cyclone separator questions

[Anthony Scott]

So I am considering a Dust Deputy or build a Thein separator. I understand they separate out the large chips and such; and the fine dust goes to the vac. I just have a shop vac for my dust collector now. It seems the filter on the vac gets clogged with the fine dust. So won't that continue to happen even if I use a separator?
Am I missing something?

[Phil Thien]

Absolutely. There is no separator that will separate ALL the fine dust.

My solution has been to use a bag in my vac to catch whatever fines that do make it through.

I would suggest doing the same whether you build one of my separators, or go with the DD.

Conventional cyclones have a slight advantage when it comes to the very finest dust. Although, the bag in my vac is 1.5 years old and barely has anything in it (I should change it due to age, I think).

My design, I feel, is less prone to clogging (especially when working wider stock on my jointer/planer). And it is certainly more compact if height is limited (mine is under the laundry chute).

[mickey cassiba]

Phil(not meaning to hijack) I've built a separator loosely based on your design, and have one question. I've only got one machine that produces actual chips and pieces hooked into a 10HP system. Would it be possible/advisable to place the separator at the machine in question?
Mick

[Cameron Reddy]

Anthony,

I encourage you to do some reading on http://billpentz.com//woodworking/cyclone/index.cfm

Cameron Reddy

[Phil Thien]

Phil(not meaning to hijack) I've built a separator loosely based on your design, and have one question. I've only got one machine that produces actual chips and pieces hooked into a 10HP system. Would it be possible/advisable to place the separator at the machine in question?
Mick

I guess it depends.

For many, having a separator right at the big chip producer(s) makes sense as it allows you to change bags less.

Then having a baffle (or baffleS) inside the ring (or ringS) of your DC will help keep the fines out of your filters.

Telling me a little more about your DC may help me make more helpful suggestions.

[mickey cassiba]

Phil, sorry I took so long to get back to this. The DC is a Grizzly 10 HP 4 bagger, which is in the process of being upgraded with Wynn filter cartridges. It's rated at 6700 CFM(I think that number came from the "marketeers" rather than the engineers) The DC does just fime with three of the four machines it services, but the fourth is a real sore toe. It's a rope lathe and produces what could best be described as floss; long thin flexible pieces about 3" long, and about the thickness of 20g wire. They hang on every little bump and not, and when the air moves through them they weave themselves into very effective plugs, clogging an eight inch metal duct in a matter of minutes. The separator I built has cured all of that, but one of our products is wood chips for animal bedding and the lathe produces superior chips for this. I have been tasked with trying to keep these chips separate from the rest of the chips and dust.
Moving the separator was my first idea to that end.
Mick

[Travis Gunn]

Phil,
Does putting a bag in your shop vac help keep the filter from clogging? I don't understand.......
Thanks
Travis

[Aaron Hastings]

Anthony,

I encourage you to do some reading on http://billpentz.com//woodworking/cyclone/index.cfm

Cameron Reddy


If dust collection were compared to politics, Bill Pentz would be a raging liberal in terms of extreme air quality. Most would fall in the more moderate 'conservative democrat' range. I think air quality is important, but I don't think the vast majority of people need the type of air quality than Bill deems mandatory.

...and with that, I'll probably take a public flogging.

[glenn bradley]

Phil,
Does putting a bag in your shop vac help keep the filter from clogging? I don't understand.......
Thanks
Travis

I believe the idea is that the bag still clogs but, is easier to clean than the filter. I have a DD and had a 5gal bucket separator before that. I run CleanStream filters in both my shop vacs. They seem expensive but are probably the last filter you will ever buy.

The best part is that when they need to be cleaned, 80% of the stuff just taps off into the trash can due to the non-stick material and then you just run it under the faucet. Or do like I do and toss it on the lawn and hit it with the garden hose. No bags, no worn out filters; been running them for years.

[David Hostetler]

I response to the original poster's question. I have a Thien separator for my shop vac. It does separate out a LOT of the fines, but not all, and eventually I clog the filter. But nowhere near as fast. With just the vac, my HEPA filter would clog in a couple of hours of sanding and shop cleanup. With the Thien separator, it became a matter of months... I cannot say if the separator is exactly that effective with my dust collector, as I have never operated it without a Thien baffle of some sort. (First in the DC, then a pre separator unit...)

My vac does not have a bag available so I can't speak to using a bag, but I can say that the HEPA filter in my vac (A Ridgid) is plenty no stick, just knock the majority of the junk off, then hose it down in the lawn, let it dry for a couple of days and get after it again...

[Phil Thien]

Phil,
Does putting a bag in your shop vac help keep the filter from clogging? I don't understand.......
Thanks
Travis

In a nutshell, yes.

Pretty much everything stays in the bag. So the pleats stay clean.