Dry fit: Shaker Night Stand - African Mahogany

[Neil Brooks]

Been working on this for a while. It's the first in a pair of his-and-hers Shaker Style night stands, both being made from African Mahogany.

I'm a very new woodworker. I may have bitten off a touch more than I can chew, in this project ... BUT ... it's going okay.

Early on, I made a decision NOT to build any parts of the first and second night stand at the same time. I did this so that I could be sure to transfer any learnings gained from #1 TO #2.

And there have certainly been learnings :)

This is dry-fit mode on #1. It's all M&T joinery. The drawer faces are not yet attached. Nor is the top. Likely, I'll use Watco Danish Oil to finish it off ... if I ever get to that point :p

Thanks for looking!

http://lh5.ggpht.com/_WVVYjLCNo2w/S2Xv6A538xI/AAAAAAAAAi4/EJm3o1oSzlw/s512/NS1_Dry_Fit.JPG

http://lh4.ggpht.com/_WVVYjLCNo2w/S2Xv7s_oM0I/AAAAAAAAAjE/69nLcNwalxw/s512/NS1_Dry_Fit%20%283%29.JPG

http://lh4.ggpht.com/_WVVYjLCNo2w/S2Xv7D-u2hI/AAAAAAAAAjA/AYr7-Fp3RsQ/s640/NS1_Dry_Fit%20%282%29.JPG

http://lh4.ggpht.com/_WVVYjLCNo2w/S2Xv7s_oM0I/AAAAAAAAAjE/69nLcNwalxw/s512/NS1_Dry_Fit%20%283%29.JPG
http://lh4.ggpht.com/_WVVYjLCNo2w/S2Xv8N5KtbI/AAAAAAAAAjI/ng8jMijdX9M/s512/NS1_Dry_Fit%20%284%29.JPG

http://lh5.ggpht.com/_WVVYjLCNo2w/S2XwELdbyHI/AAAAAAAAAjU/Icyb-YOacBA/s512/NS1_Dry_Fit%20%285%29.JPG
(http://lh5.ggpht.com/_WVVYjLCNo2w/S2XwELdbyHI/AAAAAAAAAjU/Icyb-YOacBA/s512/NS1_Dry_Fit%20%285%29.JPG)

[Ken Shoemaker]

That looks like your off to an outstanding start!! I love the design and your choice of wood.

I'm really looking forward to the finished pictures.

Well done!!

[Jim Rimmer]

You may have bitten off a lot but you seem to be chewing it well. Nice work. Can't wait to see the finished pics.

[Brian Williamson]

That's a really nice design that looks like it's coming along very well! I love the details you put into it like the through tenons and the curve in the bottom stretcher. That wood is really gonna shimmer when you put a finish on it!

[Baxter Smith]

Looks good. Neat design. The next one should go faster!:)

[John Keeton]

Neil, for a new woodworker, you have taken on quite a difficult project. Mastering so many new techniques on one of your first projects is challenging, particularly on an expensive wood like mahogany. But, you are doing well.

I like the style, and you are including some very nice elements. The only change that I can see is that I may have preferred the side panel grain to run vertically. But, what you have done looks nice, and may have maximized your material.

[Andrew Gibson]

Looks great! remember when it comes to finishing to take you time. When I get to finishing I have a tendency to get impatient and that causes me to not do quite as good of a job as I would like. Right now though I have 4 projects to finish before the end of march so I at least will have something to keep my busy for the finishing of three of the 4 pieces.

[Jerome Hanby]

Looks pretty snazzy to me. How was the African mahogany to work?

[Mike Wilkins]

Off to a great start I would say. Making your own pulls also???

[Joe Leigh]

Nice job so far. It looks more Crafstman style than Shaker style with the through tenons and straight legs.

[John Thompson]

You've done an excellent job on this piece with the execution Neil. Good.. solid design and very straight-forward. You were wise being new not to tackle two of them at the same time so you could minimize over-all mistakes as yes.. you are learning as you go from your statements. When you gain the experience you will find that it will cut build time down considerably to do both at one shot but.. I respect and commend your desision under the circumstances stated to do one and the other latter.

As I was reading the replies I wondered if anyone would comment on one of the first things I noticed and would suggest for future consideration. John Keeton did as it appears we think on the same lines with design. I would have also done the side panels so they were vertical to the legs and opposing the horizonal grain of the top and bottom stretchers and the drawer fronts. Certainly ain't a big deal as we all have different taste but just an observation as JK made for consideration in the future.

Great job so far and the finish you intend should go well as it is pretty straight forward and hard to mess up really. Easy to fix if any boo-boo's from collision.. spills.. etc. down the road also.

Well done...

[Tony Shea]

Very nice job. Interesting choice of wood as I don't see a whole lot of people using African Mohogany lately, yet it is such a beautiful wood. It can be difficult to work though and I commend you for tackling such an involved project with an involved type of wood.

My suggestion other than grain direction of side panels would be about your drawer fronts. I saw where you have said you still need to attach drawer fronts, therefore I'm assuming that they will not be inset. In all honesty, I think you could probably get away with keeping what is there as your drawer fronts and adding pulls of some sort to those. The inset drawer I think would go better with this design. But maybe you already have other plans, which may include inset drawer faces. Just a suggestion. Again, very nice work.

[Neil Brooks]

Thanks so much for all the feedback.

The comment about the grain direction on the side panels is excellent. I don't remember having made a conscious choice, either for a particular look OR to maximize yield from the 5'x5' ply sheets. I'll have to look at that idea for #2. They'll sit far enough apart that something to differentiate them might be just fine!

Yeah: I would have saved some time by overlapping mortising, ripping, planing, cutting tenons, etc., etc. by running the two in parallel, rather than one after the other, but ... I knew goof-ups would cost me double :o

My brother suggested that -- if I were really worried -- I do a full sized mock-up out of SPF, first. I'd already started, but ... thought it was a great idea -- one that I may use on my next slightly-over-my-head project.

I'm finding the mahogany to be a breeze to work with. Oh, sure, it's more dense than the few other woods I've used, but it's not over-taxing my machines (I had to start with a 3" x 11" x 72" rough hewn slab, in order to get my materials in before Xmas, so I'm getting pretty good with my planer and my jointer :)). I'm also being pret-ty patient, in not asking my machines to take big, big bites.

I agree with the comment about extending that patience to the finishing stage. My shop's in the basement, but I'll finish in the garage, where I plan to put a "patience" sign on the wall. Sound advice.

I bought the plans, online. Aside from my own learning curve, I've only found one piece of the plans that probably could use improvement: the legs have a mortise on the very top of the leg. It's open TO the top of the leg ((I'm sure there's a name for it, but ...).

It left the remainder of the top very fragile. I cracked the first two front legs with very little pressure, inserting the tenons into their mortises. I re-made two legs, which ... also cracked.

Next time, I'll cut the legs a couple inches long, make the mortises, and then cut the tops off the legs, leaving them at the final length.

My wife chose the mahogany, at the lumber yard. My total materials cost for the two night stands should be a touch over $500. I was pretty happy with that, and haven't had to scrap anything, yet, aside from the usual cut-offs (which I'm happy to have!).

My own drawer pulls? 'Nother great question.

I have no say in that ;)

I think my wife (usually, she doubles as my Finishing Department, but I wanna' do these pieces) has some pulls in mind that she's found, already. My brother's a turner, though, so I could easily see getting him to make something for the pulls.

Maybe that's another opportunity to differentiate His from Hers.

Pretty new to this site. Visually impaired, so ... I never get all the time I want to, to (work on my projects or) review the fabulous work of the more experienced ww's, but ... I'll try. I'm always in awe of what many of you can do....

Thanks for all the great feedback. Much appreciated! I'll post pics when I get the glue-up and finish done.

[Neil Brooks]

Tony: Sorry. I wasn't clear. The drawer fronts that I intend to use are the ones in the picture. I simply haven't spaced them, and screwed them in to the drawer boxes, from the back, yet.

The outsides of the drawer boxes are the only non Mahogany bits. Even the drawer bottoms are 1/4" mahogany ply. They didn't have the right mahogany ply in stock, so ... I went with my old buddy, Baltic Birch, figuring it would be well hidden by the mahogany hardwood drawer fronts.

I went back and forth on drawer slides. Partly because of a few threads on SMC, I decided to go old-school, with dovetail hardwood slides. I'll install those during final glue-up.

For anybody who's bored, this link (http://picasaweb.google.com/neil0502/NightStands?feat=directlink) should take you to the rest of the pics from this project, so far....

Thanks again!

[John Thompson]

Great follow-up on your part Neil. The drawer fronts as you are using them are simply called flase fronts meaning they will be attached to an already built drawer box. You can over-hang false fronts or recess them to be even with face frames.

But.. the main reason I posted as I just saw your last comments was....

If the mate will be in the same room.. I would not... Repeat.. would not change the orientation of the side panel grain on the second one. Even and un-trained eye will probably catch that move. I would keep it the same or IMO it will be apparent. Just keep the vertical idea in mind for the next project similar to this where it could be applied.

Again... excellent job on this piece IMO. You should be proud and I would certainly be proud as my first piece way back when wasn't even close to how good this piece is. Trust me!

Regards...

[John Keeton]

If the mate will be in the same room.. I would not... Repeat.. would not change the orientation of the side panel grain on the second one. Even and un-trained eye will probably catch that move. I would keep it the same or IMO it will be apparent. Just keep the vertical idea in mind for the next project similar to this where it could be applied.Sarge is right! The grain orientation is just something to consider on the next project. I would make these two pieces identical in every respect - pulls, etc. Otherwise, I think you would regret the variance.

[Prashun Patel]

Really nice work, Neil. You shld be proud. Hat tipped to the M&T. How, may I ask, did you cut them?

[brian c miller]

I was flipping through you pics, great work.

A few quick tips / suggestions on panel glue ups at this stage:

http://picasaweb.google.com/neil0502/NightStands?feat=directlink#5420388489925299138 (http://picasaweb.google.com/neil0502/NightStands?feat=directlink#5420388489925299138)

You may want to change you clamping strategy and use one under the one over. This will reduce the chance of the clamps wanting to make a bowed surface.

Also make sure to orient the grain smile then frown then smile which will also help the panel from bowing over time.

[Neil Brooks]

John Thompson & John Keeton: I think you're right. In thinking about it, they should be identical twins. Thanks for that. I couldn't think of an example where people had nightstands that almost matched !

Brian C Miller: Thanks for your feedback, too. When I started on this project, I was a guy who had watched a LOT of NYW epidodes, chatted with his WW brother, and flipped through a lot of books. A good analogy would be: I'd read ALL ABOUT flying a 767, and ... just figured I could fly one ;)

That glue-up ... didn't work out. Between failing to alternate clamps, use biscuits/dowels, or use cauls, I ended up with an unacceptable ridge between two boards. Lesson learned. I ended up ripping it down a glue line, and the re-doing it with cauls and alternating clamps (no pics). MUCH, much better.

I've also been considering buying the P-C 557 plate joiner. On a FEW episodes of NYW, Norm didn't join his boards prior to glue-up. I figured ... AHA! But ... then I started seeing him use biscuits. Um ... okay :o

Thanks for the reminder on grain direction, too. No downside!

Shawn: Thanks so much! Because I'm visually impaired (20/20 at distance, but trouble at near. My ability to focus and NOT see double lasts only a short while. Before that, I get really symptomatic....), I knew I couldn't move into Neanderthal territory. There were TOO many M&Ts to cut. I bought a Grizzly benchtop mortiser for the mortises.

The side panels, though, go into mortises that run nearly the length of the leg. I did those on my router table with a straight bit, but did the first and last two "punches" (north end and south end of the mortise) with the mortiser, in order to leave a squarer end (I did that, of course, after the first one ... cut solely on the router table ... that didn't look so good!)

I did NOT, however, have a tenoning jig until I had already cut all the tenons. That seems to have cost me some precision and accuracy ... which ... showed itself when I tried to fit them all up.

The major lessons learned, there were:



Be sure to have adequate, and consistent, downforce on the board (miter gauge fence clamp would work) that gets the tenon, as you run it over the blade, whether using the standard 1/8" kerf TS blade or the dado stack;
A tenoning jig -- if not shop made -- is still pretty cheap, and really valuable :rolleyes:
Don't cut the tenons and the mortises both exactly to the plan spec. Cut one or the other, first, and then use that dimension to lay out the other
A mortising machine won't necessarily eliminate the need for hand chisels, and a swan-neck chisel [??]. I had a fair amount of adjustment to do, and bottoms to clean up -- sometimes because my extra 1/8" of depth wasn't quite enough; sometimes because I just didn't like the look of the bottom, the way the mortiser left it

Thanks much, again!!

[incidentally: I type about a million words a minute, and can type without looking. Between that and ... a half-pot of coffee ... I can be a bit long-winded :p]

[Ron Carlton]

snip
Also make sure to orient the grain smile then frown then smile which will also help the panel from bowing over time.


I respectfully disagree with this strategy of glue up. That approach would be fine if you were designing a washboard. If you don't alternate the wood, it works together to form and arch which is much easier to hold flat. In addition the center of the wood will be facing up, resulting in less sapwood, creating better color (much easier to get a uniform finish), harder and fewer knots.

[Neil Brooks]

I respectfully disagree with this strategy of glue up. That approach would be fine if you were designing a washboard. If you don't alternate the wood, [snip]


I thought he was suggesting that I alternate the wood, no?

[Ron Carlton]

I thought he was suggesting that I alternate the wood, no?

That is how I interpreted it. However, from my experience it is better not to alternate the wood for the reasons I gave.

I have attached a drawing that illustrates how boards will move when cut from different parts of a log. When the wood is glued together, not alternating, it tends to bow making it much easier to flatten with a few screws. Try flattening the alternating boards washboard pattern. The drawing shows how the "older", and harder, wood is on the top which will result in a more uniform finish.

[Robby Tacheny]

I think the idea of alternating the "smileys" on wood is that each strip will help to cancel the other one out. There should be opposing forces at the glue line in theory. Most everything that I have ever read supports the idea of alternating the growth ring directions.

However, I can see your point that reversing the cupping would be easier in a panel that doesn't alternate directions.

I suppose the width of the wood plays a big factor in all of this too. This is why in the end I prefer buying wider boards and ripping the edges from the board for use. This way I essentially get quarter sawn or rift sawn lumber for glue ups.

-R

[John Thompson]

I have seen this issue debated for around 10 years on forums and you won't find a conclusive answer yet. I don't alternate flat sawn ( I use almost exclusively QS at this point) and I agree with Ron that it is easier to pull it down on a table top oriented in one direction. I have done it the other way also and had both good and bad results.

The main reason I don't alternate is the fact I quite often leave open grain on table top end. Smiley up.. smiley down looks quite bizarre as the open end grain is seen. I think both ways will work as they have for me but I do agree that keeping the same orientation vs alternating makes it easier to get cup out in the majority of cases. I think even a more important factor is to be sure the wood is between a proper moisture content before glue up and has been acclimated to the shop to attempt to avoid before the fact.

Which way is the absolute right way? Which is correct.. push or pull a hand scraper. IMO the jury is out and don't expect them to deliver a final verdict anytime in your life-time. :) :) :) vs :( :) :( :) = an argument amongst the even most experienced WW'ers. Ain't WW'ing fun? ha.. ha...

[Neil Brooks]

Which way is the absolute right way? Which is correct.. push or pull a hand scraper. IMO the jury is out and don't expect them to deliver a final verdict anytime in your life-time. :) :) :) vs :( :) :( :) = an argument amongst the even most experienced WW'ers. Ain't WW'ing fun? ha.. ha...

Wow. I have ab-so-lute-ly no idea, but I DO love the way you used the smileys to describe the two different methods. That's just how I'll think of the two options, from now on.

Perfect!

:)

[Ron Carlton]

I was taught to anticipate wood moving as it ages and to use it to my advantage. The basic principles involve knowing that the wood at the center of a tree is older while the outside is younger. This means the cells on the outside are more open than the center ones...so the outside will shrink more than the center. This is important to understand because after the wood is dried and made into furniture it will continue to expand and shrink with the seasons. The outside wood will move much more than the inside. When joining boards together the boards should be chosen so that new wood is joined with new wood and old wood with old wood. If you don't do this, no matter how well planed and sanded the boards are you will find uneven joints as soon as the humidity changes. I have attached some sketches that illustrate this.

My woodworking teacher said that understanding how wood moves is the difference between a craftsmen and a carpenter.

[Steve Aasen]

Hi Neil,
Nice work. You mentioned you got the plans online. Do you mind sharing the site (I am interested in the night stands, particularly if there is a matching bed design as well)?
Thanks,
Steve

[glenn bradley]

How have I missed this thread all these months!?!

Very nice effort on the nightstand. Me like-um. Can't wait to see them with a finish on them.

[Neil Brooks]

PM sent, Steve.

Ya' know ... I never DID remember to post pics of the final, finished product.

A mind ... is a terrible thing to waste :)

Here ya' be. Happy as Mahogany clams:

http://lh6.ggpht.com/_WVVYjLCNo2w/S6qtDbfCg5I/AAAAAAAAA6k/wpWvFF6ZRTU/s512/P1040746.JPG

Pre- knob addition (I hated to do it)....

http://lh3.ggpht.com/_WVVYjLCNo2w/S6pMfNwg4kI/AAAAAAAAA6M/VQAwvmcj4SA/s512/P1040742.JPG

We're enjoying them, at bedside, every night and morning.

OhByTheWay: scrap mahogany can take this:

http://lh5.ggpht.com/_WVVYjLCNo2w/S6KbqDDao-I/AAAAAAAAA30/kWIiooQDAi0/s512/P1040727.JPG

To this (almost done)....

http://lh5.ggpht.com/_WVVYjLCNo2w/S-hpVVQPojI/AAAAAAAABBo/sIFxd5HMLuk/s512/P1040765.JPG

[Neil Brooks]

Thanks much, Glenn :)

[glenn bradley]

Those came out great. What was your finishing method?

[Tony Shea]

Nice job all around Neil. The finish came out great and like the addition of the knobs. What are the knobs made of? I also would be very interested in seeing a plan of some sort for these night-stands. My parents would love these in their bedroom as they would match existing furniture very well. Again, great job.

[Neil Brooks]

Thanks, Tony and Glenn.

Tony: These (http://www.furnitureplans.com/pi_products/1000)were the plans. For eight bucks ... pretty good deal. Pay close attention to the slides, glides, and center track before you start, though.

They almost boxed me in a corner. I had to fab center glides, at the end -- no big deal.

Finish:

Watco Danish Oil, in Natural.

First coat was a flood coat.
2nd, 3rd coats were 400-grit wet/dry wet-sanded.
Three coats of paste wax on top.

I guess the knobs are closest to an oil-rubbed bronze:

http://lh5.ggpht.com/_WVVYjLCNo2w/S6qtD59frTI/AAAAAAAAA6o/_b9mgk-q5ZQ/s512/P1040747.JPG

Thanks, again. My 1st date with African Mahogany. A joy to work with....