Shooting Board Plane

[Jim Koepke]

For my shooting board needs, mostly two planes have been used. A low angle block plane, Stanley #65-1/2, has been used for a lot of work. It is fairly comfortable with the lever cap as opposed to the knuckle joint cap of the #65. The problem is when trying to power through bigger pieces it just does not have enough mass to keep going.

The other plane that has been put to work on this is a Stanley #5-1/2. It has good mass, but tends to stall after about 10 inches. The real problem seems to be that it is difficult to get a good grip on the plane to keep pushing. A #6 is just a bit too big without building a bigger shooting board.

So, in my attempts to make this a bit easier to push and a bit more comfortable for the hand, a piece of scrap ash from an old lathe turning was put to use.

First, it was put in place and given a few trial pushes. The best feeling angle was determined and then a pencil was used to scribe a location line to locate where a slot should be. A saw was used to put a kerf about 2-1/2 saw widths into the wood.

As a proof of concept, it does work and is much more comfortable than trying to shoot without it.

I will be doing more on this in the future. For now, has anyone else done home made mods to an old Bailey without drilling holes?

I have seen some with knobs on the side posted here.

138613
138614
138615

jim

[Eric Brown]

I use the L-V LA Jack and wish the handle was better positioned for shooting. A tilt handle might work or maybe a custom made tote that has the handle offset? Think I'll give it some thought.

Eric

[Jim Koepke]

I use the L-V LA Jack and wish the handle was better positioned for shooting. A tilt handle might work or maybe a custom made tote that has the handle offset? Think I'll give it some thought.

Eric

One of the things that was forgotten in my OP was the position of the handle and the direction one puts pressure on plane. It seems shooting works best with the hand over or just behind where the blade meets the work.

jim

[harry strasil]

I currently use a woodie jack set fine with the right side jointed square to the sole and the handle repositioned on the left side for my demo shop and a miller falls 07 (stanley 140 clone in my basement shop).
A skew angle woodie jack is currently under construction for my demo shop.

[lowell holmes]

I have the same plane. Derek Cohen has a tutorial making a hot dog handle for the LV BU Jack.

I will build one for mine.

[Jim Koepke]

Modified the handle some more by cutting a couple of kerfs in the side and cleaning it out with a 1/8 inch chisel.

It is shown on a #6 was modeled on the #5-1/2. It was just being tried on other sizes of plane. The #6 works well with the "hot dog" also.

139336

139337

139338

It was cut a little to seat up against the frog. The back end was cut with a gouge to make it more comfortable on the palm and heal of the hand. Not as nice as the one Derek made, but it does the job. Took less than 15 minutes to convert a piece of scrap ash off the lathe.

jim

[Jim Paulson]

Jim,

Glad you posted this thread because I'm building my long shooting board right now and I'll be dealing with the handle aspect shortly. I thought the colorful label on the bottle was a nice touch too. Is it an ale of some sort? If so, it does put a spin on how much effort we put into getting straight boards. LOL

I like the idea of the handle, but I think it would be a neat thing to have the handle clamp onto the side of the plane body. Instead of drilling a hole, I don't see why a person couldn't add a clamp with a tightening bolt to the end of the handle. I might try it myself. Thanks for getting us thinking about this.

Jim

[Jim Koepke]

Jim,

Glad you posted this thread because I'm building my long shooting board right now and I'll be dealing with the handle aspect shortly. I thought the colorful label on the bottle was a nice touch too. Is it an ale of some sort? If so, it does put a spin on how much effort we put into getting straight boards. LOL

I like the idea of the handle, but I think it would be a neat thing to have the handle clamp onto the side of the plane body. Instead of drilling a hole, I don't see why a person couldn't add a clamp with a tightening bolt to the end of the handle. I might try it myself. Thanks for getting us thinking about this.

Jim


Jim,

That was my last bottle of the Christmas / Winter Solstice Ale. Many of us Neanders use high carb beverages to fuel muscle powered woodworking.

There is no hole in the plane for this one, it is pretty much a friction and wedging fit. I think Derek Cohen got this started with his making a wooden hot dog for one of his planes.

I have been thinking about it because I want to buy the LN #62 with a hot dog for shooting. Besides, a regular bench plane is downright uncomfortable for more than just a little shooting.

For tightening it to the plane, there are a lot of ways that would prevent damage to the plane. That would take a bit more engineering. For now, I think I will stick with what I have until the Lie-Nielsen Tool Show opens in Portland next month.

I was talking to them on the phone the other day to see what kind of deals they will have at the show. His reply was with purchases above a certain amount they will let you have one of their DVDs for free. What a conundrum, trying to pick just one.

jim

[Jim Paulson]

Jim,

Saranac is the beer in these parts and fortunately I am able to enjoy one with my parishioners once in awhile.

Your interest in buying a LN62 for shooting got me thinking.



"I have been thinking about it because I want to buy the LN #62 with a hot dog for shooting. Besides, a regular bench plane is downright uncomfortable for more than just a little shooting."


I have been thinking about eventually purchasing a LN low angle jack for awhile, but the LN9 iron mitre plane while more costly might have some advantages too. Cost aside, which of these two planes do you think would be the most beneficial to own first? This might motivate me to finish some things, who knows.

Jim

[Jim Koepke]

Jim,

Saranac is the beer in these parts and fortunately I am able to enjoy one with my parishioners once in awhile.

Your interest in buying a LN62 for shooting got me thinking.



"I have been thinking about it because I want to buy the LN #62 with a hot dog for shooting. Besides, a regular bench plane is downright uncomfortable for more than just a little shooting."


I have been thinking about eventually purchasing a LN low angle jack for awhile, but the LN9 iron mitre plane while more costly might have some advantages too. Cost aside, which of these two planes do you think would be the most beneficial to own first? This might motivate me to finish some things, who knows.

Jim


The LN #9 versus the LN #62 has been flipping around in my mind also. My thoughts revolve around what will be done with this plane. The #62 is a Low Angle Jack Plane that should have a bit of versatility. The #9 is pretty much specialized for shooting or miter trimming on a shooting board.

From talking to LN on the phone, the #9 is quite a bit heavier than the #62.

So, my final decision is that if there was some extra money in my budget, then both would be better. Since that is not the case, my choice is to go with the more versatile #62.

Heck, last night with the added comfort of a wooden "hot dog" on the planes it seemed like maybe I do not really need the #62. Though it is sure to come in handy on some other projects.

Over time, it will likely get my wife to use some hand planes, she is an advocate of sanding. She likes to make decorative things from burl slabs. The #62 with a toothed blade will likely help to tame the wild grain of burl.

jim

[Terry Beadle]

Here's a couple photo's of a hot dog I made for my LN Low Angle Jack plane out of a scrap piece of poplar. I cut the blank on my table saw by making a single pass at estimated center length wise. Then rotating the piece 180 and cutting again. Then I increased the width of the cut by 1/32 nds until it fit snug on the side of the LN. Then I added three 1/4 inch dowels to the bottom with two of the dowels spaced to trap against the mouth ridge. Shaped with planes and oscillating sander to comfort.

[Jim Koepke]

Interesting design.

I guess if the stress is too much, the dowels will break before the metal.

Made me think of a cam lock design possibilities.

jim

[Dale Sautter]

A skew angle woodie jack is currently under construction for my demo shop.

Any progress here Harry?

I sure have been debating in my mind which way to go with this for a plane that I've been thinking about. At this point, it's still a couple projects away, and looming closer. Ron Hock put together a nice chart here (http://hocktools.wordpress.com/2010/03/07/the-turn-of-the-skew/), hope he doesn't mind me quoting from his blog:



To save you some time I did a bit of Excel work and came up with a chart to show the effective angle of a the following pitches and skews:

Skew angle –> 10° 15° 20° 25° 30° 35° 40° 45°
Pitch angle
35° 34.4 33.6 32.6 31.3 29.8 28.0 26.1 23.9
40° 39.3 38.4 37.2 35.6 33.8 31.8 29.5 27.0
45° 44.1 43.1 41.6 39.9 37.8 35.4 32.8 30.0
50° 49.0 47.7 46.0 44.0 41.6 41.6 35.9 32.8
55° 53.8 52.3 50.3 47.9 45.2 42.1 38.9 35.4
60° 58.5 56.8 54.5 51.7 48.6 45.2 41.6 37.8
65° 63.2 61.1 58.4 55.2 51.7 47.9 44.0 39.9

A common pitch plane (blade bedded bevel down at 45°, like your trusty #4, etc.), skewed 30° will attack the wood at an effective angle of 37.8°. If you skew the same plane 45°, it will cut the wood as would an edge at 30°.

Sorry the formatting got a tad out of place...

I have a nice chunk of mesquite already roughly cut to size and sliced for glue up but originally planned on using a home made bronze lever cap. Using a skewed iron would... complicate this a bit, but may well be worth the effort in gaining a shallower cut/slice. Originally planned on using an A2 iron honed to 30°, bedded at 42°, leaving a 12° clearance angle. With a 20° skew... the effective angle would be ~39 1/2°. A dilemma... :)

Forgot to mention that this is kind of an experiment of sorts... also plan on inlaying 1/4" x 1 1/2" brass into the cheeks, full length, and boring a 1 3/8" hole, centered in the bed, the whole length to house an epoxied-in-place solid brass rod. This ought to gain me a few pounds of mass and a bit of rigidity... :)

[David Weaver]

It's hard to tip a #9 and scuzzle up your shooting board, at least compared to a low angle jack when you're tired.

Is LN your brand preference regardless?

Before I had a 9, I used a LV LA Jack plane, and not much, i guess as i got the #9 almost as soon as I seriously got into hand work. I haven't used the LA jack for over a year now- and probably for two on a shooting board, and have really only kept it to use with a toothed blade, which I've also never actually had the occasion to "need" to do.

What little I used it on a shooting board, I always thought the size of the cheeks was nice to have, and it wasn't uncomfortable to use until you really used it a lot in a session. The low angle gets through stuff easier than the #9 at the same shaving thickness, but I much prefer the #9 since it does what it was designed to do without really having to pay attention at all to whether or not it's tipping or how hard you're handling it. I've never been in a rush for heavy stock removal at the shooting board, so the fact that it isn't quite as low of an angle is of no consequence - the #9 would absolutely be my choice of "inexpensive" miter planes unless you had something else that would make the 62 get used elsewhere often and make you feel warm and fuzzy about really getting your money's worth out of it.

[Jim Koepke]

David, I think you make your point very well.

I was looking at the #9 as a dedicated shooting plane.

How ever, the LN #62 just seemed to have more versatility, which is a trait I like in a tool. I do use it on face grain and other trimming at times.

Also, a lot of my shooting is on 8 and 12 inch boards where the lower angle works advantageously for my arthritic elbow and shoulder.

Of course, when I hit the lottery a #9 will be on my short list just because.

jim

[Phillip Ngan]

What makes the LN9 (http://www.lie-nielsen.com/catalog.php?sku=9)so good for shooting are the large cheeks and the position of the handle placed directly above the cutting edge.

However having said that, the LA can be used for shooting, especially with the hot dog handle, but a LN9 cannot be used as a bench plane because of the lack of forward and rear totes.

I have a Lee Valley Bevel Up Jack, and it has a large dimple on the side on which your thumb sits for shooting. I find it works really well for that purpose. And of course being a bevel up design it can be a regular and high angle plane too.

[David Weaver]

What makes the LN9 (http://www.lie-nielsen.com/catalog.php?sku=9)so good for shooting are the large cheeks and the position of the handle placed directly above the cutting edge.

However having said that, the LA can be used for shooting, especially with the hot dog handle, but a LN9 cannot be used as a bench plane because of the lack of forward and rear totes.

I have a Lee Valley Bevel Up Jack, and it has a large dimple on the side on which your thumb sits for shooting. I find it works really well for that purpose. And of course being a bevel up design it can be a regular and high angle plane too.

I can't say much for the hotdog version because I don't have it (i have the old version with the side knob), but in general the LN 9 is a lot less tippy on a long shoot than an LA jack, and you can use it indefinitely without your fingers starting to hurt.

The handle is in a funny place - really far forward - on the old LN 9s, but shooting a long board, you can put it on the web of your hand and lean your forearm on it and push as hard as you can without hurting your fingers.

I guess I'd say it's just a lot easier to use (especially for long periods) because it's squat width wise and the cheeks are designed for shooting. It's nice for long grain shooting trimming / too. It's a bit of a luxury item, though, your work won't be any better because of it, at least mine hasn't been, and now I have a LV BUS that never sees the light of day except once every 6 months or so when pulling it out of the box to make sure there's no rust.

[Doug Shepard]

I hope this isn't derailing this thread but I've been debating selling the LN hot dog I picked up for the LA Jack. I bought it but haven't done any shooting with the LA Jack since getting the hot dog. Then I ended up getting a LN #9 last fall when Woodcraft was having their great LN sale. Is there any compelling reason why I still might want to use the LA Jack for shooting and keep the hot dog if I have the #9 too?

[Jim Belair]

With the LA Jack being such a favoured choice for shooting board use, I wish Veritas would come out with a hot dog as an accessory for theirs. A nice piece of bubinga to match the tote and knob, a brass insert with set screw or two. I know I could make one but its just another thing on the list.

Jim B

[John Gornall]

The Lee Valley bevel up jack plane actually has a hotdog handle built in - it was designed that way. The lever cap is hotdog shaped, narrow with parallel sides. Your fingers grip the lever cap with you thumb in the round depression on the side. Works well for me.

The drawing on this page shows the different shaped lever cap clearly.

http://www.leevalley.com/en/wood/page.aspx?p=49708&cat=1,41182,52515

[Derek Cohen]

The ultimate shooting plane, in my opinion, is still the Stanley #51.

Here it is on the #52 chute board ...

http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a262/Derek50/Tools%20that%20I%20have%20made/Shooting%20board/Ramp%20versus%20Skew/Shootingonflat1.jpg

And here it is on my ramped shooting board ..

http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a262/Derek50/Tools%20that%20I%20have%20made/Shooting%20board/Ramp%20versus%20Skew/Shootingonramp1.jpg

http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a262/Derek50/Tools%20that%20I%20have%20made/Shooting%20board/Ramp%20versus%20Skew/Shootingonramp-detail1.jpg

Wait until LN bring lout theirs!

On the other hand, if you want to use a LAJ with a hotdog, here is my Veritas ...

http://www.inthewoodshop.com/ShopMadeTools/Building%20the%20Hotdog%20Mk%20II%20for%20the%20LV %20LA%20Jack%20pics_html_m45f4b59f.jpg

Make yours here: http://www.inthewoodshop.com/ShopMadeTools/Building%20the%20Hotdog%20Mk%20II%20for%20the%20LV %20LA%20Jack%20pics.html

Regards from Perth

Derek

[Zach England]

Much thanks, Derek. That is exactly the kind of tutorial I have been looking for all morning.

[lowell holmes]

I brought this thread back because some of the newbies might find it interesting.

[Doug Hepler]

Jim, et al

Here is my solution. I used a Stanley #4. The hotdog attaches to where the knob went. There is a groove cut in the hot dog for the side of the plane. It is comfortable enough to push and it has enough mass to finish most cuts if I don't try to take too much in one pass. Sorry for the ugly. My motto is "you don't need to look pretty to make pretty." In the spirit of full disclosure, shooting with a bench plane still was not satisfactory and I bought a LV shooting plane. 392425