Care of Tools

[Peter Gavin]

Hello. I'm a newbie on this site but I've been lurking enough to know I like what I see here. I'm presently the custodian of someone else's tools (which they inherited but since they live in a Chicago condo I graciously offered to store for them:) ) and am enjoying relearning some of the skills I developed in my father's workshop. More and more I've been grabbing the hand tools instead of turning on the power but last night I had a major dilemma. What can I do to make sure I'm not hurting the value of the tools I am only caretaker of. Specifically, I was about to take some steel wool and start scrubbing some rust off of an old hand saw when (thanks to reading the posts here) i decided I had better check what it was first. Almost unreadable under the rust it said "Disston" and there is a "95" in a logo plus some other text. Would it hurt the value of the saw if I scrubbed those markings off? Also there are some planes: 18" long with a corrugated bottem that say's "Stanley Tools" on the back handle and "Bailey" on the front bottom plate. Another plane that says "Miller Falls" on the blade locking mechanism that is 14" long. Another plane that says "Bailey No4" on the front of the bottom plate andis 6 1/2" long. What are your recommendations for caring for these tools as I realy would like to be able to use them.

Thanks

Peter Gavin

[Ken Fitzgerald]

Peter...Welcome to the 'Creek. I'm sure someone from the neander side will have the answer to your questions! Again...Welcome!

[Tyler Howell]

Welcome Peter,

Now if we work this right we will both come out AOK! Just tell your friend they disapeared and that will be the end of it.
Now from the sounds of it you have some real jewels there, Pictures would help. care and feeding is an art. Do a search on planes in the Neander section here. There are some great tutorials on this very thing. still a novice I've learned some great tricks for planes and chisels with lapping plates in a class I'm now taking.
I'm looking forward to the answers here too!
Again welcome to the Creek.

[Jerry Palmer]

Some pics would definitely be of help for identifying the vintage of the tools you described. As far as the saw is concerned, lots of great info at the http://www.disstonianinstitute.com/ on identifying and determining the age of Disston Saws.

For refurbinshing the saw as well as sharpening it for use, this site is great:

http://www.vintagesaws.com/

One technique for cleaning the rust off after blading it, that is not mentioned, but that I have found to work well and sometimes enhances the etch on the blade is to use vinegar instead of mineral spirits as lube for the sandpaper.

[John Miliunas]

So fine, I'm an electron killer. BUT, I can still "WELCOME" a new member, especially seeing as to how he's right in my "neighborhood"!!! :D Welcome to SMC, Peter! If you're looking for answers on most *any* woodworking tool or project, you've come to the right place! :) I'm not a Neander myself, but visit across the boards and have even picked up a hint or tip or two on "this side" of the WW platform. Come often, stay long and don't forget, we like pictures on *any* of the boards! :cool:

[Peter Gavin]

Thanks for your welcomes and advice. I'm going to go home now and cleane up the Diston "per instructions" and find out what I actually have. If I get a digital camera I'll post some pics of the tools as well as my current project.


Peter

[Fred Gorney]

Do the tools have any sentimental value to the owner? That could potentially be a bigger issue than the monetary value, which you would be in a much better position than us to judge.

[Dan Moening]

Would it hurt the value of the saw if I scrubbed those markings off?
For collectors, absolutely. Same is true for the logo decal on the plane tote (rear handle).

Care and feeding of antique tools is as simply as removing the existing rust and then preventing any future rust from forming.

WD40 and a light sanding with 220 grit wet/dry sandpaper, frequently wiped down with paper towels...works well enough...just enough to remove the rust...when the slurry turns from reddish-brown to brown to gray you're done...if the slurry is gray then you're removing metal.

Prevention can take many forms:
Vapor Corrosion Inhibitors (VCI) from manufactureres such as Bullfrog,
Sprays such as TopCote,
wipe ons like Camelia oil and paste wax.

Most of alll....learn to put a sharp edge on the blades and put 'em to use! :D

edit for courtesy: Welcome Aboard!

[Pam Niedermayer]

You want to be very careful sanding a saw blade since the logo is important to the saw's value. I'd recommend using a razor blade to lightly scrape off the first layer or two of rust, recommend per Todd Hughes on Woodcentral, then use a sanding block to lightly sand. You definitely want to keep the Disston etch.

Other tools are different. With chisels and plane blades, regular sharpening should do the job for you. Some chisel handles may need refurbishing/replacement and it's a bit tricky getting the handles and blades separated. With metal planes, first try soap and water, maybe one of the 3M abrasives. Whatever you do, you don't want to kill the japaning.

Pam

[Tom LaRussa]

Also there are some planes: 18" long with a corrugated bottem that say's "Stanley Tools" on the back handle and "Bailey" on the front bottom plate. Another plane that says "Miller Falls" on the blade locking mechanism that is 14" long. Another plane that says "Bailey No4" on the front of the bottom plate andis 6 1/2" long. What are your recommendations for caring for these tools as I realy would like to be able to use them.

Peter,

I know very little about saws, so I'll leave that to others, but I have been studying planes a bit lately, so I'll give you the dubious benefit of my studies.

The 18" long plane sounds like a No. 6, which is a "Fore" plane. Here is a link to a page with descriptions of the Stanley Bailey No. 4 and No. 6. (Note: The number 4 sounds strange -- it should be longer than 6 1/2".) http://www.supertool.com/StanleyBG/stan1.htm

The Millers Falls plane could be any one of a number of different models. This page might help you figure out which it is: http://www.public.coe.edu/%7Erroeder/main/bench/benchtable.htm

Getting back to the Stanley planes, you might be able to tell when they were made by using this page: http://www.hyperkitten.com/tools/stanley_bench_plane/dating/

Now then, about maintaining and using them... First a couple questions:

What condition are they in now? Are they heavily rusted, pristine clean, or what?

As somebody else asked, do the tools (in their present condition) hold deep sentimental value for the owner?

Would he/she mind if the tools were cleaned up a bit to make them more usable even if that made them less valuable to a collector?

[Erin Raasch]

I'm another newbie who's been lurking for awhile, I guess I can join the conversation, since I'm in the neighborhood. My husband and I have found ourselves in possession of a few old tools, and have been working on cleaning them up enough to make them usable. I'm not quite sure how it happened; it started out innocently enough, with a Millers Falls #9 that had been his father's. Next thing I knew, there was a Stanley Bailey #5C, a MF #22, a Fulton transitional, a Stanley 60 1/2 - well, you all know how that goes. Nice MF #18 just arrived in the mail today :)

I've got several planes in about every stage of clean-up, including a new-in-box Millers Falls #14. (Well, it's not quite new anymore - but it sure makes some nice shavings!) My husband Scott is the Keeper of the Disstons - he's cleaned up quite a few over the last several months.

We've been looking forward to meeting some other woodworkers in the area, but most everyone on these forums seems to live in Texas or New England. Give me a yell, maybe we can get together and exchange some tool-care tips.

Erin

[John Miliunas]

Erin, this is just getting totally ridiculous! Earlier today, we had Peter from Madison, now there's you & your hubby in Black Earth, Jeff Sudmeier in Arena and myself, holding up the West end out here in Bear Valley! Kripes, we can cover a line of about 40+miles and hit a Creeker about every 10! :D Too cool! I thought the guys in Texas and our Arkie buddies were the ones close to each other! Don't end there, neither. We've got Dale out in Peshtigo, Keith further up North and I know I've missed several others! The Wisconsin franchise of SMC is GROWING! This is neat! :)

Anyhow, I'm a true-blue electron killer, so I can't help much with the Neander side of things. BUT, welcome to SMC, all the same! :D Lots of super folks to share with and learn. Oh, and we ALL like pictures of projects, tool rebuilds, and the such! Again, welcome! Come often, stay long! :cool:

[Dean Baumgartner]

Erin, this is just getting totally ridiculous! Earlier today, we had Peter from Madison, now there's you & your hubby in Black Earth, Jeff Sudmeier in Arena and myself, holding up the West end out here in Bear Valley! Kripes, we can cover a line of about 40+miles and hit a Creeker about every 10! :D Too cool! I thought the guys in Texas and our Arkie buddies were the ones close to each other! Don't end there, neither. We've got Dale out in Peshtigo, Keith further up North and I know I've missed several others! The Wisconsin franchise of SMC is GROWING! This is neat! :)

Anyhow, I'm a true-blue electron killer, so I can't help much with the Neander side of things. BUT, welcome to SMC, all the same! :D Lots of super folks to share with and learn. Oh, and we ALL like pictures of projects, tool rebuilds, and the such! Again, welcome! Come often, stay long! :cool:


John,
Don't forget Mark way up there in Northern Wisconsin, me just west of Green Bay and we may even want to be real open minded and include those to the west of us like Tyler.

Dean

[John Miliunas]

John,
Don't forget Mark way up there in Northern Wisconsin, me just west of Green Bay and we may even want to be real open minded and include those to the west of us like Tyler.

Dean

No, I didn't forget you guys, though I know if I started listing everyone, I'd miss somebody. :o But yeah, you're right. This franchise is growing quite nicely! And sure, why not include our brethren to the West. There are actually quite a few reasonably close to WI over there. For that matter, there's a pretty strong contingent South of us, as well, though I'm not sure how many of those IL folks are real far South! :) Yup, it's starting to look like a Tri-state get-together should be considered! :) :cool:

[Dennis McDonaugh]

I'm not quite sure how it happened; it started out innocently enough, with a Millers Falls #9 that had been his father's. Next thing I knew, there was a Stanley Bailey #5C, a MF #22, a Fulton transitional, a Stanley 60 1/2 - well, you all know how that goes. Nice MF #18 just arrived in the mail today :)

Erin


That's the way it always starts. You think you can just own one, but you can't. Once you start you are hooked and sliding down the slippery slope! Pretty soon you are scrounging flea markets on the weekends and then its the ood antique store on your lunch hour. Its insidious. :)

[Bart Leetch]

Peter

Here is a way you can clean the rust off without damaging the tool.


http://antique-engines.com/electrol.asp

[Tyler Howell]

Cheese Everywhere Hijacking this thread.

Come on Vikings step up here!

[Erin Raasch]

<snip> Yup, it's starting to look like a Tri-state get-together should be considered! :) :cool:

Howdy, neighbors . . . good to meet you all! Yep, a MidWest Tool Fest sounds great . . . and we've got all winter to plan. As an extreme novice to both woodworking and hand tools, it's nice to know that others are at the same place on the learning curve as I am. Tyler, I've been following your adventures in Neander Land - sounds like you're having great fun and learning some priceless skills as well.

I've been working on a reproduction of a portable Shaker cabinet . . . about 36x8x9, and when finished it will have 7 drawers, perfect for all those odds and ends that are cluttering my workspace. I'll have the carcase and dividers completed in a week or two, the drawers will have to wait till Spring, since we're getting ready to close up the shop for the winter (no heat :( ).

Except for a couple of rip cuts on the table saw and some thickness planing to knock the stock down close to the 5/8" and 1/2" thicknesses that I used, it's all been done by hand. Right now I'm working on the finishing . . . BLO on the carcase, shellac on the dividers . . . patience, patience, patience . . . not my strong suit! :eek:

Erin

[Tyler Howell]

Welcome Erin,

We have a SMC get together tonight in the Minniapple. Looking forward to meeting some Creekers after the WWS.
Be glad to help out with the Midwest Area Shindig. But I'm beginning to think Midwest folks are like the people in Lake Wobegone.... Shy Persons:D .
Come on now folks, Still time to sign up.
Glad to have you in the Creek, Great bunch of folks here.

TJH

[Tyler Howell]

Then you know Erin, I'm the law. No slack even for Newbees. Justice for all. PIX please:D :D ,

[Peter Gavin]

Thanks to all for your help and welcomes. It looks like I started something in discovering central Wisconsin SMCers. I've determined my Disston to be a D-23 and I've gotten permission to feel free to use the tools as freely as I want. Of course, I've learned at this site that using tools and preserving their value isn't a mutually exclusive proposition. If there is a Wisconsin SMC get together please be sure to let me know.

Thanks again

Peter