Pen question for you learned gentilemen

[Ken Garlock]

This afternoon LOML and I drove over to a nursery that we frequently buy from to see the pens made by Neil Sperry (http://neilsperry.com/pages/neils-handmade-pens.html). Neil is one of the top gardening expert in Texas. He publishes a gardening magazine, and has a weekly radio program.

Neil has also been a pen turner for over 10 years. Today he was selling pens to benefit a local school in McKinney TX. He has access to may types of woods around Texas, being a well known gardener and graduate of Texas A&M. He also buys wood from Gilmer up in Portland OR. He sends the wood out to be "stabilized" after which he cuts his individual blanks. Some times he has his blanks dyed when being stabilized.

The question for you gentlemen follows. He said that he has $65 in the making of each pen. I don't know what it costs to have wood stabilized, and don't know of any company that does it. Since any dying of the wood penetrates the entire blank, I suspect the process is similar to making pressure treaded outdoor wood. The thing I am puzzled about is the 'pen kits' he uses. The mechanism is far superior to those available from our typical venders like Packard, and The wood turner catalog. While it is difficult to describe the mechanism after the pen is assembled, I did notice that the pen clip is held in place by a tiny cap that screws into the end of the mechanism, something I had not yet encountered. So, good people, where does one obtain these higher quality pen kits? Neil says he buys them in lots of 1000.

Since he was at the garden nursery to sell pens, I really didn't get a chance to quiz him. OH yes, he was selling individual pens for $195.00 each. and people were buying them up as if they were a rare prize.

[Kyle Iwamoto]

Wow, $195. Most impressive...... They must be very beautiful. I had a hard time selling mine for 15 bucks..... Therefore I must suck. :eek:

[Jason Clark2]

Outwardly they appear to be basic European kits from Craft Supplies.

http://www.woodturnerscatalog.com/store/Pen_Making___Ballpoint_Pen_Kits___European_Pen_Kit ___euro_pen?Args=

I can't imagine his cost per blank is more than $10 and if I'm right about the kit they should be somewhere around $6 each for 100+. Even if we double my estimate on the blank and the kit we're still only at 1/2 of what he claims to have in each pen. Sounds to me like he's selling fertilizer in addition to pens.

Jason

[Allen Neighbors]

I can't answer that question - about where to get those certain kits that Neil buys, but some better kits are still available through PSI, Packard, and CSUSA. I know a pen turner in Canada that only buys high-end kits, and sells many of his (through galleries) for over $1000 ea.
I would have to have a better market, to afford some of those high end kits. I buy the regular kits, finish with superglue, and sell in craft shows, and by word of mouth, for 20 to 50 bucks apiece (depends on the material used).

[Ken Fitzgerald]

Ken,

Go to CSUSA and look at their rollerball kits. The Emporer kit goes for $50.

The clip being held on by a threaded cap is dependent upon the pen style. For example, the Euro style pen sold by CSUSA functions exactly like you described and yet it is not really an expensive pen.

While I have never had pen blanks stabilized, I have turned them. Yes, the stabilizing liquid penetrates the grain as you suggest.

My unsuccessful attempt at turning some corncob pens was impeded by the stabilizer not fully penetrating the pen and my not realizing I might have to stop and stabilize the material. Oh well! I used to be blonde before I turned white and it started receding.:rolleyes:

One thing my wife and I noticed, when I bought the more expensive pen kits, the mechanisms and materials were, in fact, of a much higher grade than I'd experienced with the cheaper pens.

In fact, the few times I bought pen kits that were 1/2 off and later discontinued, I found out why they were cheap and being discontinued as it was nearly impossible for me with my meager pen turning skills, to get one to successfully turn out. 20% success isn't good but that's what I got on one particular pen style that was on the market for a very short period of time. I'm sure others with more experience and skills could have had better success rate.

[Mike Wenman]

Not sure where he gets his mechanisms from and that can raise the price depending on whether it is an emperor or a slim line. The price he pays for stabilization and shipping is unknown, but as for the rest of it, the amount a person asks for a pen in many aspects, is based on what they feel their time and effort in turning, assembly, fit and finish is worth.

Have read that there is a gentleman in Japan that only does 1 or 2 pens a year that are made out of bamboo and will clear, easily, $2500.00 a pen. Granted it is some rare type of bamboo and he's only using a foot of it total, but still 2500.00. WOW!

[David Drickhamer]

For information on stabilizing contact Constant at http://www.lazerlinez.com/
Dave

[David E Keller]

I think that seems like a pretty steep price for the pens posted on the front of his website. I agree that CSUSA has the nicest kits I've come across with the emporer kit being their highest priced kit at about 50 bucks. You can buy stabilized blanks from Arizona Silhouette for about 5 or 6 bucks apiece. That with shipping, glue, sandpaper, etc probably gets you to $65, but the kits he has pictured are no where near that expensive... Besides, if he's buying 1000 at a time, he ought to get a pretty sizable discount per kit. That being said, more power to the guy if he can get 200 dollars a pop for those pens.

If you are just looking for a pen with a screw cap to hold the clip, the standard cigar kit fits the bill. You can swap out the refill with a gel roller for a few bucks, and you'd have my pen for daily use.

If you want to see some really creative pens and fantastic finishes, I'd recommend you stop by penturners.org from time to time. There are also some nice tutorials in the library section there.

[Bernie Weishapl]

I must say he doesn't have a whole lot invested in those pens. If he is buying them 1000 at a time I'll almost bet he is getting them for $4 or $5 each. The most expensive Euro I have seen in Titanium gold was $9.50. Most expensive stabilized blank I bought was $12. I just can't imagine him having more than $22 to $25 in each pen. But more power to him if he can sell them for that. I couldn't even come close.

[Kenneth Whiting]

At the end of Barry Gross's Pen Making DVD he shows his display setup and talks about some of his pens. All of his sets(pen and case) were from $175 to $225. I don't know where these guys come up with those numbers, but if they can get away with it more power and money to them. I figure they are selling the signature on the pen more than the pen.

[Paul Atkins]

The all look the same to me, except the wood choice. Actually sort of boring. I guess they must write nice. Do they have spell check? Ok, I've never turned a pen except for a Bic pen refill, so I might not know what I'm talking about.

[Norm Zax]

Has anyone considered the possibility that by "costs" he has added lathe, tools, material, rent, electricity and work? That may add another 10 bucks each... assuming you buy any new tool that comes out, experiment with finishes...
I gotta stop day dreaming.

[Brian Effinger]

I think there is 3 reasons why he gets as much as he does for pretty basic pens.
First - the money is going to some sort of charity or cause. People pay more when the money is going to something other than someone's pocket.
Second - The guy appears to be famous in his little corner of the world.
And last - some of the wood he uses is from rare, or specific trees. I saw lumber from trees at the Alamo, that 30,000 New Zealand wood and a tree at Texas A&M.

Just my 2 cents, and if he can command these prices, good for him. I won't be buying one though. ;)

[James Carmichael]

The demand and $195 price tag isn't the pens (though I'm sure they're nice), but who turned them.

Yes, he is a Texas legend.

LOML is an Aggie and Neil Sperry fan. A few years ago, some of his pens were being auctioned, including one turned from the Aggie Oak. I don't think bids of less than four-figures were even being accepted.

Moral of the story: if you want to get 2-bills apiece for your pens, become famous first, or: approach a celeb who will lend their brand to your pens.

Ah, Pen-turning with the Stars;)

[Ken Garlock]

Yes, I think James has pretty well hit the nail on the head, being well known and using woods from historical places. Of course, anything from Texas A&M is historical, just ask any ex student.;)

I was thinking that the high cost of making the pens was due to stabilizing the blanks, and pen kits. I am now thinking it is more of an implicit value added tax, something to prepare for those retirement years.:rolleyes: But, I don't begrudge Neil his profit, he has a lot irons in the fire and works hard.

Thank you all for your comments. I have learned a lot and have some new avenues to to pursue in the ever changing world of pen kits.

[Mauricio Ulloa]

Hey,

I'm selling the lower end stuff from $15 to $40 and the high end from $100 to $150. I personally prepare my own blanks out of cocobolo logs that I get in my country.

To be honest with you, I don't get to sell much of the high end....

[Mark Hix]

If he adds his materials, pays his blank assembler, his turner and his finisher and his marketing costs, he may very well have that much in cost, assuming he is using his rate as a public speaker to establish the price. Each of those jobs has to be completed before he sells a pen.

Is he trading on his name? I would if I could.

The uniqueness of some of the blank material plays into it too.

If your fit and finish are perfect on a pen that you have $30 invested in plus your skills/time, you can get $200 or more in the right market. He has a list of the locations he will be at on his website. They are all retail nurseries. The customers will all recognize his name.

Looks to me like he put alot of thought into his plan and is making it work.