Winding Sticks

[David Rinehart]

Hello to all,
Long time reader,first time poster.
Due to my goofy vision I'm having a problem using the winding sticks so,
my question is, do any of you have an alternative method.
I retired back in Oct. and now have more time to work on a project using hand tools. Don't have to use all the power tools to finish as quickly as possible. Didn't have to use the sticks very often then but now that I need to, I can't (bummer).

Thanks for any tips and help
David

[Bob Glenn]

Find a flat surface and place the board on it. If it rocks corner to corner, the two corners that it is rocking on are high. No rock, its flat. Most glass is flat. If I am planing a small board to flatten it, I just place it against the window behind my bench to do a quick check for flatness.

[harry strasil]

What seems to be your major problem?

Some possible reasons!

Sticks are the same color, I used a black felt tip to blacken the edge of one right at the top.

You are standing too close to them. 5 to 6 feet back is a good distance.

[Frank Drew]

David,

What is it that you're trying to do, and how are the winding sticks not working?

Basically, you place one stick at the far end of a board, across its width, and the other at the near end, also across its width. You stand back some (and probably have to crouch down) and sight across both sticks to see if they're parallel. It helps to have some kind of contrasting color on the edge of far stick, making it easier to detect slight amounts of deviation from parallel.

But winding sticks are only for detecting boards in wind, not other out-of-flat conditions. It's not true that if a board doesn't rock it's flat; a board that's straight along its length but cupped won't rock when placed cup down, but it's certainly not flat.

[Eric Brown]

I got the aluminum winding sticks from Lee Valley because they are straight, won't rust, and best of all they are black with aluminum stripes running down their length. The stripes are fairly easy to see. It may be an idea for you. I've never had good vision but the contrast works well for me.

Mike, you don't have a location listed as to where you are. If close, I'm sure someone here would be willing to show you some things.

Eric

[Jim Koepke]

David,

Welcome to the creek. Your problem may be similar to mine, our vision is limited by our glasses. Technically, I should have trifocals. My glasses are bifocals and some pairs are better than others. I find I often use a pair of weak readers to get the right focal depth for some of these tasks. Sometimes they have to be moved back and forth from my eyes like a hand lens.

Getting old is a B!+@#, but it is better than the alternatives.

jim

[David Rinehart]

Thanks to all.
Mr. Harry my sticks are different colors-brown and powder blue, seems to have less glare.
My main problem is like Mr. Jim said about glasses. Mine are for nearsightedness and bifocal for up close. Can't focus on both at the same time.
Thought maybe someone would have a trick or two to get around using the sticks.

Thanks again, I appreciate your comments.
Oh, Mr. Harry, in my small shop I if back up any more I'll be standing out side in my neighbors yard.

David

[mike holden]

David,
Take a piece of sheet metal, like an altoids tin; punch a very small hole in it - then look through the hole at your winding sticks.
You are effectively making a pinhole camera which has very great depth of field, this should bring both winding sticks into focus for you.
If not, well all you have lost is a tin that you would probably have stuck in the recyclables anyway.
Mike

[Jim Koepke]

Thought maybe someone would have a trick or two to get around using the sticks.

Mike and I were trying to come up with tricks to get around the glasses.

To get around the sticks requires checking with straight edges and flat surfaces and takes a bit more time and may not be as accurate. A good pair of sticks will show low points in various place over the length of a board. Placing a board on a flat surface may hide a hollow in the face of a board.

If you have a regular optometrist, you might try asking about glasses for depth of field use for this specialized need. My experience is they tend to look at you funny until you explain it some. The reading part of my bifocals is often "too close" for my liking. For reading small print they are fine, but for seeing beyond 2 or 3 feet they are useless. I explained this to my optometrist and they can make the reading part a little weaker on request. This allows me to see stairs and read through the same part of the lens. I am not sure if this will work with your eyes. A simple test would be to try some of the readers the next time you are in a pharmacy or the supermarket. If it is going to work, you should be able to find a strength that will let you see about a foot or two from you face out to at least your feet or beyond. I am not an eye doctor, but I do know this allows me to have a pair of glasses that lets me have good vision in a range of about 2 to 8 feet. Anything outside of that range requires my regular glasses. For closer work, I put a pair of readers on in front of my bifocals.

jim

[David Rinehart]

Just came in from the shop, had to try Mr. Mike's tip. IT WORKED! Although I used a Mason jar canning sticker. Had to make a couple adjustments to the hole. Don't know why I didn't think of something like that. I used to do about the same by pressing my thumbs and index fingers together to make a small hole to look through to read the numbers on the end of box cars in the rail yard.

Mr.Jim I'll try the reading glasses thing the next time I'm in town. Truck is on loan right now, may be a while.

Thank you again
David

[Johnny Kleso]

You dont have to see super well it really is pretty simple..

http://wizkidz.home.comcast.net/ww1.jpg

[Derek Cohen]

The pinhole camera trick is one I use in restaurants when I forget to bring along my reading glasses ... much to the embarrassment of my wife. Make a telescope (tube) of your forefinger and thumb, close the hole created as much as possible, and look through this. It has the same effect as a pinhole camera.

Now the real issue here is LIGHT. What you do with the pin hole is to concentrate light on a source. Aging eyes need more light ... much more light!

So simply add more light over your work bench. I added fluoros under cabinets that run above my bench. I also have focussed lights as well as fluoros in the ceiling. Can't have too little light!

Regards from Perth

Derek

[harry strasil]

Next time you get a new credit card, drill several sizes of small holes in the middle and deburr them, then carry it in your pocket, and hold the dark side up to your eye and use whichever hole gives the clearest view, its no good anymore anyway, so you don't need to worry about loosing it.

[Don McConnell]

David et al,

As others have indicated, one way to check the surface of a piece of timber for being "in wind," or twisted, is through the use of a straight-edge. Specifically, the straight-edge needs to be long enough that it can be applied diagonally, from corner-to-corner. Any significant twisting will become readily apparent. This can be a shop-made wooden straight-edge which may be readily "proofed" (checked for accuracy) from time to time, as needed. In fact, this is my preference for reasons beyond that of expense.

Another consideration is that this works best on pieces with some width relative to length. In other words, long narrow pieces, such as door stiles, don't lend themselves quite as readily to this approach. Though it still can be useful in the initial stages of truing them up. On the other hand, for pieces such as door stiles, it is so important that they not be in wind, that the multiplying effect of winding sticks can be very helpful - possibly even critical.

Some interesting approaches have already been suggested, but I thought I'd mention one other thing in case you haven't been doing it. Winding sticks are traditionally intended to be used by closing one eye while sighting across them. I'm sure it varies from person to person, but I wear trifocals (for astigmatism and presbyopia) and have no real problem when using this approach and backing off about an arm's length from the nearest winding stick. This probably doesn't need to be said, but I automatically keep my dominant eye open, and use the main part of my glasses' lens. As a point of interest, this approach is so common that, historically, winding sticks are known as "winking strips" in some locales.

Hoping this may help.

Don McConnell
Eureka Springs, AR

[John Coloccia]

If you have two long levels, you can balance them on the winding sticks, on on each side of the wood, and then read off any twist by noting a the difference.

Also, you couple completely replace the winding sticks with two levels, and get your twist by reading the difference that way, too. If you want to get silly, buy two digital levels, and then you'll get an exact readout.