What were they thinking??? Miter slots on cheap table saws.

[Walter McGuire]

Anyone that has made the mistake of buying a cheap benchtop table saw will quickly notice the small t-slotted miter slot. If you are new to woodworking or your budget is critically low, you will most likely do what i did...purchase one and tell yourself that you will buy a better one when you have more room or money. Let me be one of many to say this...Don't scrimp on a table saw! They are under-powered, you can't safely use a dado set, they are for the most part made like a toy...other than the blade. If this isn't enough, the miter slot on these things: What were they thinking? Does it really cost any more to mill or cast a top that has 3/4 x 3/8 miter slots? Did they do this on purpose, to sway you toward the saw you couldn't afford but should have bought, or do they just have no clue? Everything on a table saw revolves around these slots...if there's anything to get right, this would have to be high on the list. If you know that a cabinet style saw is what you really need, but you need a saw "NOW" and budget is of high concern, buy an old and ruggedly made benchtop. Most of them were belt driven and had a heavy cast iron slot. They also had...imagine that...a miter slot that would accept industry standard accessories. A little lube and maybe a couple of bearings...you'll have a saw you can do precise work with, while saving for what you want. You may even find that it's all you need

I've ranted and I feel much better.

Anyone have anything else to add...or possibly any horror stories?

[David Prince]

I can see them possibly having their place at a jobsite being portable and all, but that would be about it.

They don't feel safe when you fire them up and start pushing wood. My cabinet saw is solid as a rock and therefore seems much safer.

[Brian Kent]

I agree, with two things to add.

With my $89 Ryobi, cutting maple would work for a little while, then the motor would just freeze to a stop and not go until it cooled. I had two horrible kickbacks when the whole saw flexed.

I am much safer with a solid cabinet saw and a stable fence.

[Terry Welty]

I feel your pain... Happiest day of my life was when my craftsman table saw went up in smoke with a big SCCCCCRRREEEEEECCCCHHHHH... Suffered the underpowered, too small, noisy, crooked thing for almost 10 years... searched and researched for a new one... almost settled on Ryobi.... Thank goodness, I ended up getting a Ridgid R4511.... Great Saw...

[Neil Brooks]

My first TS was a bottom end Ryobi ... from their outlet center, in Castle Rock, CO.

I used it for about a week, but then discovered the non-standard miter slot business.

I ordered a new saw the next day.

I couldn't agree more: there isn't a valid reason that I could think of not to go with the standard. I fear ... your logic may be exactly right: find out they've screwed you, and get you to buy up.

Or ... some companies ARE just that silly.

I'd heard Craftsman did the same thing on many of their saws.... :(

[Van Huskey]

My rule of thumb: never use a saw that weighs less than the combined weight of me and the stock I am cutting.

Regarding the OP there is a lot I agree with, actually most of it. The reality most of the cheapo bench tops I have seen are being used by a "handy" homeowner who bought it to do a single project. The rest have been on jobsites and have never seen the miter slot used, most couldn't even tell you where the miter gauge is. They rip on it and crosscut on their MS.

That all said I have seen some really amazing things built on really cheap benchtop saws, there is a reason that there is Dodge and Ferrari.

[Norman Pyles]

As it is with most things, you get what you pay for.

[dan sherman]

I'm currently making do with a delta ts350 contractor saw, as I don't have the room or cash yet for a hybrid or cabinet saw.

My point of view is this:

If your making small stuff like picture frames, pencil holders and doll houses a benchtop is fine. If your making small pieces of furniture, or the occasional large piece, you can get by was a decent contractors saw. If your making lots of large pices, or constantly ripping large hardwood stock (8/4 +) you need at least a 2hp machine.

[Ken Fitzgerald]

Another thing to consider when dealing with the extemely cheaper saws.

The odds are that saw was designed and manufactured by a 2nd company and the company whose name is on it...bought that saw predesigned to meet the low end market.

The US is one country who doesn't function on the metric system. Everyday at work I moan because a lot of what I work on is metric...and a lot isn't......and it's on the same machine often....just like cars.

The miter slot could very well be metric......and was designed for countries who use the metric system.

[Walter McGuire]

I do understand that benchtop saws have a purpose and are handy for certain things, and the same with contractor saw...they fill a niche. After all, who would like to lug a cabinet saw around a jobsite.

Ken,
You've made me look at this in a different way. In Britain, they probably spend the day at work griping about fractional sizing. Standard is different everywhere. With most cheap saws being made in China and Malaysia, they probably make them to the standards of the majority of their global customers. To be honest with you...I have no idea what tools are like in other countries. It's only the tools that are specifically designed for the US market that meet our standards. Thanks for the insight.

This being said, I'm investigative by nature and vow to get to the bottom of this. I'm going to talk with some major table saw manufacturers and see what they say...just for giggles. Who knows...If I get through to them, you may very well start seeing better features on junk table saws (Laughs). I'm serious...I'm even going to post my findings.

[paul cottingham]

Hey, I have a reasonable Delta contractor saw and the mitre slot isn't right on it either. Interesting.

[Jeff Sudmeier]

You don't need the most expensive tools to make nice stuff, some of the most amazing stuff I have seen made was on a protech plastic base table saw.

[Paul Incognito]

I worked for many years with a Makita 8" bench top saw. The miter gauge and slots were a complete joke, but the fence was downright dangerous. I used that saw for a couple of months with the stock fence and when I could afford it upgraded to the Rousseau fence/table. That made a nice, useable saw out of it.
I worked with that saw for 8-10 years and built many cabinets with it.
Don't get me wrong, I've upgraded to a much bigger cast iron contractor saw recently and I'll never go back, but that Makita served me for a long time.
BTW, I break down sheet goods with a track saw and cross cut with a miter saw.
PI

[Dave Gaul]

I had a Delta bench top for over 3 years, it served me well in that time for it's intended purpose. It wasn't until I started using rough hard woods, such as 8/4 rough maple, that I realized this little guy wasn't going to cut it anymore (pun intended!). I now have a Ridgid R4511 Granite top, and with a good ripping blade, it handle 8/4+ maple just fine!

I've heard about the reason smaller saws have their short arbors and non-standard miter slots... I was reading about my first saw, and heard from a factory rep that the reason they do that is so that you CAN'T use typical accessories like you would on a bigger saw...they don't want you pushing these little guys beyond their limits...

They make the arbors short so you can't use a full-sized dado set...
They make the miter slots non-standard so you don't try to use jigs & attachments meant for bigger saws...

Not saying this is fact, just what I had heard a few years back...

[Prashun Patel]

I had a Delta Shopmaster for several years. Also served well to learn on.

Best thing it did for me was to appreciate what a 'real' saw can and should do (not that I'd call my current Jet ProShop the top of the line; but it was a budget-appropriate step in the right direction...)

[Chen-Tin Tsai]

I work on my cheapie Ryobi portable because I don't have space or funds for anything else (my father gave it to me, after buying it to rip a couple of pieces of odd shaped molding :)). Luckily, the miter slot is the standard 3/8"x3/4" size and the table is mostly big enough to work with. I used a Kreg miter track to build my crosscut sled and it works decently. The thing that irks me the most is that the saw mechanism itself would go out of alignment often, and I would need to check to make sure that it is parallel to the fence or the miter slot (whichever I was using). I haven't cut any big pieces of hardwoods with it yet, and probably won't based on what I've read here.

Anyknow know of a decent table saw that will fit in a unheated shed, be easy to roll through 40' of backyard to a driveway, and work on a regular outlet? :D

[Hugh Jardon]

I do understand that benchtop saws have a purpose and are handy for certain things, and the same with contractor saw...they fill a niche. After all, who would like to lug a cabinet saw around a jobsite.

Ken,
You've made me look at this in a different way. In Britain, they probably spend the day at work griping about fractional sizing. Standard is different everywhere. With most cheap saws being made in China and Malaysia, they probably make them to the standards of the majority of their global customers. To be honest with you...I have no idea what tools are like in other countries. It's only the tools that are specifically designed for the US market that meet our standards. Thanks for the insight.

This being said, I'm investigative by nature and vow to get to the bottom of this. I'm going to talk with some major table saw manufacturers and see what they say...just for giggles. Who knows...If I get through to them, you may very well start seeing better features on junk table saws (Laughs). I'm serious...I'm even going to post my findings.

I'm a Brit originally. When I went through school in the 70s & 80s, we did both Imperial and Metric measurements. What has happened now though, is the domination of pan-European health and Safety standards, which mandate the use of metric measurement to comply with the regulations. You can't buy a 112lb bag of cement anymore. In the first place, it is too heavy for the regulations, which say the max weight is 25kg. So 25kg bags it is. OSHA has a looong way to go before they are up with the Europeans on safety legislation.

For tools, the prevalence of large machine tools (Table saw, jointer, bandsaw, thickness planer etc) simply isn't there. You won't find table saws on sale at the equivalent of HD. A 10 inch CMS is considered the Daddy. Sorry, a 250mm CMS :) . Specialist retailers will be able to find you a table saw if you really want one, but you will pay through the nose for it. Not like here, where I bought three of them (1 contractor, 2 hybrid) for under $800 last year.

[Richard Dragin]

A poor craftsman blames his tools.

[Jim Rimmer]

A poor craftsman blames his tools.
No one in this post was blaming the tools for poor quality of their work. The comments were about non-standard miter gages and short arbors that cause issues with after market components.

[Don Whitten]

My first was a DeWalt 744X, still have it sitting around. Built a lot of good stuff with it. It is in a whole different class than the 100 dollar saws your talking about though, I do love my hybrid saw and wonder how I ever turned out the work I did on that old saw now after using this thing.

[Bret Johnson]

I know exactly what you mean. I did the same thing, bought a cheap $179 CS TS and it had those stupid t-slots. The top was aluminum so I took my router and cut a 3/4 t-slot so I could use my CS miter gauge. I burned the motor up one day cutting some Pecan. I went to HD and bought the TS3650 the next day. I should have saved my money and bought it first.

[Tony Shea]

I agree that the newer Dewalt 10in. portable table saws are actually a joy to use on jobsites and one could actually build some quality small scale furniture with them. The fence system on these saws is great and capable of great precision with its' micro-adjust feature. Once set up the fence on these saws rivals some of the hybrid/cabinet saws. But the small size is the limiting factor that a hybrid/cabinet saw beats it every time. If someone is in need of a portable table saw for jobbin it then the Dewalt should be your #1 choice. But for furniture/cabinet making don't even think about using something smaller than a contractor saw. As for the cheapy job site saws....GOD AWFUL P.O.S.! They really shouldn't even sell these things and feel bad for people that can't resist the low price. Throw in their top quality blade that comes with these saws and you got an oversized hunk of a door prop/step stool.

[Adam Slutsky]

I too started with an 8" makita portable. When I realized its limitations I expanded it with a Rouseau fence. That worked for a bit until I wanted to use a dado blade and a tennoning jig. I then traded it for a Delta TS350. This saw is ok but the blade guard stinks and the top is too small. Now I wish I had just spent the money on a better TS right from the beginning. Live and learn.

[Paul Ryan]

I have learned all of those lessons the hard way as well. I am on my 5th table saw in 8 years. The 1st was a tiny rockwell/delta bench top that was mounted to a stand. It tipped over while ripping a large 2X12 for some thing I was doing, I can remember what. That saw did not have enough power to kick back it the blade got pinched. I stopped the blade many a time while ripping 2xwhatevers with lots of stress. It was a hand me down.

I then though I would upgrade to a nice crapsman pos that I paid $175 for. It had an aluminum top, pull out wings, and out feed. The worst part of the machine was the fence. There was not way to glue line rip on that machine. I sold it to my brother for $100, for him it works well, but very hard to build furniture with it.

I then bought a jet contractor saw, with the motor internal. That was a decent machine 1 1/2 hp but the fence again was a pos. I learn my lesson after that, a crappy fence can make a good table saw bad, but a decent fence can make a bad table saw use able.

I decided to but my last saw after the jet, that is when I discovered the creek, while researching steel city table saws. At the time I was milling over a SC or a sawstop. I went the SC rout and bought a 3hp granite top machine. It was a very nice table saw, and had an exceptional fence. Looking back I should have plopped down the money for the sawstop at that time, but the PCS saw wasn't out yet, and $4800 for a ICS saw compared to $1400 for the SC.

My wife keep raggin on me the more time I was spending out cutting wood. She said she worried every time she heard the saw running. When the PCS field test saws came available I jumped on one. I was the best money I spent on a table saw. I am impressed every time I use the saw. And I have owned it for almost 1 year now. In the end I only lost $200 on the steel city, and about $100 on the jet. So not too bad.

The steel city cabinet saw would have done everything I ever needed a table saw to do, with one exception it would also cut off my finger. That is the only reason I went to the sawstop. But what I learned was how important a fence is. I really think if you have any belt driven saw with a good fence, that is all most hobbiests really need.

[Richard Dragin]

My first saw was a cheap Skil direct drive that screeched like heck. I didn't know much better and built a bedroom set and sculpted rocking chair with it. I cut hdpe runners to fit the miter track so I could make a sled and tenon cutter for it.

I guess I finally learned better and bought an old Delta contractor saw for $75. that sits in a custom cabinet. Built five more rockers with it.