General Finishes Polyacrylic or Target EM6000

[Ryan Eldridge]

Hi there all,

I am wanting to finish a chair using a water based topcoat. I was thinking of using either the general finishes PolyAcrylic or the Target EM6000.

I can get quarts to the General finishes product locally and start applying the finish this weekend.

I can purchase the Target EM6000 from a local shop but it will take the shop a week to get it in, and they can only get gallons. I do not see needing an entire gallon of finish in the next year.

Or I can order off the net and get a quart of the Target finish.

What would you guys choose?

Thanks.

[Thomas Pender]

Both and have use Minwax poly acrylic with with great success (and you can get it from the Borgs). I can hardly tell the difference. However, you can really only successfully spray the Target EM 6000 whereas the poly acrylics can be brushed on with good success (apply it in only one direction). I am at the point now where I use almost use nothing but the Target EM 6000 or a polyacrylic. I think if Gustav Stickley could have used it he would have. I do admit that if I have a large surface that spraying the EM6000 is the way to go (it self-levels well), but I have messed it up on occasion and it is harder to mess up brushed on polyacrylic.

I would try both - I ordered the Target online (just a quart) and had no problems. I really think that test panels make a difference. Another thing - give it two or three coats a let them cure for a few days. I also admit that it is our esteemed moderator, aka Jim Becker, who turned me on to Target and the polyacrylics and I owe him for it. :)

Tom

[Jim Becker]

No question that given the choice, I'd pick the EM6000 every time. There have been a few instances where for immediate needs, I've used a quart of Minwax Polycrylic in a pinch...it's not a horrible product and actually about the only thing with the Minwax name on it I'll use outside of the Antique Oil Finish (which is a varnish...) on turnings. But I've been a very satisfied user of Target products for years and feel very comfortable with a firm that specializes in and continually improves their water borne finishes. I generally order directly from Target (current discount code is JX10 for 30% off and a gallon of EM6000 will come to $30.80 shipped) unless I need tinting. In that case, I order from Jeff Jewitt at Homesteadfinishing.com.

[Ryan Eldridge]

Wow that is pretty resounding for the EM6000 I have read a lot about it and I am going to give it a try. Also, it looks like I will be buying a gallon even though I do not really need that much.

Right now with their promotion it is $30 for a gallon shipped or 27.50 for a quart shipped so I guess I will get some good spraying practice in with some of the extra product.

If anyone is in Boise, Id and needs some look me up.

Thank you for the recommendations.

[Doug Shepard]

... However, you can really only successfully spray the Target EM 6000 whereas the poly acrylics can be brushed on with good success (apply it in only one direction). ...

I recently used EM6000 for the first time and brushed it on with as good of results as I've gotten brushing Minwax Polycrylic so it can be done. I've used both foam and regular brushes in the past for the Polycrylic but did the EM6000 with a high quality nylon brush.

[O. Rob Anderson]

Hey Jim, can I use the Target EM6000 product on oil stained cabinets? I'm using the MW oil stain. Can you tint EM6000? Also, is it easier to spray than say a conversion varnish?


No question that given the choice, I'd pick the EM6000 every time. There have been a few instances where for immediate needs, I've used a quart of Minwax Polycrylic in a pinch...it's not a horrible product and actually about the only thing with the Minwax name on it I'll use outside of the Antique Oil Finish (which is a varnish...) on turnings. But I've been a very satisfied user of Target products for years and feel very comfortable with a firm that specializes in and continually improves their water borne finishes. I generally order directly from Target (current discount code is JX10 for 30% off and a gallon of EM6000 will come to $30.80 shipped) unless I need tinting. In that case, I order from Jeff Jewitt at Homesteadfinishing.com.

[Jim Becker]

Hey Jim, can I use the Target EM6000 product on oil stained cabinets? I'm using the MW oil stain.

Yes, with a barrier coat of de-waxed shellac as the "best practice" to insure proper adhesion. If the stain has cured fully...which can take months...you may be able to skip the shellac.


Can you tint EM6000? Also, is it easier to spray than say a conversion varnish?

Yes, you can tint EM6000. As to ease of spraying, it's super easy to spray...and clean up after. But when you say "conversion varnish", if you mean a solvent-based product, rather than the Target EM8000, I suspect the water borne product is going to be easier (and safer) for you to work with. Same goes for the EM2000 water borne alkyd varnish...sprays just as easy as EM6000, although it has a longer dry time between coats.

[Matt Meiser]

The EM2000 seems to be a great product. I'm a big fan of EM6000, but I suspect I'll pretty much be switching to 2000. I've got a sample of maple a friend of mine sprayed with 2000 after wiping on a coat of the Target WB shellac. It a perfect match to maple furniture I've previously finished with an oil-base product. I've also got a cherry sample I sprayed the same day that I think is a pretty good match to the cabinets I just did with an oil based finish, followed by the WB shellac, followed by EM6000, at least the color they were before darkening considerably after a couple months of sunlight.

The WB shellac is a nice product once you get the hang of it. Its "thinner than water" when you spray it so it takes practice to spray. You can also wipe it on nicely.

[Jim Becker]

Matt, the EM2000 is a very nice finish. Formerly called "Hybrivar", Jeff formulated it to provide the positive look of an oil based alkyd varnish with the ease of application that a water borne finish brings to the table. While he focused a lot on cherry (he showed me a number of samples at an industrial show in NJ a couple years ago), I can appreciate how it would work nicely on other species, too. I would definitely consider using it again on a project or three where it might present an advantage. That said, I really like how the EM6000 (and it's predecessor, USL) "act" and the quicker dry time between coats for that product. Do note that the EM2000 does have slightly more VOC...and a noticeable, but not obnoxious, odor after spraying.

[Matt Meiser]

When we were spraying it at a finishing workshop our club did I really didn't notice any slower drying. It definitely does have a different odor, but like you said, not obnoxious.

[Ryan Eldridge]

Well guys my wife got a kick out of me this weekend. Since I ordered the EM6000 (it shipped on Friday and will get here this coming up Friday), I decided to get a sprayer and practice a little bit.

I was going to get the Earlex 3000, I went to woodcraft and talked with one of the employees about the merits of it and the HV5000. He did not have any experience with the 3000 but liked the 5000 ... Well long story short he gave me 15% off since it was early in the morning and with that savings I decided to purchase the HV5000.

I used it to spray several test boards with shellac and it was fun, and quick. I was even able to get a seal coat of shellac on my rocking chair, I got one little run but other than that it was great to spray and so much quicker than brushing it was amazing.

Thanks for the help, and I am looking forward to spraying the EM6000.

[O. Rob Anderson]

Just spoke to Jeff and Homestead finishing. Jeff hooked me up just right to finish my kitchen cabinets. He suggested I use the EM2000 product for better durability with 1 coat of DW shellac tinted for my sealer. Bought the QS-600WB LVLP gravity gun as well. Jeff understood my needs right off the bat. He also carries the GF primer and black paint for my crown and vineer oak siding. Thanks for the heads up Jim!

[Jim Becker]

Rob, you're dealing with "da best" when you're working with Jeff. ;)