Sawstop contractors saw opinions?

[Josh Reet]

Most of the SMC conversation about Sawstop saws (aside from the typical arguments) seems to be about the ICS or PCS.

However, due to money, need, and space, if I were going to get a saw stop any time in the near future, it would have to be the contractors saw. I have a contractors saw now, so it's not like I have a unisaw and would be stepping back to anything. From what I can tell, ignoring the brake system, the sawstop contractors has better features, is more powerful (by 1/4 HP), and has a better fence (if you go for the 36 or 52 in) than what I own now.

Anyone used one? Any thoughts one way or the other? I'm not really interested in getting into the "too expensive for the brake feature" or any of the other arguments that people like to throw about in Sawstop discussions. I'd just like to know about their contractors saw as a hobby woodworker's saw.

[Van Huskey]

I will try to wade in without broaching any issues you do not want touched.

The SS CS is a solid saw, the stock fence is garbage as you seem to know. I can't say more in that vein as you ask us not to.

Treading lightly here BUT you can get a LOT more saw for the money. There are a lot of great full 3hp cabinet saws for less (even half) what the CS will cost out the door with the correct upgrades.

Bottom line, the SS aquits itself well (with upgraded fence) against all the contractor saws that cost half as much (because almost all of the are half as much). You will not be disappointed if you judge it by contractor saw criteria, you just have to decide if the extra safety feature is worth the money, you will however be disappointed if you judge it by $1800 TS criteria.

The entire SS line stands equal to its true peers in utility just has a significant cost for the safety. The ICS meets or exceeds the standards of the PM2000, the General and the Uni, the PCS meets or exceeds the level of all the upper-mid level 3 hp "american" cabinet saws and the CS meets or exceeds the level of all the contractor saws, one never looses utility buying a SS compared to their real competition plus it adds a measure of safety which the others do not afford as a set cost above the utility competative saws. One must decide if that cost is right for them, much like paying extra for stability control either by buying an option or a more expensive make/model of car. It is simply like insurance, you pay for it based on your utility derived from it, noboby has insurance for EVER possible loss or liability and very few have no insurance for any loss or liability, the majority lie somewhere in the middle.

[Glenn Vaughn]

I have the contractor and am extremely impressed with it. I have the 36" rails and the upgraded fence. It is very well constructed and, as far as I can tell, very accurate.

[Tim Null]

I think I can reply in the manner you are requesting.

I have a small space. So a cabinet saw is not in my realm of possibility. I need something that I can move around. Also, 220 is not a possibility at this time. In order to run 220, I would have to route the wire in a manner that my significant other would find not acceptable for cosmetic reasons.

So large hp saws are not a possibility even if the budget allows.

I had a Ridgid, which was fine for a beginning saw. I eventually wanted the best contractor style saw I could get. The safety advantage is what put me over the edge. I need all ten digits to earn my living, so my hobby cannot endanger my families livelihood.

Outfitted with cast iron wings and the upgraded fence, I have no complaints. It works flawlessly. Has all the muscle one can ask from the sub 2 hp motor. Fit and finish is top notch.

Would I buy it again? Yes. The safety alone is worth the extra money. Could I have gotten similar performance for less? Most likely. But my peace of mind is priceless. And the saw does not compromise in function, it just costs more to have the safety features.

Seems to me, if you are considering a SS saw, then you will get one. Those who choose another brand are not making the safety feature their prime concern. This is not to say that if you do not use a SS that you care less for safety, just that if having the blade brake is important, then it becomes a major issue in your buying criteria.

So in my mind, it is the best contractor saw out there. Is it the most performance for the buck? No. But what the extra dollars buy you is well worth it. Just get the two or three add ons: Cast iron wings, upgraded fence and mobile base.

[Josh Reet]

Thanks for the replies thus far, some good info there.

I probably should have specified that "is it a good value" isn't what I am asking. I see that as an unanswerable question because those who value the safety system will see it as a moot point because they want that feature and those who don't value the safety system will see the saw as massively overpriced. So attempting to discuss it will just get into those sawstop arguments I want to avoid.

What I'm looking to get answered is if people who have experience with the sawstop contractors saw feel that it is a quality saw in comparison to other similar saws. Is it accurate? Is the QC high? Does the fancy dust collection thing work? Is it a pain to align the blade? And so on.

If it's a good saw, then I will have my own answer for myself as to if it is a good value and use of my money.

[Ron Carlton]

snip

What I'm looking to get answered is if people who have experience with the sawstop contractors saw feel that it is a quality saw in comparison to other similar saws. Is it accurate? Is the QC high? Does the fancy dust collection thing work? Is it a pain to align the blade? And so on.



I have the contractors saw with the dust collector. Nothing fancy about it, has a hose from the base of the saw to two outlets...4" and 2 1/2". Works OK...still get a lot of dust on the floor and table. I believe it was a $49 option. Don't think the table top collector is available for the contractors saw, couldn't find anything on their web site that touted it. Can't see why it wouldn't work.

http://www.sawstop.com/images/hero_PCS_dust.jpg

[Ron Bott]

I've had A Sawstop contractors saw for a while now and really like it. I got the upgraded model with cast iron wings and beis clone fence. It's heavy, the fit and finish is superb and it has done everything I have asked of it.

When I saw the Sawstop in action at a WW show a few years back, I knew I had to get one. I think the technology was amazing, and I would never forgive myself if I had an accident and knew there way a way to prevent it but chose not to.

I upgraded from a PM 66. It performs every bit as well with the added safety of the brake feature. I built a one of those enclosed contractor saw work stations with router table, and it improved the already pretty good (by contractor saw standards) dust collection. I expected I would sacrifice some performance in the name of safety in the transition from cabinet saw to Sawstop contractor saw, but have found none.

I'm sure you will get a number of responses that say it's crazy to spend that much money on a contractors saw, that you could get a low end cabinet saw instead. But the Sawstop contractors saw is not built like or doesn't perform like any other contractors saw. It's a real step up from the others.

[Shawn Pixley]

I have the SS Contractor Saw. Like you, mine has to be mobile (Garage where we park two cars). I did not want to run a 220V line as it like would have involve both a new panel and possibly a new service. I added cast iron wings, the 36" Pro fence and extesion table, and mobility base. After which I added an outfeed table, some storage drawers under the extension, and various jigs. The saw is great and compares very well to a Unisaw (what I learned on). It was easy to set up and has done everything I ask of it. I don't think that it is in the same league with other contractor saws. for what I have done to it, maybe I could have gotten the PCS. But that wasn't even a rumor when I gat the saw and there is that whole electricity thing again.

Everything in my shop has to be mobile and find a home along the wall and run on 100v power. I have built cabintery, furniture and yes built my first box the other day. I does all that I ask of it. I have no regrets and would do it again.

[Josh Reet]

Don't think the table top collector is available for the contractors saw, couldn't find anything on their web site that touted it. Can't see why it wouldn't work.

http://www.sawstop.com/images/hero_PCS_dust.jpg

That's a shame as the guard collection thing was part of what I considered "fancy". But still, the Sawstop DC is going to be a step up from what my Delta has now I suppose.

[Gerald Senburn]

I've been seriously looking at the contractor saw to replace my 1970s-vintage craftsman saw. I had a chance to play with one a few weeks ago and it's really quite nice. The controls are very smooth and I really liked the dust collection of the guard.

[Paul Ryan]

That's a shame as the guard collection thing was part of what I considered "fancy". But still, the Sawstop DC is going to be a step up from what my Delta has now I suppose.


I tested a shark guard designed for a ICS saw and it fit just fine on my PCS saw. From what I understand the riving knife and holding fixture is the same for all 3 saws. So if you really want a new SS guard call up your dealer and order one for a PCS saw it will fit.

[Rod Sheridan]

I've been seriously looking at the contractor saw to replace my 1970s-vintage craftsman saw. I had a chance to play with one a few weeks ago and it's really quite nice. The controls are very smooth and I really liked the dust collection of the guard.

I have overhead dust collection on my table saw, and it sure is a great feature, I wouldn't go back to not having it.

Regards, Rod.

[Peter Aeschliman]

I tested a shark guard designed for a ICS saw and it fit just fine on my PCS saw. From what I understand the riving knife and holding fixture is the same for all 3 saws. So if you really want a new SS guard call up your dealer and order one for a PCS saw it will fit.

I was reading this thread solely to figure this issue out. I wonder why they don't offer it as an accessory if it fits? weird.

I have looked at this saw carefully, and it really does seem to have better features that other contractors saws. The dust collection, mobile base mechanism, slightly more powerful motor, and the riving knife are huge improvements compared to competitors.

So my thinking on the cost is this: if you were to allocate the incremental cost of this saw vs. the next closest competitor, you can't assign the entire premium to the safety brake... Those other features should factor in as well.

From what I can tell, saws with and without riving knives have about a $150 price difference alone.

[Josh Reet]

Are the Sawstop saws USA made?

[Rod Sheridan]

Are the Sawstop saws USA made?

No...........Regards, Rod.

[Larry Crowder]

"However, due to money, need, and space, if I were going to get a saw stop any time in the near future, it would have to be the contractors saw. I have a contractors saw now, so it's not like I have a unisaw and would be stepping back to anything. From what I can tell, ignoring the brake system, the sawstop contractors has better features, is more powerful (by 1/4 HP), and has a better fence (if you go for the 36 or 52 in) than what I own now."

I'm not an electrical engineer, but how does SS squeeze out an extra 1/4 HP from a motor wired at 110v? I don't understand how they can rightfully claim to be more powerful than every other CS on the market!

[mreza Salav]

"However, due to money, need, and space, if I were going to get a saw stop any time in the near future, it would have to be the contractors saw. I have a contractors saw now, so it's not like I have a unisaw and would be stepping back to anything. From what I can tell, ignoring the brake system, the sawstop contractors has better features, is more powerful (by 1/4 HP), and has a better fence (if you go for the 36 or 52 in) than what I own now."

I'm not an electrical engineer, but how does SS squeeze out an extra 1/4 HP from a motor wired at 110v? I don't understand how they can rightfully claim to be more powerful than every other CS on the market!

Simple: the motor could be more efficient.
A Baldor 3HP motor works on 14.5 amp vs. a cheap 3HP motor can draw up to 22apm (full load).;

[Van Huskey]

What I'm looking to get answered is if people who have experience with the sawstop contractors saw feel that it is a quality saw in comparison to other similar saws. Is it accurate? Is the QC high? Does the fancy dust collection thing work? Is it a pain to align the blade? And so on.

If it's a good saw, then I will have my own answer for myself as to if it is a good value and use of my money.


I have used the SS contractor's saw on several occasions, I have over the years had occasion to use 10 or so of the other contractor saws on the market, the quality, fit and finish as well as the operation is equal to or better than the best contractor saws period. It is a very accurate CS when the stock fence is upgraded, dust colections is OK as good as other con saws BUT lacks compared to good cabinet saws as all con saws do. I haven't tuned a SS CS so I can't say but based on what I have been told it is as easy as the better con saws out there. For me if I were to be given any contractors saw including the SS I would take the SS even if it didn't have a brake, this is based on the fact the non-brake based utility is as high as any other contractors saw and the QC seems to be higher than the rest.

The one thing I take issue so far in the discussion is directly comparing the SSCS to a PM66 and a Uni, do NOT get the impression that SS has "walked on water" and produced a contractors saw that has the accuracy, power and general utlity as serious cabnet saws. You have to take this kind of enthusiasm with a grain of salt.

Table saws are simple beasts so the criteria for choosing them is not complicated like say an automobile, I think for the SS all one has to do is decide if the brake is worth about $800 to them, because that is the only real issue since the SS saws are the equal of the best saws in their form category when it comes to criteria that does not involve the brake.

[Van Huskey]

I'm not an electrical engineer, but how does SS squeeze out an extra 1/4 HP from a motor wired at 110v? I don't understand how they can rightfully claim to be more powerful than every other CS on the market!

If they are claiming the most powerful CS on the market they are incorrect, even venerable Grizzly has two 2hp 110v contractors saws.

[Josh Reet]

If they are claiming the most powerful CS on the market they are incorrect, even venerable Grizzly has two 2hp 110v contactors saws.

I haven't seen Sawstop themselves claim anything like that. They just say their contractors saw is 1 3/4 HP. My delta contractors saw is 1 1/2 HP.

[Ron Carlton]

I got an answer from Sawstop regarding the blade guard with integrated dust collections.

"Hi Ron,

Thank you for contacting SawStop. In response to your request, new blade guard with integrated dust collection,(that currently comes standard on the Professional Cabinet Saw) will be available to purchase as an accessory to the Industrial Cabinet Saw in Q1 2010. Use of the new quick-release insert is required to utilize the new blade guard. Pricing has not yet been established. snip"

[Josh Reet]

I got an answer from Sawstop regarding the blade guard with integrated dust collections.

"Hi Ron,

Thank you for contacting SawStop. In response to your request, new blade guard with integrated dust collection,(that currently comes standard on the Professional Cabinet Saw) will be available to purchase as an accessory to the Industrial Cabinet Saw in Q1 2010. Use of the new quick-release insert is required to utilize the new blade guard. Pricing has not yet been established. snip"



I am confused. So does the contractors saw come with that dust collection guard or not? Some of the comments on this thread make it sound like it does. But I can't find any photos showing the saw with the dust collection guard installed.

[Ken Fitzgerald]

Josh,

Go to www.sawstop.com (http://www.sawstop.com) select contractors saw and watch the videos.

It appears to come with under the table dust collection.

[Josh Reet]

Josh,

Go to www.sawstop.com (http://www.sawstop.com) select contractors saw and watch the videos.

It appears to come with under the table dust collection.

Doh!

I should have thought of that.

From the videos, it very clearly shows a different guard. I guess I'll email them and see if it will be an option like they told Ron it would be for the ICS.

[Glenn Vaughn]

The response I got from Sawstop when I asked the same question in November:



Thank you for contacting SawStop. It is great to hear you are enjoying your new Contractor Saw! In response to you inquiry, the new blade guard with integrated dust collection will be available to purchase as an accessory to the Contractor Saw in early 2010. Use of the new quick-release insert is required to utilize the new blade guard. Pricing has not yet been established. I recommend signing up for the SawStop newsletter at www.SawStop.com (mhtml:{876E242B-DC14-45E0-B982-A7FF2BA7E719}mid://00001242/!x-usc:http://www.sawstop.com/) which will keep you apprised of product releases and updates. Feel free to contact me with any questions.

[Josh Reet]

The response I got from Sawstop when I asked the same question in November:

Better than nothing I suppose. Thanks for the info.

[John Sanford]

First, I have no experience with the SS CS, but I've perused this thread with interest.

Safety aside, the class of the Contractor's Saw segment is the Delta, or perhaps "was", as I don't know how the Asian Delta CS's stack up against the previous American built models. From what I've read, the SS meets or exceeds the features of the classic Delta Contractor's Saw. It certainly has better dust collection.

I still kinda wish they'd have done a hybrid rather than a CS, but that's mainly because the whole "motor hanging out the back" on a CS is a PITA.

FWIW, I've had a Delta CS for about 10 years now, outfitted with an Incra fence.

[Josh Reet]

Just as a follow up to the guard/dust-collection aspect of this thread, here is another question and answer from the Sawstop people.

My question:


Are there any plans for the new blade guard to come standard on the ICS or contractors saw? Or will it always be an add on?

Their reply:


At this time we only have plans for it to be an optional accessory. Thanks!

As a side note, they were quite fast at replying to my email. So that says something about the company to me.

[JohnT Fitzgerald]

As a side note, they were quite fast at replying to my email. So that says something about the company to me.

Josh, before buying I had quite a few emails/questions out to them, and they were all answered extremely promptly.