Really disappointed with Incra 1000SE

[Dan Friedrichs]

I got a new Incra 1000SE miter gauge for Christmas, and spent today playing with it. After all the hype I've read on this forum about this gauge, I'm really disappointed.

Below are some things that really bother me about this product:

1) In order to use the extended fence, you have to loosen a hex screw with an included screwdriver. I need to go find this screwdriver every single time I want to use the fence?!

2) The rulers are not affixed - they simply slide in a channel. I think I will have to be careful not to bump the gauge and accidentally shift one of the rules.

3) The rule on the extended fence reads upside-down. Incra apparently didn't want to print a rule that read right-to-left, so they took the standard left-to-right rule and slid it in upside down. How cheap!

4) The flip stop has two independant "arms". I think it would be convenient if they were some integer value of distance apart (so I could say, "Stop 1 is at 20" and stop 2 is at 24"). Unfortunately, Incra spaced them 3 26/32" apart. Why?!


Overall, I am not even remotely impressed with the design of this product. Had I purchased it myself (not been gifted it), I'd be returning it. I anticipated this would be a highly-accurate system to allow me to miter and crosscut to precise lengths with ease (ie - not making test cuts, not measuring and marking with a tape measure first, etc); instead, this seems like a kit of parts.

I would caution people to try one of these before they buy one. Perhaps it would work for your use, but it doesn't appear to fit mine.

[Stephen Edwards]

Thanks for the review. One of the great things about this forum, IMHO, are the tool reviews from woodworkers who actually have a tool that someone else may be considering purchasing.

[Vince Shriver]

Since you were gifted this thing, seems to me you can put it on the classified board and use that money to purchase something more to your liking, or ask where it was purchased and take it back. Pretty easy stuff here.

[Peter Aeschliman]

Most of the issues you state don't bother me much, except for the ruler issues. Why it's upside down and why it moves so easily is beside me. Those are two things they really should change, and I can't imagine it would cost them a ton of money either... they'd just have to change the extrusion so that it's flat on the top for an adhesive-backed ruler, and reprint rulers so they read correctly.

For such an expensive and generally well-made item, it's a bit of a head scratcher why they would go cheap on the ruler.

[Bruce Page]

I have the Incra 2000 that has to be partially disassembled and reassembled when switching miter slots – a nuisance. Its saving grace is that after initial setup, it is dead accurate. I also think the stop is more trouble than it is worth.
I don’t think they make the 2000 anymore…

[Prashun Patel]

I urge you to play with it a little more. I like it, and I find it to be very accurate.

I got used to the screwdriver - and even like it now. Mine hangs under my saw. A lot of people have replaced those screws with thumbscrews, though if it really chaps ya.

I agree the 'ruler' is a joke, but I never understood how that's supposed to work anyway, since as soon as you shift the miter angle, you change the distance to the blade. I measure from the blade each time with a real ruler.

The flip stop is awesome. I usually work with the both arms, but the independent arms allow you to utilize the max distance of the extension fence with the stop if you need to - instead of sacrificing that 2ish inches. That little microadjuster bar is great.

I'm building a rocking chair now that has some tricky angles and tight tolerances, and this thing has been very good at it.

My only wish is that the fence were a little higher to make clamping to it a little easier. I have an aux fence for it, but that prevents using the flip stop.

[Cary Falk]

Dan,
I am sorry you are disappointed with the Incra. My only complaint with it was the piece of angle steel that connects the fence to the head is not square and need to be shimmed on every gauge. You would think they would machine these instead of stamping. I don't use the rulers so I can't comment on that. There are adjustable pins on the flip stops so you can probably get an even number between the 2 if you wanted. I figure what ever the distance between them, what ar the odds it would be what you needed anyway. I believe there was a person on this forum that found a solution from MasterCarr for the cap screws so you don't have to use a wrench. All in all I think it is miles ahead of my OEM gauge.
Cary

[Bill Arnold]

...
Below are some things that really bother me about this product:

1) In order to use the extended fence, you have to loosen a hex screw with an included screwdriver. I need to go find this screwdriver every single time I want to use the fence?!

2) The rulers are not affixed - they simply slide in a channel. I think I will have to be careful not to bump the gauge and accidentally shift one of the rules.

3) The rule on the extended fence reads upside-down. Incra apparently didn't want to print a rule that read right-to-left, so they took the standard left-to-right rule and slid it in upside down. How cheap!

4) The flip stop has two independant "arms". I think it would be convenient if they were some integer value of distance apart (so I could say, "Stop 1 is at 20" and stop 2 is at 24"). Unfortunately, Incra spaced them 3 26/32" apart. Why?!


Overall, I am not even remotely impressed with the design of this product. Had I purchased it myself (not been gifted it), I'd be returning it. I anticipated this would be a highly-accurate system to allow me to miter and crosscut to precise lengths with ease (ie - not making test cuts, not measuring and marking with a tape measure first, etc); instead, this seems like a kit of parts.

I would caution people to try one of these before they buy one. Perhaps it would work for your use, but it doesn't appear to fit mine.

1. The same is true of the router fence I have. I don't have any issue keeping the accessories organized so I can find something when I need to re-configure the setup.

2. Aside from the ruler and template in my LS router system adjustment arm, I would never use the rulers you reference. Regardless of the system I might be using, I trust only my measuring tape to be exact.

3. I hadn't paid any attention to this, probably because I use a tape as I said in (2).

4. The flip stop is apparently designed around the coupler block and the "independent" arms just match that distance. The specific distance is immaterial since one arm will be used when setting lengths close to the blade and the other allows measurements at the full extent of the arm.

One can find fault with anything out there. For someone to have gifted you with this tool, they must have had some idea you wanted it.

[Cliff Holmes]

I need to go find this screwdriver every single time I want to use the fence?!

I keep mind on the saw with a RE magnet.


The rulers are not affixed That's one thing I really like about them, I can adjust the entire fence and then slide the rule into position. FWIW, I don't have any problems with them moving on their own.


The rule on the extended fence reads upside-down. Incra apparently didn't want to print a rule that read right-to-left, so they took the standard left-to-right rule and slid it in upside down. How cheap!

You should have gotten *two* rules, one L-R and one R-L, in the packaging


The flip stop has two independant "arms". I think it would be convenient if they were some integer value of distance apart (so I could say, "Stop 1 is at 20" and stop 2 is at 24"). Unfortunately, Incra spaced them 3 26/32" apart.

There are two small stop rods and one large one in the package. You can tie the arms together with the large one or use the arms independently with the small ones in each arm. And all the rods are adjustable, so they can be whatever distance apart you like within the length of the rod adjustment.

It seems you really need to spend some time looking over the owner's manual.

[Dan Friedrichs]

Wow - some rather adversarial reactions to my comments...

Cliff, I actually did NOT get a R-L and L-R rule in the package. And I am aware of the little rods (mine came pre-rusted for some reason), but I'm saying that I think it's poor design to place the stops such a strange distance apart.

Why, exactly, would I want to tie the two stops together? That is unclear.


I also want to affirm Cary's comments that the bracket connecting the fence to the head is not square, and needed shimming (difficult, since you have to get it shimmed perpendicular to the table and the blade simultaneously).


I'm just saying that, for my money, this is a poorly-designed product. I've seen woodworking products that offer better value and much better design.

[Michael Panis]

Wow....One of the interesting things about reviews is how two people can come away with such different impressions. I can't count the number of times that I've used my Incra 1000SE and said "Wow! I can't believe they thought of that!"

I'd encourage you to use it a little more. One thing that you'll find is that it remains dead-on time after time.

As for your concerns, here is my take on them...

1) The screwdriver
I assume they require the use of a tool because they were worried thumb screws might come loose. Perhaps they could have designed a tool that mounts to the gauge. Personally, I just leave the tool right near the mitre gauge.

2) Non-affixed rulers
I had the same concern at first. I expected the ruler to only be set once and then work like the one used by the tablesaw fence. Then I realized that since the whole fence is designed to slide relative to the mitre slot, a fixed ruler just wouldn't do the trick. I mainly use the rulers for relative measurements. I find they move when I want to move them, and stay put when they should.

3) Upside-down rule
Interesting point...I hadn't thought about this.

4) Flip stop arm spacing
Even if they were exactly 4" apart, how often would that be the distance you were looking for?
If you want to use the two arms as independent stops, use the steel bars to set the relative distance to exactly what you want.

Anyway, that's been my experience...

---Mike

[Bill Arnold]

... It seems you really need to spend some time looking over the owner's manual.

Amen!!! ;)

(I just hate it when I "know" I have something figgered out, then take time to read the manual and see where I screwed up!)

[glenn bradley]

Like me, it sounds like your main disappointment is with the fence parts. I just have the V-27 which is a great little gauge. I bought the telescoping fence direct from Incra. The telescoping part was far from even with the main fence portion. They sent me a new one and were so helpful and nice that I hate to say that it was not much better. A bit of foil tape and some fiddling about and I had it dialed in as long as I don't extend or retract it. So, it is now a fixed length, extended about 5 inches.

I capped the hexbolts with these to avoid the wrench:
137326 but feel they really should have been included. A drop of crazy glue stopped the tape wandering. All in all the gauge is great and I trust it completely. The fence and the attachments should be wayyyy better for the price.

[Matt Day]

I love mine, and I am not concerned about the issues you listed. As much as I would like to have the ruler that would be accurate, I don't rely on it at all. I change from the right to left miter slot occassionally, and use it on my router table too so I move the fence around a lot.

Though I agree - an upside down ruler that isn't adhered at all (though you don't want it permanent so you can move the fence right?) isn't that great. I don't mind the oddly spaced stops and in fact have never noticed that.

What it does excellently though is get perpendicular to the miter slot, eliminate slop in the miter slot, and adjust easily to any angle you need, acurately.

Good review though. I always look for the negative reviews on sites such as Amazon, and this will be good info for some future buyers.

[Dave Lehnert]

I never notice the ruler being upside down. Now you are going to make be go to the shop and look.

[Keith Christopher]

I would recommend an osborne gauge. I was choosing between the incra and a few others, and went with the osborne. I love it. it's all about what you can relate to and utilize.

[Bill Huber]

Dan, I agree with you 100%, I had one for a week and sold it.

Why is the thing so bulky, you put a 3/4 inch MDF fence with sandpaper on it so things wouldn't slip and it is just so bulky it is not very pleasing to use.

Why should I have to readjust it every time I want to tilt the blade over to a 45.

Even with the screws that Glenn used they are not very easy to adjust.

I will keep the old EB-3 and love it.

[Jason White]

I'm not crazy about mine, either.

Jason



I got a new Incra 1000SE miter gauge for Christmas, and spent today playing with it. After all the hype I've read on this forum about this gauge, I'm really disappointed.

Below are some things that really bother me about this product:

1) In order to use the extended fence, you have to loosen a hex screw with an included screwdriver. I need to go find this screwdriver every single time I want to use the fence?!

2) The rulers are not affixed - they simply slide in a channel. I think I will have to be careful not to bump the gauge and accidentally shift one of the rules.

3) The rule on the extended fence reads upside-down. Incra apparently didn't want to print a rule that read right-to-left, so they took the standard left-to-right rule and slid it in upside down. How cheap!

4) The flip stop has two independant "arms". I think it would be convenient if they were some integer value of distance apart (so I could say, "Stop 1 is at 20" and stop 2 is at 24"). Unfortunately, Incra spaced them 3 26/32" apart. Why?!


Overall, I am not even remotely impressed with the design of this product. Had I purchased it myself (not been gifted it), I'd be returning it. I anticipated this would be a highly-accurate system to allow me to miter and crosscut to precise lengths with ease (ie - not making test cuts, not measuring and marking with a tape measure first, etc); instead, this seems like a kit of parts.

I would caution people to try one of these before they buy one. Perhaps it would work for your use, but it doesn't appear to fit mine.

[Larry Frank]

Some people love it and others don't. I do not have any problem with using the hex screw driver as it keeps things tight. I know that others really dislike this part. I guess this is why there are several different ones on the market. If I had to replace mine, I would buy another one.

I never use the rule as it is not accurate enough. I measure and mark each piece to get exact cuts. The stops do work very well for cutting several parts to length.

The only thing that I dislike is that I have not always been smart enough to readjust the fence after making an angle cut and have put a couple of knicks in the fence. I have read that I am not the only one to do this.

[Paul Ryan]

I have learned not to trust the rulers on most tools. They are mearly a guide. The tape on my table saw is always right on but I still don't trust it. I either use my tape measure which I have tested and is accurate, or the wixey on my fence. When using the saw for mutiple cuts at different lengths I use the wixey, it has never failed me. As far as the loose tapes on the miter guage. I really dont use them because I still use my tape or the stops on the guage. It is still night and day better than a stock guage.

[Cliff Furman]

I have the 1000SE and love it. I had a magnet with a mounting plate with a hole in it. I removed the left screw on the protracter scale and bolted the magnet there. It holds the hex driver when I'm not using it.

I use the flip stop as a single stop all the time. I really like the micro adjuster for sneaking up on a cut.

The flip stop can be mounted to allow an aux 3/4" fence to be used.

[David Peterson MN]

I am very happy with the 1000hd I recently got. It has been very accurate. I am constantly using it. The only disappointment is need the screwdriver but I just keep it close by so no big deal.

[Tom Veatch]

I got a new Incra 1000SE miter gauge for Christmas, and spent today playing with it. After all the hype I've read on this forum about this gauge, I'm really disappointed.

Below are some things that really bother me about this product:

1) In order to use the extended fence, you have to loosen a hex screw with an included screwdriver. I need to go find this screwdriver every single time I want to use the fence?!

Mine lies in the trough between the front of the saw and the front fence support bar. Perfect fit, out of the way and very convenient.

2) The rulers are not affixed - they simply slide in a channel. I think I will have to be careful not to bump the gauge and accidentally shift one of the rules.

Not a useful feature. Every time you change the miter angle or shift the fence, that dimension changes anyway. Better to use a reliable steel ruler to measure the cut.

3) The rule on the extended fence reads upside-down. Incra apparently didn't want to print a rule that read right-to-left, so they took the standard left-to-right rule and slid it in upside down. How cheap!

See above.

4) The flip stop has two independant "arms". I think it would be convenient if they were some integer value of distance apart (so I could say, "Stop 1 is at 20" and stop 2 is at 24"). Unfortunately, Incra spaced them 3 26/32" apart. Why?!

Can't speak for Incra on the why, but the flip stop has a metal rod that either ties the two arms together or can be adjusted to provide a specific offset distance between the two arms. I find that more useful than a single fixed difference.

Overall, I am not even remotely impressed with the design of this product. Had I purchased it myself (not been gifted it), I'd be returning it. I anticipated this would be a highly-accurate system to allow me to miter and crosscut to precise lengths with ease (ie - not making test cuts, not measuring and marking with a tape measure first, etc); instead, this seems like a kit of parts.

I doubt there's any product that every individual finds satisfactory. If you find it less than desirable, try converting it to cash and getting one that is a better match for your needs. Lots of gifts get returned during this part of the year.

I would caution people to try one of these before they buy one. Perhaps it would work for your use, but it doesn't appear to fit mine.

Always good advice.



Comments interspersed above.

[Bob Wingard]

HRUMFF !! You couldn't please some people if you hung 'em with a brand-new rope .. .. ..


Seriously .. the 1000SE has worked just fine for me and I've had it for several years now. It just depends on how you use it and how it works for you. Seek out a friend or fellow woodworker and ask to try his stuff .. in HIS shop, of course .. and evaluate how it would work for your applications. Nothing like a hands-on feeling for a tool before making a purchase decision.

I've got a big Exactor sliding table that has been dead on every time I've checked it, but when doing small, precision cuts, I keep going back to the 1000SE .. it just doesn't FEEL like something that big can be accurate on small, precision cuts .. but it is. It's all a state-of-mind coupled with (probably prejudiced) personal preferences.

[mreza Salav]

1) In order to use the extended fence, you have to loosen a hex screw with an included screwdriver. I need to go find this screwdriver every single time I want to use the fence?!


This is my only complaint about it.



2) The rulers are not affixed - they simply slide in a channel. I think I will have to be careful not to bump the gauge and accidentally shift one of the rules.
It's good that it is his way. If you want to use it on the left miter gauge or right you want to replace the ruler accordingly.



3) The rule on the extended fence reads upside-down. Incra apparently didn't want to print a rule that read right-to-left, so they took the standard left-to-right rule and slid it in upside down. How cheap!
As I said, if you use it on the left miter gauge it is not upside down,
perhaps they could put in two of these rulers...



4) The flip stop has two independant "arms". I think it would be convenient if they were some integer value of distance apart (so I could say, "Stop 1 is at 20" and stop 2 is at 24"). Unfortunately, Incra spaced them 3 26/32" apart. Why?!
I have tied them together and didn't feel the need to use both of them.

It's a fine piece of equipment and IMO it's well thought as well, but not everybody might like it.

[Bob Wingard]

The only thing on mine that I didn't care for was the socket head screws and the need to keep the wrench handy. The handle on the wrench stripped, so I replaced both screws with ratchet-style clamps, and all is well. I have since "discovered" those little cam-style clamps from Rockler, and have been putting them on just about everything I own.

I just checked, and they have 'em on sale .. 4 clamp assemblies for about $9.00 .. .. .. your choice 1/4-20 or 5/16-18

http://www.rockler.com/product.cfm?page=10602&filter=cam

[Allan Froehlich]

I have an Incra 1000SE as well.

I found this tool difficult to understand when I first purchased it but soon found many of its awkward attributes to be very useful. I'll disect some earlier posts:

Upside down ruler: mine does not have this. Call them up, they are friendly.
Ruler moves: I wedged a tiny piece of sawdust under it and now it is stationary

Flip-stop arms: a diamond in the rough! That bar joining the two arms has lots of adjustment potential. It is very useful when you want to trim both ends of a length of lumber. I usually cut one side square with the more distant arm down and the metal rod adjust to lenght and then drop the closer arm down to make the final cut. This is especially useful when the end of the board has rough cuts and you might trim a couple inches from both ends. It is also nice when cutting shoulders for mortises.

Hex-screws: I never questioned these. In fact, I prefer them to adjusting those little knurled thumb screws. I feel like I have greater control.

Slide Extension: I calibrated the extension so that when the part containing the arms was placed on the zero (0) on the ruler of the top of the extension, the lower rule would give the proper lenght.

Angle bracket not true 90 degrees: I determined it to be about 0.1 degrees off center, but I figured it was due to my Crapsman table saw and not the guage.

Over all, the Incra 1000SE helped me bring my woodworking to a new level through improved miters.

[Steve Prill]

My only issue with the 1000SE is that the fence is so slippery that the pieces being cut tend to creep along the fence while cutting--especially on angled cuts. Any ideas how to prevent the wood from moving? I put an aux fence on that has sandpaper on it to stop the movement, but as stated by someone else this eliminates being able to use the stop and makes the assembly awkward.

Steve

[Denny Rice]

I would recommend an osborne gauge. I was choosing between the incra and a few others, and went with the osborne. I love it. it's all about what you can relate to and utilize.

+1 on the Osborne! I love mine.

[Wayne Cannon]

Yes, yes, yes, and yes. I agree. That's why mine collects dust and my Woodhaven and Kreg (almost identical) get all the use.

[Mike Heidrick]

Dan, if you want a couple of those cap screws PM me your address. I bought the bag full from MC Master Carr.

[Prashun Patel]

My only issue with the 1000SE is that the fence is so slippery that the pieces being cut tend to creep along the fence while cutting--especially on angled cuts. Any ideas how to prevent the wood from moving? I put an aux fence on that has sandpaper on it to stop the movement, but as stated by someone else this eliminates being able to use the stop and makes the assembly awkward.

Steve

Steve- Put some PSA sandpaper right on the face of the fence. You don't need much, one or two swaths of 3" wide 150g will do the trick.

As for the criticisms of the gauge being out of square, I don't understand. The gauge is easily calibrated to the blade. I did that once and it's stayed true.



Seems like a lot of the gauges out there WILL do the job; it's about what you like.

[Bill Huber]

As for the criticisms of the gauge being out of square, I don't understand. The gauge is easily calibrated to the blade. I did that once and it's stayed true.

It is not the squareness to the blade it is the squareness to the top of the saw that I had a problem. It was not hard to fix but it still should have been right to start with.

[Eric Gustafson]

I have the Osbourne and the Incra 3000se. (I also have the Incra miter 5000.) I do not even use the Osborne anymore. I prefer Incra's flip stop to Osborne's for accuracy and convenience. Recently, I dropped my Incra 3000 gauge. :eek: I was in the middle of a major shop overhaul and wouldn't need it for awhile, so I put a "needs calibration" sticker on it so I would not trust it for the next use. When I finally checked it it, it was right on. I can always trust my Incra miter to give me an accurate angle. (I don't advise the drop test, though!) :o

One thing that makes the Incra unique is the 1/32" incremental teeth on the flip stop and fence. Once set, you can cut predictable lengths without even touching your tape measure. This is how the rulers become useful for dead on accuracy until you need to extend the fence. Try doing that with the Osbourne! I keep the allen wrench in a drawer right by the saw for extending the fence so this never bothers me, it is always where I expect it to be.

I don't know how the Incra can be described as poorly designed. It is accurate and repeatable. The flipstop has zero slop. Plus, it costs less than what I paid for the Osbourne, which does not have anywhere near the features.

[Josh Brouse]

Can't comment about the Incra as I have the EB-3 and love it.

Fast to zero and dead on.

"Presets" for the common angels (Incra looks like it has more "presets").

Fast change from one side of the blade to the other.

Didn't notice till after I had it .. but .. Norm uses it !!!!!!!!!!!!

Best of all I got it for free when I bought a 15" powermatic planer from a guy. I asked if he would "throw" it in. He said yes ... SCORE

I don't understand why everyone doesn't have a dodge ram truck like mine. :)

But like all things in life, personal preference trumps all.

Good luck in finding "your" miter gauge.

[Kyle Iwamoto]

How much do you want for it?:)