A' weight will not take sharp corners very well. There is where I will use 'B' weight.
Anyway, I only use hardwoods and generally never sand lower than 100. I usually start with 120 and to 180 and thats usually it. Sometimes I will go to 220, but not very often for normal lacquer finishing.
When going for a mirror finish, i will use 120, 180, 220, 320, 400, 600,1200 and 1500. Then I use a 3 step buffing system.

If you really want to learn something, do what I did 30 years ago.
Get a long board or two and sand sections of it starting with sanding to 180. Next to it, continue on the rest of the boards with 220 then repeat with 320 and on up. Then apply a clear finish the way you normally do. stop at each section when it looks about right. You will find that the lower grits require more coats of finish then the higher grits. Eventually they will all look the same, just more coats.

Also note that even though all finishes have an adhesive quality that makes the finish stick to the wood and itself, you can sand high enough where the finish does not make a good bond with the wood. Sanding makes a patern in the wood (or steel) called an anchor profile. This gives the finish some 'tooth' to stick to. Too slick a finish, the finish wont absorb into the wood on the first coat. It will set on top of a slick surface. I dont know how much of a difference it would make and dont concern myself because I stop at 220 or less.
As for the finish sticking to itself on subsequent layers, there is in addition to sanding some 'tooth' onto the surface a chemical bond also. This also depends on the product used.

[Joe Shinall]

Thanks for all the input guys. I'm going to try some of the other brands. I've never used the Norton ROS disks. Or any of the other brands for that matter. Gonna dabble a little bit and see what I come up with. Thanks again guys.