Cabinet construction question

[Matt Meiser]

In my upcoming kitchen project, I've got a number of locations where part of the side of a cabinet will be visible because I'll be varying the heights and depths. I plan to use prefinished maple ply again which means I have to do something on those cabinet ends since the outsides will be red oak. I've come up with a few options, but want to see what others have done.

See the drawing below an example.

Here's what I've come up with:


Use red oak ply on those end pieces. The drawback is that the inside would not match and would need finishing.
Set those sides in 3/4" and add a 3/4" red oak ply panel on the outside. Seems wasteful
Same as the last one, but use 1/4". I'd have to glue instead of screw and I worry about adhesion to the PF surface.
Same as the last one but use paper-backed or self-adhesive veneer. Worried about adhesion here too, even more than above.
Try to find ply with maple veneer on one side, oak on the other. Haven't seen it on any local suppliers list though. And I'd have to finish the inside.

Right now I lean toward the 2nd or 4th options.

[Jay Brewer]

Hi Matt, I run into this all the time. The best way I have come up with is to use a piece of 1/4 ply the same wood species and stain as the rest of the cabinets.

I'm not sure what you mean about adhesion problems. Almost sounds like you are using prefinished 2 sides. I build all my boxes with prefinished 1 side so I can glue the 1/4" to it. Its also cheaper. just plan your box and face frames dimensions to accept the 1/4".

Hope this helps.

[Glen Butler]

My vote goes to the adhesive veneer for most of the areas. Over the oven is the only area for concern as it will get hotter, but I don't think it will be hot enough to cause a problem. If you are concerned get the paper backed and apply it with a good contact cement.

[Matt Meiser]

Jay, the stuff I've used has been 2-sided. I'll have to see if I can get single. What do you do for shelves?

Glen, have you seen any issues with it separating later? For example above the stove?

[Sam Layton]

Hi Matt,

I am in the same situation. I am building my kitchen now, working on the face frames. I am using pre-finished ply, and riff sawn red oak for the cabinets. I do not want any oak ply to show on the outside of the cabinets. I am going to use finished panels on all of the areas you described.

So on my end panels I will have maple pre-finished ply on the inside and a finished solid oak panel on the outside. Double panels will not use that much more material.

On the upper cabinets next to the stove vent, I will have the finished end panel only on the part that hangs down below the vent. The upper part that butts up against the vent will be a ply filler, and not visible.

Before I decided to use the end panels, I was going to resaw my own veneer and laminate it to unfinished ply. I will be using double partitions on most of the cabinets. It will take a few sheets extra, but what is a few sheets in the big picture...

All of my panels will be shaker flat panels. My panels will be solid wood, no ply.

What are your thoughts?

Sam

[Dirk Lewis]

Matt - I used 2-sided PF maple ply as well and tried (and got away with so far) using 1/4" ply on a couple of the exposed parts very discretely pin nailed (23g) and glued to the sanded surface of the PF ply. The sanding of the exposed panels was easy and allowed the glue to hold.

ymmv

[Jeff Duncan]

I would go for applying a veneer to the exposed side of the box. I never order pre-finished 1 sided as it's not worth it for me. Another thing to stock, not good for much except the occasional exposed end, and it has a tendency to warp much more than when both sides are finished.
good luck,
JeffD

[Jason Strauss]

Matt - I used 2-sided PF maple ply as well and tried (and got away with so far) using 1/4" ply on a couple of the exposed parts very discretely pin nailed (23g) and glued to the sanded surface of the PF ply. The sanding of the exposed panels was easy and allowed the glue to hold.

ymmv

Dirk,

I'm going to run into this problem, too. When you say "sanded" do you down to bare wood, or just scuffed up enough to get decent adhesion?

Thanks!

[David DeCristoforo]

The most "common" treatment for these conditions is to use a backed veneer (either paper or phenolic) applied to the finished end with contact cement. That way you can build out the cabinet, fill any fastener holes on the finished end (I use Bondo) and then skin the end with whatever species you are using for the faces.

[Jay Brewer]

[QUOTE=Matt Meiser;1334892]Jay, the stuff I've used has been 2-sided. I'll have to see if I can get single. What do you do for shelves?

Hi Matt, I always keep a couple sheets of 2 side in the shop. I use them for shelves and drawer boxes.

Like Jeff said,its is kind of a pain keeping both kind. I use one side alot because I can stain / tone the outside to match my kitchen on the bump outs, or easily attach a skin if I have pocket holes to cover. Its also $10 cheaper, not alot but it adds up.

The 1/4" skin allows you to use 23 ga pins to hold it while the glue dries.

I would think if you sanded the finish a little, glue and a few pins would do the trick.

[Glen Butler]

Jay, the stuff I've used has been 2-sided. I'll have to see if I can get single. What do you do for shelves?

Glen, have you seen any issues with it separating later? For example above the stove?

The stick on stuff is best for a melamine core. It give you something smooth and clean and it will never come off melamine. But where you are using ply, use a good contact cement and you won't have a problem. I have not seen a problem in my own work, but to be honest it is too soon to tell. I do know that cabinet companies have been doing it for years with success.

[Dirk Lewis]

I did a pretty decent scuff-job, half way between sand bare and light scuff?

[Brian Ross]

142822

You will have to excuse the quality of the photo but I attach a full length panel in the situation you describe. I have applied a skin but I had one start to peel and now do it this way.

Brian

[Peter Quinn]

Any location appropriate we use finished end panels. Very rarely will an end of a cabinet get a slab treatment. For situations like the step back we glue a piece of 1/4" to match the FF material to a single sided prefinished maple. The shop stocks both but uses primarily double sided these days as the cost difference is marginal. The purchaser got screamed at by the cabinet makers when he switched to double sided exclusively for just this reason. We have sanded double sided back to raw with a wide belt in a pinch, but that eats belts. That conversion varnish finish is very tough and unpleasant to sand. For situations like the cabs on each side of a window or sink, it could be either an applied 1/4" piece or a finished panel depending on the clients preference.

I have scuffed the prefinished with 60G and used PL glue for similar things in my home shop, but not for anything particularly visible or critical like what you are doing. Perhaps epoxy would work, but my call would be to get some single sided, or your other idea of adding 3/4" and some screws, maybe with some pl adhesive for good measure.

[John Gregory]

I used PSA veneer on Melamine and worked great. That is what I would use. I bought it from tapease.com. no connection to them just a customer.