NEWBIE ALERT - off-center wine stopper

[Bob Daniel]

Hi folks... moving up from pens on my medium-sized lathe (King 10" x 16" Wood Lathe Model: KWL-1016C) I'm making wine stoppers (Lee Valley stainless steel cone shaped with integral 1/4x20 screw) and I'm ending up with an off-centre hole after turning. Here's my process:



find center of a small rectangular blank using crossed diagonal lines on the end grain
on drill press, pre-drill hole for stopper, about two inches deep (most of this will be left in the chuck)
mount blank in Oneway Talon Chuck, blank's corners sticking out of the 4 gaps between jaws
turn profile of wine stopper, sand, polish, wax, part off


The now-revealed location of the pre-drilled hole where the stopper gets screwed in is never quite centered. Obviously my version of center doesn't match up with the actual center-of-turning, if that's a term...

So the obvious question: how can I change this procedure to get a properly centered hole?

Should I drill it AFTER? That begs the question of how to support a round, tapered, shiny, FINISHED workpiece securely without marring it, for the drill press...

Thanks for any help, cheers. And seasons greetings from Canada!

[Bill Swanson]

I have only done the woodcraft version and I turn them on a mandrel. If you dont have a mandrel make one fron the correct threaded stock and chuck it up in a chuck.

Just my 2 cents.

[Bob Daniel]

I have only done the woodcraft version and I turn them on a mandrel. If you dont have a mandrel make one fron the correct threaded stock and chuck it up in a chuck.


Interesting...thanks!... I assume you mean that the mandrel (not threaded) or the threaded rod would NOT go all the way through, or else there would be a hole at both ends? But how would it "hold on" during the turning without a way of tightening it from the other end, like I do when turning pens?

[Bill Swanson]

The mandrel threads are as long as the threads on the stopper.

Here are the instructions I use.



1. Cutting Blanks
Cut wooden blanks to measure approximately 1½" x 1½" x 2" long.
2. Drilling Blanks
Using a 6mm bit (144629), drill a 1" deep hole in a piece of wood any size you wish that is longer than the threaded stem on the wine stopper.
3. Mandrel Preparation
1. Mount the bottle stopper mandrel on your lathe using a chuck, drill chuck, or Morse Taper driver.
2. Screw the blank onto the mandrel until the wood shoulders against the round stop collar.
3. Support the other end of the blank with the tailstock.
4. Turn to desired shape and finish.



4. Turning Blanks
Turn the blank to your desired shape or design.
5. Finishing
Use any finish of your choice for this step.
6. Assembly
Unscrew the wood from the mandrel. A few drops of CA glue, or epoxy, in the threaded hole of the wood, prior to screwing it onto the stopper, will securely fix the wood to the stopper. Slide an O-ring (A) into each groove in the stopper body.

Hope this helps.

[Kyle Iwamoto]

Buy a wine stopper mandrel, or I guess you could try making your own. I think you're correct in assuming that the center is not the center. The best thing about buying a mandrel, is it's sized to the stopper, and you can get a nice clean joint, if you don't want to make a bead or other feature.

If you don't want to buy a mandrel, use a drill bit in the tailstock to drill your mounting hole, turn round and reverse the blanks then turn and part off. But, that would require buying a drill chuck mandrel if you don't have one. It will be centered though.

If you have an adjustable pen mandrel, is the end thread 1/4-20? You could use that.

[Bob Daniel]

That's hugely helpful, thanks so much!!



The mandrel threads are as long as the threads on the stopper.

Here are the instructions I use.

1. Cutting Blanks
Cut wooden blanks to measure approximately 1½" x 1½" x 2" long.
2. Drilling Blanks
Using a 6mm bit (144629), drill a 1" deep hole in a piece of wood any size you wish that is longer than the threaded stem on the wine stopper.
3. Mandrel Preparation
1. Mount the bottle stopper mandrel on your lathe using a chuck, drill chuck, or Morse Taper driver.
2. Screw the blank onto the mandrel until the wood shoulders against the round stop collar.
3. Support the other end of the blank with the tailstock.
4. Turn to desired shape and finish.

4. Turning Blanks
Turn the blank to your desired shape or design.
5. Finishing
Use any finish of your choice for this step.
6. Assembly
Unscrew the wood from the mandrel. A few drops of CA glue, or epoxy, in the threaded hole of the wood, prior to screwing it onto the stopper, will securely fix the wood to the stopper. Slide an O-ring (A) into each groove in the stopper body.

Hope this helps.

[Bob Daniel]

I've been using a drill chuck / taper with 7mm mandrel for my pens, and just ordered a starter kit for another size, not 1/4x20 though probably... I'll look into the wine-stopper mandrel thing, thanks so much...!!:)


Buy a wine stopper mandrel, or I guess you could try making your own. I think you're correct in assuming that the center is not the center. The best thing about buying a mandrel, is it's sized to the stopper, and you can get a nice clean joint, if you don't want to make a bead or other feature.

If you don't want to buy a mandrel, use a drill bit in the tailstock to drill your mounting hole, turn round and reverse the blanks then turn and part off. But, that would require buying a drill chuck mandrel if you don't have one. It will be centered though.

If you have an adjustable pen mandrel, is the end thread 1/4-20? You could use that.

[Doug W Swanson]

Here's a couple of mandrels for you.

http://www.bereahardwoods.com/pen-kit/supplies/wbs-stopper.html

There are a bunch of different mandrels out there that are sized for the particular wine stopper you are using. Just make sure you get the right size and you are good to go.

I mount my mandrel in a drill chuck vs a regular chuck. The main thing I like about that is the wood sticks out farther from the chuck so there is more room to work on it. I'm less likely to rub up against the chuck when I'm carving up the bottom.

Hope this helps...
Doug

[Ken Fitzgerald]

Bob,

The mandrel used in turning winestoppers are shown in the link Doug posted. You can make one by just taking a 3/8 x 16 threaded bolt and cutting the head off of it. Put the remaining threaded portion in your jacobs chuck in your drill.

Drill a 5/16" hole in your blank.....tap it to 3/8" x16 and screw the blank onto your homemade mandrel. Turn the stopper. Apply your favorite finish.

Remove it from the mandrel and screw in the metal portion.

Check this out: http://www.woodturnerscatalog.com/woodturners/Images/pdfs/bottle_cone.pdf

[Bob Daniel]

Thanks folks!! I've got a starter kit coming from penblanks.ca including the mandrel and drill bit required for their stoppers... also got some threaded inserts coming from Lee Valley, when my other concern was how well the wood was "holding on" to the screw, and getting the hole diameter just right... seemed to go from too tight to too loose going up just a 64th...

So my final question (I hope) - should I bother with the inserts? Can you turn the piece with the insert installed, will it install safely on the mandrel? Or should I just screw the mandrel into the piece, then afterward replace it with the stopper, as suggested? Little CA glue to make it permanent?

Appreciate it!!

[Ken Fitzgerald]

Bob,

The way I do it is turn it on the mandrel. Then remove it and screw the remaining part into the newly turned stopper.

[Mike Wenman]

I normally use this process:

1. drill and tap my stopper blank
2. put it on the mandrel
3. turn / sand / finish / buff
4. take it off the mandrel and put it on the stopper hardware
5. give as a gift or sell ;)

[Bob Hamilton]

I drill and tap the blank on the lathe, reinforcing the threads with thin CA. How well the wood threads and how strong the threads are is really dependent on what the wood properties are. Close grained hardwoods like hard maple take threads quite well. Coarse grained woods like oak or ash can be difficult to get a good thread in and the threads might strip out if you get too aggressive with your cuts. Softer woods like soft maple or poplar would be unlikely to either take a thread very well or have the thread be strong enough to support the cuts, so would be a good place to use your inserts. Using the tailstock for support during most of the bulk waste removal is a good idea no matter what wood you use.

If you care to see how I do mine: http://www.youtube.com/view_play_list?p=A69EFB0CB41AE86F

Another Youtube poster drills and taps his at the drill press: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3xuLZ3m9hC4

Good Luck!
Bob

[Kyle Iwamoto]

I use 5 minute epoxy, I coat the entire bottom of the stopper, and the threads. That's to prevent water from getting between the stopper and the wood. Prevents formation of those nasty looking fungi that grows in damp wood. I hope. Keeps people from taking the stopper apart and wearing out the threads, or cross-threading it. Or otherwise buggering up the stopper. Then say its a quality control issue.

[Steve Mawson]

Ruth Niles also has instructions for turning bottle stoppers on her site. Mandrels are for sale on the site as well.

[JerHall]

They can be fun.
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