Motor upgrade for lathe

[Raymond Sprouse]

First off, sorry about my ignorance.

I've been doing a lot of research on lathe mods. One thing that I would like to do is upgrade the motor on my lathe. I see that a lot of people online have mentioned using dc motors and pwm's from treadmills. I concidered this method for a while, but I think I want to go with the 3ph 2-3hp 220 vac motor and variable frequency drive. I have spent a lot of time searching for a motor and vfd online and have run into a few questions.

1. Most vfd's advertised say the max hp for the motor that they can run. I am guessing that is the max amps the vfd puts out?
2. If your got a 3hp vfd, I assume you could use say a 2hp motor with it?
3. The output freq for the vfd is a range. I have seen some say 0-60, 0-400, or one that said 5-68. I may be a little off on the numbers. Am I correct in the assumption that the hertz is what determines the rpm on the motor? If so, then a vfd that puts our 0-60hz would have an rpm range from 0-X rpm?
4. Most vfd I have seen have a forward and reverse option. Does this require a certain type of ac motor for both directions?
5. I have read that some motors require a capacitor start. Is that something that a vfd is able to do?

I have many more questions, but I'll leave it at these for now. It seems the more I read, the more questions come up.

If anyone has done an upgrade like this, please let me know what would be a good motor/vfd would be and a possible source. A lot of people talk about ebay and this online surplus store (https://www.surpluscenter.com/home.asp).

Any information would be greatly appreciated.

[Skip Spaulding]

Ray, I converted my Nova 1624, went with 2hp/3phase and 2hp rated vfd. I probably spent more than I needed but I am very happy so far. I used the bowl saver (McNaughton) the other day on some green cherry. Very smooth, did not have to change belt position. So far I have run with the belt in the 1020rpm set up, about middle of my of my pulleys. Rpm on my display reads 0-2700 when running, I very seldom turn at top or bottom end. I feel going from 11/2 to 2hp was well worth it and just turning a dial for speed change is a real pleasure!
I hope to try some large HF's after the holidays. Will try and keep you posted.
Have a great Christmas! or Happy Holiday!
Skip

[Alex Shanku]

Raymond,

I have a Delta 1460 powered with a small 3/4hp 3ph motor controlled by a VFD.

I think that this is probably the best buy in small VFD's today.

http://www.factorymation.com/s.nl/it.A/id.198/.f

Great product and warranty.

Simple to set up. I have a 10K (I think) pot. mounted to control the freq. and vary the lathe speed.

I dont use forward/reverse much while turning, so I still control that manually through the vfd controls on the unit.

In addition to the responses you will get on this forum, you may want to make your way over to OWWM.org and search the forum, there are some very good posts about setting up 3ph motors and freq drives. Included also are some excellent wiring diagrams, which I found helpful.

[Jake Helmboldt]

Ray, I converted my Nova 1624, went with 2hp/3phase and 2hp rated vfd. I probably spent more than I needed but I am very happy so far. I used the bowl saver (McNaughton) the other day on some green cherry. Very smooth, did not have to change belt position. So far I have run with the belt in the 1020rpm set up, about middle of my of my pulleys. Rpm on my display reads 0-2700 when running, I very seldom turn at top or bottom end. I feel going from 11/2 to 2hp was well worth it and just turning a dial for speed change is a real pleasure!
I hope to try some large HF's after the holidays. Will try and keep you posted.
Have a great Christmas! or Happy Holiday!
Skip

Skip, how much did it cost for the conversion? I assume you still have the full functionality of the swivel head and such?

[Paul Atkins]

Thanks Alex. I am about to convert my 9' lathe to variable speed control. This looks like the ticket.

[Reed Gray]

It might be worth talking to Brent English of Robust lathes about the 'Vector' drive he is using. I don't know if he would sell the drive and converter, but he probably knows more than most of us about it. There was a thread about it a few days ago about the Robust Liberty lathe.

robo hippy

[Dennis Ford]

If your got a 3hp vfd, I assume you could use say a 2hp motor with it?
That is correct.
Am I correct in the assumption that the hertz is what determines the rpm on the motor? If so, then a vfd that puts our 0-60hz would have an rpm range from 0-X rpm?
Your assumption is correct, motor speed is roughly proportional to the frequency. The speed range of any particular motor depends on its design. At 60hz, some motors run ~3500 rpm, some run ~1750 and some run ~1160. These are called two pole, four pole or six pole motors. Most lathes use four pole motors (1750 rpm @ 60hz). My homemade lathe has a six pole motor (more torque but less speed).

Select a motor that fits your lathe, consider;
* mounting
* shaft size (if the motor "frame size" is the same, shaft size will match)
* rpm
* a motor that is not "inverter duty" will eventually be damaged by voltage spikes from the VFD. IMHO most of us will turn for years before this is a problem.

Three phase motors are easily reversed, nothing special required.

Some single phase motors are "capacitor start", three phase motors are not. Single phase motors will not work with a VFD.

[Chris Haas]

pay attention to the vfd input requirements.

NOT ALL VFD'S TAKE SINGLE PHASE AND MAKE IT THREE PHASE!!!

a lot of people think this, but that isnt the case. in fact most i've come across take 230v three phase and make it 230v or 460v 3 phase with variable frequency. thats why you see the hz outputs varing sooooo much.

now on to my next point. do you have a vfd yet? i'm working with an electrician that is going to provide and pre program a 3hp single phase to 3 phase vfd for my specific motor and if you pm me, i can supply you with his info. he is not only reasonable in price, but the cheapest you will find periord.

[Raymond Sprouse]

Thanks for all the feedback. That cleared up a lot for me. Alex, thanks for the link. That vfd looks good. I looked through that companies motors too. That be a one stop shop. Thanks again everyone.

[Skip Spaulding]

Jake, to answer your question, conversion was about $575.00. I ordered through FactoryMation. Motor is 2hp WEG premium efficiency cast iron, drive is Teco 7300CV. I also ordered parts to build remote (cost extra) but have found controls on the VFD are working great. Yes I still have full use of all features on the Nova. Used my existing pulleys, but did have motor pulley reamed out to fit new motor shaft. I am sure I probably could have gone with cheaper motor and drive but so far I really enjoy my set up.

[Raymond Sprouse]

I found this motor (http://www.factorymation.com/s.nl/it.A/id.58197/.f) and this vfd (http://www.factorymation.com/s.nl/it.A/id.198/.f). What do you all think?

[Chris Haas]

this (http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&Item=360209423814&Category=78192&_trkparms=algo%3DLVI%26its%3DI%26otn%3D2) vfd was my second choice, it will work fine for you too. my first choice was a used one so there is no more of them. look for a 3 hp 3 phase motor too. cant beat the prices.

[Bob Bergstrom]

When I was turning outboard up to 24" on my Delta 450. I found the limiting factor was belt slippage more than any lack of power. I used spray belt dressing trying to contend with the slippage. It was a two belt system with a shreve pulley. If you lathe has a good way to tighten the belt it may not be a concern with a 3 hp. motor. My powermatic 3520 has a ribbed belt and a tension lever which really helps delivering the power to the head stock.

[Raymond Sprouse]

Chris, I tried your link but it takes me to ask.com. Sorry. And do you mean my pick for motor/vfd was your second choice?

[Raymond Sprouse]

Bob, thanks for the belt slip tip. That was my first thought too. But my motor sound changes when mine bogs down.

[Chris Haas]

no, your choice isnt my second, the vfd in my post was. i think i fixed the link.

[Raymond Sprouse]

Ok, it's working now. That looks like a good one. I'll keep an eye on it. Thanks.

[Dave Schell]

Raymond, I went through this process when I was building up my barebones Vicmarc lathe. One thing I learned from researching alot of VFDs is that some come with rather sparse, technical documentation for programming the drive and some come with very clear and understandable documentation. In the end, I went with a Hitachi drive primarily because it had documentation I knew I could understand. Most of these manuals are online so you can read them ahead of time before buying.

If you search this forum for "barebones vicmarc" you will find the thread I started documenting my entire build, including the exact motor and drive I used, prices, and how I programmed it, including wiring in a remote control box (a good thing).

Good luck. Dave

[Dave Mueller]

Raymond,
I bought the same VFD as shown in your earlier post and have been very pleased with it. There are some other VFDs called "sensorless vector" which go through a self-tuning measurement and then automatically adjust for that motor to provide a torque boost at the low speeds, which is what the Australian Vicmarc and the Robust use, however, I have not felt a need for it.

I did reprogram my VFD to go to 90 Hz or 150% of the base motor frequency of 60 Hz. That means my 1800 RPM rated motor maximum is now 2700 RPM. The spindle is the same RPM, since I used a 1:1 pully ratio. I checked with the motor manufacturer and he said that it is OK to run it at 150% but not to go higher. I think it is a function of motor design.

Having said all that, my homemade lathe goes from about 40 RPM (I also programmed the lower frequency) to 2700 RPM without a belt change. Although the torque at 40 RPM is pretty low, I only use it for sanding. As soon as I speed up to about 100 RPM, I have never been able to stall it and it is a 2 HP motor. If you buy the FM50 controller and have any problems programming it, drop me an e-mail through the Creek and I'll help if I can.

Good luck - it's not as hard as it sounds.
Dave

[Raymond Sprouse]

Dave Schell, thanks for the tip. I'll research the manual. Also, great job on your build. I read over the thread today. Looks like a nice lathe.

Dave Bryan, That is comforting to here of someone else with the same VFD. It sound good. I was hoping to get somewhere near 50 rpm on the low end. Thanks for the programing help. I will definitely keep you in mind when I get my supply's. Do you have any pics of your homemade lathe?

[Bob Borzelleri]

Jake, to answer your question, conversion was about $575.00. I ordered through FactoryMation. Motor is 2hp WEG premium efficiency cast iron, drive is Teco 7300CV. I also ordered parts to build remote (cost extra) but have found controls on the VFD are working great. Yes I still have full use of all features on the Nova. Used my existing pulleys, but did have motor pulley reamed out to fit new motor shaft. I am sure I probably could have gone with cheaper motor and drive but so far I really enjoy my set up.

Skip...

Do you have any photos of your conversion? Also, I couldn't find a single phase 2 hp WEG premium efficiency cast iron motor on the FM website. Do you have a model number or are you using 3 phase?

...Bob

[Raymond Sprouse]

Anybody know of a site I can find some good 3 step pulley's? The motor I ordered takes a 7/8" bore. I can't remember what my spindle is at the moment, but still need to find a place to buy the pulleys.

[Greg Bender]

Raymond,
your local bearing supplier should also carry all kinds of pulleys with the ability to bore for shaft size.
Greg

[Raymond Sprouse]

Raymond,
your local bearing supplier should also carry all kinds of pulleys with the ability to bore for shaft size.
Greg

Thanks Greg. I live in the middle of nowhere. I don't have a bearing supplier within 100 miles that I know of. I'll keep searching.

[Mark Hazelden]

Raymond,

Here are some companies that I use when making items for my shop.

http://www.mcmaster.com/
http://www.use-enco.com
http://www1.mscdirect.com/cgi/nnsrhm

Perhaps they have what you are looking for.

Good Luck,

Mark

[Raymond Sprouse]

Well I finally got my VFD and motor. The VFD is: 3 HP, G.E., Model D7210, 230 Volt 1 Phase Input
The motor is an Emerson 2 HP Three Phase, Totally Enclosed Fan Cooled.

I have to run 220 to my shop now. Once that is done, I'll be asking some questions about setting up this VFD. If anyone has this unit, please let me know.

[Raymond Sprouse]

I was looking through my VFD manual and have a question. I have to get some kind of plug to plug in my vfd to the wall outlet. Some 220 volt plugs have 4 prongs, some have three. By looking at the pic I pulled off my manual, it looks like I need a 3 wire, 3 prong plug. 2 power wires and 1 ground.
I have a 2hp motor and my home's electric is 1 phase. This would put me on figure d.

Does that sound correct?http://i202.photobucket.com/albums/aa115/rizaydog/Untitled-1-1.jpg

[John Hart]

Yes...Figure D would be correct

[Raymond Sprouse]

Thanks John.

So I would need the 3 wire/ 3 prong plug like a dryer?

[John Hart]

Yep...that'll work. Just make sure you get the matching outlet. A dryer set would be of sufficient rating though.

[Raymond Sprouse]

I am trying to setup my remote now and have some questions for all of you. I have included a list for the buttons/switches I am planning to buy to allow run, stop, forward & reverse, and speed control. Below are some pics from my vfd manual control terminals.
http://i202.photobucket.com/albums/aa115/rizaydog/Manualmini300.jpg


http://i202.photobucket.com/albums/aa115/rizaydog/Untitled-1-2.jpg


I am planning on purchasing the following parts from automationdirect.com

Pushbutton, 22mm metal, momentary, red 40mm mushroom operator, 1 N.C. contact block (http://www.automationdirect.com/adc/Shopping/Catalog/Pushbuttons_-z-_Switches_-z-_Indicators/22mm_Metal/Mushroom_Pushbuttons_Illuminated_-a-_Non-Illuminated/GCX1135)

Pushbutton, 22mm metal, momentary, black 40mm mushroom operator, 1 N.O. contact block (http://www.automationdirect.com/adc/Shopping/Catalog/Pushbuttons_-z-_Switches_-z-_Indicators/22mm_Metal/Mushroom_Pushbuttons_Illuminated_-a-_Non-Illuminated/GCX1134)

Selector switch, 22mm metal, 2-position, maintained, black knob, 1 N.O. contact block (http://www.automationdirect.com/adc/Shopping/Catalog/Pushbuttons_-z-_Switches_-z-_Indicators/22mm_Metal/Selector_Switches_Illuminated_-a-_Non-Illuminated/Non-Illuminated/GCX1300)

22mm potentiometer with 10 Kohm resistance, black handle. (http://www.automationdirect.com/adc/Shopping/Catalog/Pushbuttons_-z-_Switches_-z-_Indicators/22mm_Metal/Potentiometers/ECX2300-10K)

Four-hole plastic enclosure for 22mm devices, 185mm H x 70mm W x 51mm D, 40mm between hole centers, gray top (http://www.automationdirect.com/adc/Shopping/Catalog/Pushbuttons_-z-_Switches_-z-_Indicators/22mm_Plastic/22mm_Pushbutton_Enclosures/SA109-40SL)

Number 13 on the contact terminal shows the power supply for the POT. The FWD and REV terminals, I assume, come from the output from the selector switch. I don't understand where to get the power for, or where the output goes for the other buttons/switches. Can anyone help me with the other connections.

Any help will be greatly appreciated.

[Raymond Sprouse]

Any help from anyone?

[Raymond Sprouse]

So now I am trying to setup my remote now and have some questions for all of you. I have included a list for the buttons/switches I am planning to buy to allow run, stop, forward & reverse, and speed control. Below are some pics from my vfd manual control terminals.
http://i202.photobucket.com/albums/aa115/rizaydog/Manualmini300.jpg


http://i202.photobucket.com/albums/aa115/rizaydog/Untitled-1-2.jpg


I am planning on purchasing the following parts from automationdirect.com

Pushbutton, 22mm metal, momentary, red 40mm mushroom operator, 1 N.C. contact block (http://www.automationdirect.com/adc/Shopping/Catalog/Pushbuttons_-z-_Switches_-z-_Indicators/22mm_Metal/Mushroom_Pushbuttons_Illuminated_-a-_Non-Illuminated/GCX1135)

Pushbutton, 22mm metal, momentary, black 40mm mushroom operator, 1 N.O. contact block (http://www.automationdirect.com/adc/Shopping/Catalog/Pushbuttons_-z-_Switches_-z-_Indicators/22mm_Metal/Mushroom_Pushbuttons_Illuminated_-a-_Non-Illuminated/GCX1134)

Selector switch, 22mm metal, 2-position, maintained, black knob, 1 N.O. contact block (http://www.automationdirect.com/adc/Shopping/Catalog/Pushbuttons_-z-_Switches_-z-_Indicators/22mm_Metal/Selector_Switches_Illuminated_-a-_Non-Illuminated/Non-Illuminated/GCX1300)

22mm potentiometer with 10 Kohm resistance, black handle. (http://www.automationdirect.com/adc/Shopping/Catalog/Pushbuttons_-z-_Switches_-z-_Indicators/22mm_Metal/Potentiometers/ECX2300-10K)

Four-hole plastic enclosure for 22mm devices, 185mm H x 70mm W x 51mm D, 40mm between hole centers, gray top (http://www.automationdirect.com/adc/Shopping/Catalog/Pushbuttons_-z-_Switches_-z-_Indicators/22mm_Plastic/22mm_Pushbutton_Enclosures/SA109-40SL)

Number 13 on the contact terminal shows the power supply for the POT. The FWD and REV terminals, I assume, come from the output from the selector switch. I don't understand where to get the power for, or where the output goes for the other buttons/switches. Can anyone help me with the other connections.

Any help will be greatly appreciated.

[John Hart]

Raymond...I'm having trouble seeing the details of the schematics. Where can I find the original PDF of the manual?

[Raymond Sprouse]

Sorry John, I thought they would come out better. Here is a link (http://www.geindustrial.com/publibrary/checkout/GEH-6647?TNR=Installation%20and%20Instruction%7CGEH-6647%7CPDF).

[John Hart]

By the way...going by what I can make out in these diagrams, the controller requires a 10VDC input from an external supply such as a PLC. Now, you can supply voltage from a number of devices like a plug-in AC-DC power thing like what you use for laptops, radios...etc. The supply doesn't need to be a high-current rating....just enough to supply the bias voltage for the poteniometer.

Off hand, I would say that the pot that you've selected is incorrect, as you've chosen a 10Kohm pot, as opposed to the specified pot of 0 to 5Kohm. It may not make a difference, but may not function between 5 and 10 Kohm...which means your pot resolution may be too harsh during operation of the lathe.

But, don't hold me to this until I can completely understand the circuit. I kinda need to see the manual.

[Raymond Sprouse]

By the way...going by what I can make out in these diagrams, the controller requires a 10VDC input from an external supply such as a PLC. Now, you can supply voltage from a number of devices like a plug-in AC-DC power thing like what you use for laptops, radios...etc. The supply doesn't need to be a high-current rating....just enough to supply the bias voltage for the poteniometer.

Off hand, I would say that the pot that you've selected is incorrect, as you've chosen a 10Kohm pot, as opposed to the specified pot of 0 to 5Kohm. It may not make a difference, but may not function between 5 and 10 Kohm...which means your pot resolution may be too harsh during operation of the lathe.

But, don't hold me to this until I can completely understand the circuit. I kinda need to see the manual.


I am not sure I follow. Do you think I need a PLC to operate this vfd or to use a remote with this vfd?

By looking at my diagram on post #11 figure D, the following should be true:
G is the ground from my 220 line
L1/L is one of the power line from my 220 line
L2/N is the second power line from my 220 line

U,V,W are the outputs to my motor. The G on the right is the motor ground.

Is this correct so far?

[John Hart]

Yep..you have everything right so far.

The question now is how to supply the remote operation signal.

I just read the manual....and it looks like you can supply command signals from a number of different kinds of sources....such as a PLC...or a PWM generator, or a standard 0-10V potentiometer controlled supply.

You've chosen the pot option, so you're good to go. The 10Kohm pot you've chosen may not work as it may limit the current too much...but then again, it might work just fine. The controller might be versatile enough to handle it. Nevertheless...the pot ECX2300-5K on the same page would be the correct one...you might as well get that one.

But regardless....Your main concern right now is supplying a 10VDC control voltage to the potentiometer so it can supply 0-10 Volts over its span.

That's accomplished by getting a 10VDC supply (simple plug-in type) that will cost you less than 10 bucks. You'd wire up the supply to the pot and then route the the output of the pot and the ground to the controller on Terminal 12 and 11 respectively.

If you don't understand the potentiometer wiring, I'll be happy to create a drawing for you.

[Raymond Sprouse]

Thanks a lot John. I will get the POT that you mentioned, and 10vdc wont be a problem.

What about the run, stop, forward, and reverse? Any idea where to connect them?

[John Hart]

Give me a couple minutes.....I have a meeting right now.

I also want to re-verify your 220 hookups. (L1-L2-G may not be correct)

[Raymond Sprouse]

Take your time John. I appreciate everything you've helped me with.

[John Hart]

Ok...well...first things first. The 220V hookups you described are correct. Rock on.

Next stuff....slap me if I'm confusing. :o

I'm questioning the purpose of the Stop and Run buttons. In programming the controller operation, you have the following choices:

0....Keypad Operation (with FWD and REV by external signal)
1....External Signal
2....Keypad Operation (Always FWD)
3....Keypad Operation (Always REV)

Now..with these choices, the only way that you can incorporate external Run and Stop ...is to disable the keypad completely with option 1 (External Signal)

It seems that the Stop and Run buttons are quite convenient on the controller....Are you sure you want to disable this?

[Raymond Sprouse]

Actual, I am only thinking of making a remote to keep the vfd safe from sawdust ect. from the lathe and other tools. I could just mount it in a convenient location and use the controls on the vfd. There is a way to switch between forward/reverse without an external signal right?

Do you think that is a better solution?

Thanks again for your help John. I am a lot less confused now. I read that manual 1/2 dozen times without much success.

[John Hart]

Hey.....this is fun Raymond. I could be working on a database right now...'course then, I could get fired right now.:eek: Hmmm:rolleyes:

Anyway....This is really your choice Raymond...but the thing about this controller is that it is designed to be operated by the keypad or by some remote controller...and they are assuming some fairly significant logic to get the all the features. (This is where a PLC comes in handy)

But...of course, with a lathe, you pretty much just need the basic stuff like direction and speed control

You could protect the controller with a shield...(Hinged Plastic box put together with silicone caulk)

But....I did come up with an idea....

...let's say you want to go with the switching. You need another power supply to supply 24VDC to the external inputs.

You could use two power supplies (one for the Pot and one for the switches) Or you could get a multiple output Power Supply.....Orrrr, you could get a 24 Volt supply and stick a 50cent 10VDC Regulator on it to split them up...whatever. Easy-peasy.

To accomplish Run and stop with switches could be done this way: According to the manual...Anytime the switch is in Forward or Reverse...it is in run mode. Anytime there is no signal, it is in STOP mode. So your Run/Stop switch should really be an On/Off switch to supply power to the Forward/Reverse switch. So, instead of the two momentary switches for Run and Stop...replace them with another selector switch.
Two Selector switches ---> RUN/STOP FWD/REV

Wire up the output of the FWD/REV switch to the FWD and REV terminals on the controller.
Wire up the output of the RUN/STOP switch to the FWD/REV switch
Wire up the 24V output of the power supply to the input of the RUN/STOP switch.

Program F02 to 0 (Keypad Operation - FWD/REV change by external signal)

With this setup, you could still have the keypad active...but have your switches at the lathe.

[Dave Schell]

Doesn't your VFD supply it's own DC power for the remote control switches? The Hitachi VFD I used in my Vicmarc build had a 24v power terminal that supplied the power for all my switches. See the thread "vicmarc barebones" and reference my post on 2-27-09 for pics of how my remote was wired. I find it very odd that would you need to supply an internal powersource for your remote on any modern VFD.

[Raymond Sprouse]

That's funny you say that John. I am "working" now too.

I'll have to think on it a bit more. I'll prob build a box for now, get everything working, and then try to figure out a remote if I think I still need one. I like the idea of a run/stop switch.

I think I'll check with the multimeter when it is up and running. See if there is any 24 volt supply built in. I'll let you know.

Thanks again John.

[Raymond Sprouse]

Dave,
Thanks for the feedback. By looking at the manual, I can't tell if there is a 24 volt from the vfd. I'll check when I get it running.

I did read your vicmarc build. That is where I got all the ideas and info on the remote.

Like you, I dL a copy of the vfd manual before I got it. It seemed simple enough until I really starting thinking about how it all goes together. Then it became sketchy. Oh well, live an learn.

John seems to REALLY know his stuff about vfd's, so, when the time comes, I think with the help from the great people here, I'll figure something out.

Thanks Dave

[John Hart]

Yeah...it's weird. The manual says that external digital inputs need to be between 22 and 27 Vdc supplied from the external equipment. It says the same thing about the 10V supply to the speed control circuit.

Also...they have a concern about feedback going backward through that circuitry from the motor controller. So even when you get it all hooked up, they say that you might have erratic behavior in the motor....at which time, you need to add additional filters (Capacitors or Ferrite Beads) to fix it.

If they supplied the DC power, you wouldn't have that problem.

[Raymond Sprouse]

Thanks John. I remember reading about the feedback in the manual. I forgot about that. Oh well, we'll get er done.

[Dave Mueller]

Raymond,
Sorry for jumping in so late, but I have put VFD controllers on two lathes (2 HP), both of which used a Westinghouse Teco FM50. I believe that it is similar to all VFDs in that they provide a regulated 10 volt output on one of the pins. If you look on page 2-10 of the manual you provided a link for, they show a +10 volt output limited to 10 ma. With a 5K ohm pot, you would only draw about 2 ma.

I attached a picture of the control box I used. It is a standard 3 hole 22 mm switch enclosure with a pot for speed control, a reversing switch and a twist on/push off switch. All are 22 mm, so they mount directly in the enclosure. I used Cat 5 cable for the connection between the control box and the VFD because is is well shielded and the control inputs do not require any significant current. Also, it is readily available and pretty cheap (just like me).
Dave

[John Hart]

Sheesh...now why didn't I see that?:o I looked right at it....in fact, that's the spec where they cite the 5K pot.

Dave's right, that output removes the need for an external source to the pot. The other voltages however, from any of the switches still require an external source.

And if you do decide to go with the pot, remember to program Function F01 to 1. Out of the box, it is programmed as 4 which is the controllers front panel speed control.

[Raymond Sprouse]

No worries. I missed a lot of stuff too. Sometimes we just need a fresh pair of eyes.

So it looks like, acording to page 2-11, I'll need a power sorce of 22-27 volts, 2.5-5 ma if I want to add a run/stop and fwd/rev switch.

Ok, we're getting there.

[Jeff Nicol]

Ray and John, When I did my conversion (3 years ago) I put the pot and the on of switch on the remote for the exact reson you stated "Keep the dust off the VFD" I mounted it on a post with a plexi dust cover with some small holes for heat to escape as the VFD will get warm during use. Using the correct POT is key, I used one that was reccomended by TECO when I bought the VFD and it was not very smooth and we changed it so it would start at slower speeds, just like John has reccomended. He is correct that you will have to program the VFD to the remote for it to work. I am not sure if they have a way to have it both ways on some different models. This is not a problem as it is easy to go back and change it to the keypad on the VFD when needed. I also over clocked mine to go up to 90hz and it is a screamer! I only use the higher speeds for friction finishing so it does not get used much. I have just a single pulley on not a step pulley and I have from roughly 20rpm (Usable) up to about 3500+. It all depends on what you plan to do with the lathe how you configure the pulley setup.

So far you 2 have it figured out down to the last few tweaks!

Have fun,

Jeff

[Raymond Sprouse]

So I finally finished running the 220 line to the shop. I wired up the vfd to a plug that will fit my receptacle. Now to wire the motor. . .

I have a question about the motor wiring.

There are 9 wires in the motor.

Numbers 4,5,6 are twisted together.

9 and 3 are twisted together.

5 and 2 are twisted together.

7 and 1 are twisted together.

Looking at this picture from the motor,
http://www.sawmillcreek.org/%3Ca%20href=%22http://s202.photobucket.com/albums/aa115/rizaydog/?action=view&current=100_4887.jpg%22%20target=%22_blank%22%3E%3 Cimg%20src=%22http://i202.photobucket.com/albums/aa115/rizaydog/100_4887.jpg%22%20border=%220%22%20alt=%22Photobuc ket%22%3E%3C/a%3Ehttp://i202.photobucket.com/albums/aa115/rizaydog/100_4887.jpg

It appears that this is for what they call "Lo Voltage".

According to the motor plate, this motor will handle 220 or 460. So does that mean the the "Lo" side is for 220?

It appears that I would leave the 4,5,6 wire nutted together.
Then connect the 9&3, 5&2, and 7&1 wires to one of the 3 coming out of my vfd?

If this is not correct, how should this be wired?

[Raymond Sprouse]

So I finally finished running the 220 line to the shop. I wired up the vfd to a plug that will fit my receptacle. Now to wire the motor. . .

I have a question about the motor wiring.

There are 9 wires in the motor.

Numbers 4,5,6 are twisted together.

9 and 3 are twisted together.

5 and 2 are twisted together.

7 and 1 are twisted together.

Looking at this picture from the motor,
http://www.sawmillcreek.org/%3Ca%20href=%22http://s202.photobucket.com/albums/aa115/rizaydog/?action=view&current=100_4887.jpg%22%20target=%22_blank%22%3E%3 Cimg%20src=%22http://i202.photobucket.com/albums/aa115/rizaydog/100_4887.jpg%22%20border=%220%22%20alt=%22Photobuc ket%22%3E%3C/a%3Ehttp://i202.photobucket.com/albums/aa115/rizaydog/100_4887.jpg

It appears that this is for what they call "Lo Voltage".

According to the motor plate, this motor will handle 220 or 460. So does that mean the the "Lo" side is for 220?

It appears that I would leave the 4,5,6 wire nutted together.
Then connect the 9&3, 5&2, and 7&1 wires to one of the 3 coming out of my vfd?

If this is not correct, how should this be wired?

[Raymond Sprouse]

I gave the motor and vfd a test run last night. Seems to be working good. I was surprised at the amount of noise the little vfd puts out. The little fan really blows.

I did notice a slight wining noise coming from the motor. It is not very loud, but I am concerned that I might not have something right with it. It increases when I turn up the speed. But even at full speed, it is not very loud.

Any thoughts?

[John Hart]

Hi Raymond,

I'm glad to see that you got'r hooked up. Sorry...I've been very busy trying to finish my library. (I think it wants to kill me) :)

Anyway...yes...what you describe as whining, may be the nature of a frequency controlled device like a vfd. SCR drives do cause a motor to "sing". My guts tell me that this is normal.

My guts tell me a lot of things....and some of them ain't too pleasant. :eek:

[Raymond Sprouse]

Thanks John. I was hoping that was the case.

[Nigel Tracy]

I did notice a slight wining noise coming from the motor. It is not very loud, but I am concerned that I might not have something right with it. It increases when I turn up the speed. But even at full speed, it is not very loud.

Any thoughts?
My 3ph motor (Leeson) seems to "sing" when it's drawing considerably more then 100% of rated amperage. After thirty seconds or so of singing my VFD gives an "overload" message. Seems to happen most at slower speeds and heavy turning. Turning up the speed for a second then back down usually ends the singing and prevents an overload. There's probably a setting on the VFD I could tweak to deal with this (there are so many settings).

Maybe mine is a different type of "singing", but "singing" sure would describe it... for what it's worth...

Good luck,

Nigel

[Dave Schell]

I gave the motor and vfd a test run last night. Seems to be working good. I was surprised at the amount of noise the little vfd puts out. The little fan really blows.

I did notice a slight wining noise coming from the motor. It is not very loud, but I am concerned that I might not have something right with it. It increases when I turn up the speed. But even at full speed, it is not very loud.

Any thoughts?

My Hitachi drive made a noise like that when I first configured it - after some research, I found that it is related to (and alleviated by) the "carrier frequency." I was able to adjust the setting for that which made the noise all but go away. I would recommend searching your manual for a similiar parameter for you drive.

[Raymond Sprouse]

My Hitachi drive made a noise like that when I first configured it - after some research, I found that it is related to (and alleviated by) the "carrier frequency." I was able to adjust the setting for that which made the noise all but go away. I would recommend searching your manual for a similiar parameter for you drive.


Thanks Dave, I give that a try.

[Jerry Marcantel]

want to go from a single phase to a 3 phase motor???? I can only think it's because you might have full hp rating at lower rpm, and that most 3 phase motors start slow and wind up to full rpm slower than an instant start capacitor start motors?? Help me out someone....... Jerry (in Tucson)

[Raymond Sprouse]

want to go from a single phase to a 3 phase motor???? I can only think it's because you might have full hp rating at lower rpm, and that most 3 phase motors start slow and wind up to full rpm slower than an instant start capacitor start motors?? Help me out someone....... Jerry (in Tucson)

My lathe had a single phase 110 volt 1/2 horse motor running a reeve's drive for speed control. Anyone with this type of setup will tell you that the lowest speed setting is wayyyyy to fast.

To answer your question, my response is two fold. First, I needed to slow down my lathe to a safer speed for larger turnings. Second, I needed more hp. I take large roughing cuts and my old 1/2 hp would stop.

The 3 phase is not an issue. I don't have 3 phase in my shop. However, my vfd converts the single phase to 3 phase for me. As far as the start up speed, the vfd has adjustments for that as well as how slow/fast it stops. They can be set from close to instantaneous start/stop, to a nice slow start/stop. What ever you like.

Does that help?

[Raymond Sprouse]

Thanks again everyone for your help. I got my lathe project completed today. I made a new motor mount and bolted it down. Installed the vfd inside my stand. I installed the fwd/rev, start/stop, and pot under the headstock. I'll post some pictures when I get a chance. Too tired tonight. Thanks for all your input and help...