30 Things I Wish Someone Had Told Me About Starting Engraving Business

[julien practiq]

Good Day to everyone!!
Me and my second half decided to start our home based laser engraving business to make some extra income during the rough times and most likely take that business to another level.
We've attended Epilog presentation and were astonished with endless opportunities.
But unfortunately there is not much information on that particular type of business. We are more leading to the artistic aspect of the business(wall art for example), opposed to dealing with trophies pens etc.
I'm glad that I've found that forum and hoping to get all or at list some of my questions answered.
So to all of you experts: What do you think would be the "30 Things I Wish Someone Had Told Me About Starting Engraving Business"
Thanks in advance to all who replied.

[Tim Bateson]

1. There is little money in artistic lasering - unless you (Dee) already have a thriving artistic type business you are augmenting with the laser. People LOVE the artistic stuff, but are unwilling to pay what it's worth. Fun hobby though.

[Martin Boekers]

I hate to say it but Tim is right. Unless you have a definite niche and contacts for that type of work it can be a tough sell.

Also sometimes, unless your selling your own ideas and products it can be difficult working with the "Creative Minds";) I know because I am one:p You'll get the "that's nice but not what I expected can we tweek this and that?"

That being said there are people here that do pretty good with artistic work, I believe it's David Fairfield that makes incredible small scall reproductions and Onur has finished great wall projects do, some searching through the forum for them and see what they create.

Laser work (opps paying work) doesn't come flowing in as soon as you open shop as a sales person may like it to seem. It does take some perserverance.


Good luck and welcome aboard.

The one think owning a laser does guarantee is the free time you used to have will be gone as you will be playing with all the cool things it can do!:D

Marty

[julien practiq]

1. There is little money in artistic lasering - unless you (Dee) already have a thriving artistic type business you are augmenting with the laser. People LOVE the artistic stuff, but are unwilling to pay what it's worth. Fun hobby though.

Thank you very much for a reply.Unfortunatly there are numerous companies in my area providing most common laser engraving services, so I thought going artistic would be something new and more appealing.

[Anthony Scira]

2 Don't buy any laser sales pitch and never look at the suggested retail price from a website selling you product seriously.

As in buy this cup for 5.00 sell it for 35.00 engraved.

Aint gonna happen. And if it does not well enough to make an income.

[Scott Shepherd]

People making lots of money with their lasers don't post it on internet forums. If they did, then everyone would be doing it and they'd be out of work :)

About the most productive (profitable) thing I've seen in the open on the forums that's real are electrical panel tags.


You'll go broke trying to engrave baby photos on a piece of marble.

The items you think people will love, they will. However, you need to get $15 each for them and they want to pay $1 each for them.

I could sit here for hours and type these out :)

[rich shepard]

Scott's right, when I got my laser took samples to all the tile shops in a 30 mile radius, as no one else did title at the time. Must have done 500 to 600 hundred dollars of work for some of them as samples on different types of tile and stone. Only thing that came of it was I knew what worked and what did not , not one order so far in 3 years. But one shop owner did wanted a Indian eagle engraved in marble told him 100 and he went through the roof wanted it for under 40 so as a favor said OK. When he got it he hit the fan , said not what he wanted, he wanted it in filled with color also. LMAO

[Sarah Holbrook]

I'm also going with an artistic bent to my business. I only bought my laser a few months ago so I'm still very new at this. I assume you are an artist or have design sensibilities to want to enter this market.

If you would not otherwise be purchasing a laser (for a hobby), I would do a lot of research and development up front before buying the machine. Create some designs, then hire one people in your area to cut/engrave them or use Ponoko. Do a soft launch of your business with these designs. There is a lot of work to be done that doesn't involve owning your own laser. If you get through all of this and sell some pieces (outside of your friends and family) then you will have a much better idea of whether the business would be viable.

[David Fairfield]

If you're thinking business, not hobby or art, think of acquiring the laser in terms of hiring an employee. You are getting an extremely reliable laborer. You are not getting a business generator. The machine only does what you tell it, it can't think for you. So best have something for your robot-employee to do from the get-go.

I like Sarah's idea. If you have a potential big customer locally, like a college bookstore, pay somebody with a laser to make test shots of your design, then try marketing them. Let experience be your guide.

Dave

[Jim Beachler]

I use my laser to augment my arts business. As stated in the post above, the laser is just a tool. A really cool and fun tool but still just a tool.

To make the business work, you need to be more interested in making the sale and salesmanship. I have learned through by business that I can make some very unique and wonderful items, but if I can't sell it, it worthless.

Therefore, my main job is to sell, sell and sell. I use the laser as one of my tools to make the items that I am selling and selling and selling.

As with any small business, the main thing is to sell. The second thing is have someone or something make what you sell.

[Juliana Costa]

Laser ? Art ? Dee and Onur, they know it All

[Dee Gallo]

Julien, I'll jump in here with my 2 cents. It sounds like you don't already have an art business, so what kind of art would you be interested in creating? Are you an experienced artist?

As stated before the laser is simply a tool which you use to make your product, like a paintbrush or chisel and hammer.

I personally found it a super great tool (and toy!), but only after I had an established customer base and niche which I worked on developing for several years before buying my first laser. If I had to go door to door trying to sell my products I'd be broke and tired.

So, my advice to add to your list is:
1) research and KNOW your field, be very very good at what you do
2) understand your potential customer
3) create a product they MUST have and can't get anywhere else
4) aim for the high end - people with little money are not your best customers.

cheers, dee

[Rodne Gold]

1) Marketing is important
2) marketing is almost all thats important
3) Marketing is the most important
4) No easy money to be made without marketing
5) Marketing is the first thing you do
6) without marketing having a laser is like winking at a woman in the dark , only you know what you doing
And so on......
Search these boards for advice on starting out - been 100s of threads on this ..see how many ppl are actually making a decent living off their machines , especially those that have or had no pre exisiting markets or no other ancilliary machinery and the brutal truth might emerge.

[Rodne Gold]

here's 30+ points in addition
1) Takes at least a yr of hard work to start turning a profit
2) Running costs are not insignificant
3) Not everything comes out perfect off the laser
4) Work on 1/2 the expected profits and 2x the expected running costs
5) Lasers are flaky things , one day they work and the next they can be dead
6) Tube life of 20 000 hrs is a myth
7) 90% of the fancy stuff agents tell you a laser can do are bells and whistles that dont make money
8) Cheap lasers are almost as good at what they do than expensive ones , in terms of the products they generate
9) More power and biggers beds do not generate revenue in proportion to their size/power
10) You have to be there every minute you are using the laser unless you want your house to possibly burn down.
11) You can prolly make more money selling fruit on a street corner
13) You need to be a designer
14) You need to be a businessman
15) You need to be a marketer
16) You need to be a maintenance engineer
17) No matter what exhaust system , sometimes lasering things smells bad
18) You need more than a laser to make money out of this field
19) You need to line up suppliers before you start
20) You need to spend at least 2-3 months making samples
21) Ask yourself "what have I got that ppl will use me instead of my competiton"
22) You need to know your materials and how they react to a laser beam almost more than you need to know what a laser can do
23) You have to have a basic understanding in how a laser works to understand settings and speeds and feeds
24) you need to find out who are your competiton
25) You need to accurately work out pricing
26) You need to have rhino skin if you dont want to feel despondent when your cold calling garners you rude refusals
27) Make sure all mnfgrs promises re service and guarantee are in writing.
28) Don't believe some of these even if they are in writing
29) Service , support and length of warrantee are what determines who's machines you should buy
30) in most cases , once you bought you are on your own , mnfgrs wont hand hold you extensively for free
31) You cant use mnfgrs suggested settings apart from a gross baseline , you are going to need to experiment.
32) Not all laser drivers are convenient to use and not all will be useable if your OS changes and some have bugs that will never be ironed out.

[julien practiq]

Thanks to each and every one of you for your comments and suggestions!
I'm glad that I came to the right place when experienced experts can answer my questions.
We are currently researching all possible opportunities that will make our business successful.
I'm not a professional artist, but experienced IT professional who has design sensibilities , strong will and desire to make our business successful.
I'm still open for any suggestions that would come to your mind.
I think that your comments and suggestions would also benefit other newcomers in their business decisions.
Thank you ones again!

[julien practiq]

here's 30+ points in addition
1) Takes at least a yr of hard work to start turning a profit
2) Running costs are not insignificant
3) Not everything comes out perfect off the laser
4) Work on 1/2 the expected profits and 2x the expected running costs
5) Lasers are flaky things , one day they work and the next they can be dead
6) Tube life of 20 000 hrs is a myth
7) 90% of the fancy stuff agents tell you a laser can do are bells and whistles that dont make money
8) Cheap lasers are almost as good at what they do than expensive ones , in terms of the products they generate
9) More power and biggers beds do not generate revenue in proportion to their size/power
10) You have to be there every minute you are using the laser unless you want your house to possibly burn down.
11) You can prolly make more money selling fruit on a street corner
13) You need to be a designer
14) You need to be a businessman
15) You need to be a marketer
16) You need to be a maintenance engineer
17) No matter what exhaust system , sometimes lasering things smells bad
18) You need more than a laser to make money out of this field
19) You need to line up suppliers before you start
20) You need to spend at least 2-3 months making samples
21) Ask yourself "what have I got that ppl will use me instead of my competiton"
22) You need to know your materials and how they react to a laser beam almost more than you need to know what a laser can do
23) You have to have a basic understanding in how a laser works to understand settings and speeds and feeds
24) you need to find out who are your competiton
25) You need to accurately work out pricing
26) You need to have rhino skin if you dont want to feel despondent when your cold calling garners you rude refusals
27) Make sure all mnfgrs promises re service and guarantee are in writing.
28) Don't believe some of these even if they are in writing
29) Service , support and length of warrantee are what determines who's machines you should buy
30) in most cases , once you bought you are on your own , mnfgrs wont hand hold you extensively for free
31) You cant use mnfgrs suggested settings apart from a gross baseline , you are going to need to experiment.
32) Not all laser drivers are convenient to use and not all will be useable if your OS changes and some have bugs that will never be ironed out.

Rodne,
I already know what is my first engraving project would be:) I will engrave all your 30+ points on the anodized aluminum plate and will place as wall art in my living room. Special thanks for your words of wisdom!!! That is awesome.

[Tom Bull]

Come up with a product or products, get someone else to make them as samples and then go out and see what the COMMITMENT is. The laser is an amazing machine and people are amazed, but you can't pay for it with wow, it takes cash. DON'T GO INTO DEBT FOR IT UNTIL YOU KNOW IT WILL PAY THE DEBT.
Shop carefully and patiently.
IT experience will help, but the learning curve on something like Corel Draw is huge, like the size of the Gateway arch in St. Louis.

[Doug Griffith]

1) Not all acrylic is created equal.
2) The dollar a minute pricing method doesn't take into account all the other variables such as file set-up.
3) Customers think a JPEG pulled from the web will etch beautifully.
4) Obscure file formats will be thrust upon you that you need to work with.
5) Blower fans make noise that may tick off your neighbors.
6) Cutting materials can stink and tick off your neighbors.
7) There's never enough room to store flat sheet substrates.
8) Factor in the time it takes to clean the parts after cutting or etching.
9) There are a lot of things that a CNC can do better.
10) Interest : Open Pocket Book ratio is not equal.
...

[Hilton Lister]

I was lucky. I started in business when all you needed was a Pantograph Machine and skill with a Dental Drill.

1. I never knew it would become my life.
2. Separate hobbies are a thing of the past.
3. I'm never gonna be rich.
4.Time on the job expands to take up the time available.
5.There's always going to be someone who comes along who can do the job better than you.
6. You're never gonna be able to keep up with the latest technology.
7. You can't please all of your customers all of the time.

[onur cakir]

Hi everyone !

Thanks Juliana..i'm just a "wanna be" designer :)

Well you can make money from electric tags or art products both. The difference is like;

-2.000 tags makes the same money as 1 design product makes.

-You can get 4.000 pcs of tag jobs but only 2 design jobs in a month.

-You can run a tag job at home but for design job you need a good office&showroom. Marketing of design works is expensive because you should aim people with money and hang out with them ;)

-Laser as an "end product" is ok but for example if you use laser apllications on wood and use the wood part on a door makes better profit.

-Yes i started at balcony of my flat :)

-Laser is only powerfull as your skills and imagination & computing.

I must also admit that i have a software & e-commerce business besides laser business.

[Dan Hintz]

101) Make sure you can do what you think you can do!

Corollary: If you think you can do everything, you'll end up being able to do nothing.

Don't promise a customer you can lase substrate 'X' unless you have either: a) Done it yourself before, or b) Know someone you trust who has done it before with success. You can't lose a long-term customer any faster than telling them "Yes, I can do that", followed by "Sorry, I couldn't make it work" two days before their deadline.

Don't believe you can slog through that order for 4,000 etched glasses in two weeks if you "just spend 14 hours a day at the laser... it'll be hard, but the money's worth it". The money is rarely worth it, and it sounds like a job best left to a specialist... take a small cut off of the top, but let someone else deal with the heavy lifting.

Don't overextend your reach and take a job across the country just because you're hungry for business. There will always be someone closer who can do the work, and once the customer finds out you'll be left holding the bag. Shipping/insurance is a bitch for a hand-carved, two-ton armoire.

[Lee DeRaud]

30 Things I Wish Someone Had Told Me About Starting Engraving Business

0) Don't.

And yes, I was smart enough to listen to them. :cool::D

[Mark Winlund]

Hi all.... I love this subject. Let me say at the outset: There is no money to be made in laser engraving! i Now to qualify what I said.... for the people that buy a machine, jump on the forum and say "well, now what? How do I make money with this?" These are the folks that go broke.

A personal note: I have made a small fortune in the engraving field, but I started 30 years ago. I always invested in new technology when it came out. Each process added to the total ability of the company to give the customer what they wanted. It would be very difficult to do today what I did 30 years ago.

As has been mentioned elsewhere on this thread, selling is the key. It almost doesn't matter what you do in your shop... woodworking, welding, engraving... selling your services is what will make you successful.

Rodne is probably the most successful businessman in this group. Listen to what he says.

Mark

[Dan Hintz]

Rodne is probably the most successful businessman in this group.
Due in part to the fact that he uses the laser as an additional tool in his toolbox rather than the sole tool. If you want it to be your only tool, you need to find a well-paying niche. You can build a business around the laser as the main tool, but you'll find yourself purchasing a lot of ancillary tools to support your laser work (flame polishers, stone grinder, wood cutters, etc.). Maybe it's simply a matter of viewpoint, whether the laser is an ancillary tool or everything else is.

[David Fairfield]

Thomas Edison has a few ideas for your list. :)

Genius is one percent inspiration, ninety-nine percent perspiration

Everything comes to him who hustles while he waits.

Hell, there are no rules here — we're trying to accomplish something!

Many of life's failures are people who did not realize how close they were to success when they gave up.

There is no expedient to which a man will not go to avoid the labor of thinking.

Just because something doesn't do what you planned it to do doesn't mean it's useless.

I owe my success to the fact that I never had a clock in my workroom. Seventy-five of us worked twenty hours every day and slept only four hours — and thrived on it.

I have not failed, I've just found 10,000 ways that won't work.

I find out what the world needs. Then, I go ahead and invent it.

[julien practiq]

Hi all.... I love this subject. Let me say at the outset: There is no money to be made in laser engraving! i Now to qualify what I said.... for the people that buy a machine, jump on the forum and say "well, now what? How do I make money with this?" These are the folks that go broke.

A personal note: I have made a small fortune in the engraving field, but I started 30 years ago. I always invested in new technology when it came out. Each process added to the total ability of the company to give the customer what they wanted. It would be very difficult to do today what I did 30 years ago.

As has been mentioned elsewhere on this thread, selling is the key. It almost doesn't matter what you do in your shop... woodworking, welding, engraving... selling your services is what will make you successful.

Rodne is probably the most successful businessman in this group. Listen to what he says.

Mark

Thank you Mark for the straight forward answer.I've probably forgot to mention that I did't buy a maschine yet, but jumped on the forum to get expert opinions first. I'm completely agree with your statement:"It almost doesn't matter what you do in your shop... woodworking, welding, engraving... selling your services is what will make you successful" but I would add a few more points to that but probably later on.
About Rodnie Gold:Look at my reply to his 30+ points on this forum early on :)

[julien practiq]

Thomas Edison has a few ideas for your list. :)

Genius is one percent inspiration, ninety-nine percent perspiration

Everything comes to him who hustles while he waits.

Hell, there are no rules here — we're trying to accomplish something!

Many of life's failures are people who did not realize how close they were to success when they gave up.

There is no expedient to which a man will not go to avoid the labor of thinking.

Just because something doesn't do what you planned it to do doesn't mean it's useless.

I owe my success to the fact that I never had a clock in my workroom. Seventy-five of us worked twenty hours every day and slept only four hours — and thrived on it.

I have not failed, I've just found 10,000 ways that won't work.

I find out what the world needs. Then, I go ahead and invent it.



Thomas Edison is my man:).Thank you David.

[Rodne Gold]

The problem witha startup with a laser as a sole tool is that you will be beaten by competiton with less overhead and more experience with a machine already partially amortised.
I already had a trophy/jewellery business and had , as mark did , embraced cutting edge prior to getting a laser - in fact in 1980 I bought one of the first larger scale computerised router/engravers in our country and developed my markets with that , the lasers were a natural extension of the engraving/trophy business.

If you have a multitude of tools then it becomes far more difficult for others to enter your market as the barriers to entry in terms of cost and mastering all these become difficult. Apart from which , the range of services you can offer and the variety of goods you can make means you became a "can do" shop.
At the end of it all , pure lasering wont make you good money , what will is creating something with a laser and adding extra value to it with other processes and then selling it
More than all that , what I can attribute a lot of success to is the fact that I provide quality and service as a prime consideration and price thereafter.
If you really want to make this your profession , you must look beyond a mom and pop vision and plan for growth and do it right - you got to think big..what you got to ask yourself is: is that the direction you want to go with this ..considering staff issues and the pacman like nature of a bigger business..

[julien practiq]

The problem witha startup with a laser as a sole tool is that you will be beaten by competiton with less overhead and more experience with a machine already partially amortised.
I already had a trophy/jewellery business and had , as mark did , embraced cutting edge prior to getting a laser - in fact in 1980 I bought one of the first larger scale computerised router/engravers in our country and developed my markets with that , the lasers were a natural extension of the engraving/trophy business.

If you have a multitude of tools then it becomes far more difficult for others to enter your market as the barriers to entry in terms of cost and mastering all these become difficult. Apart from which , the range of services you can offer and the variety of goods you can make means you became a "can do" shop.
At the end of it all , pure lasering wont make you good money , what will is creating something with a laser and adding extra value to it with other processes and then selling it
More than all that , what I can attribute a lot of success to is the fact that I provide quality and service as a prime consideration and price thereafter.
If you really want to make this your profession , you must look beyond a mom and pop vision and plan for growth and do it right - you got to think big..what you got to ask yourself is: is that the direction you want to go with this ..considering staff issues and the pacman like nature of a bigger business..

Rodne,

I would completely agree with what you’re saying.
I know that is running your own business is to wear multiple hats in the same time and be proactive, no doubts on that.
Since 1995 I’ve ran another customer service oriented business as my side job, until a few years ago I’ve found that it is causing problems to my health. So basically I’m familiar with selling my services and maintaining a good customer base.
I always took quality and service as a prime consideration, all the same as you mentioned in your statement. We are currently working on our business plan to “look beyond a mom and pop vision and plan for growth” and I do like to take that business to another level.
I think we have a pretty good understanding what are we trying to get our self involved to.
Unfortunately at my current life and our economy situation I don’t see any other way to possibly earn a decent retirement base as my age is approaching.
Rodne, thank you ones again for sharing your wisdom and experience.

[David Fairfield]

One more quote that has helped me

PRESS ON. Nothing in the world can take the place of persistence. Talent will not; nothing in the world is more common than unsuccessful men with talent. Genius will not; unrewarded genius is almost a proverb. Education will not; the world is full of educated derelicts. Persistence and determination alone are omnipotent.

Calvin Coolidge

[Liesl Dexheimer]

Wow, interesting thread. I've been in the engraving business for 8 years now, started when I was 19 in an existing business. I also majored in graphic design so I understand about various file formats, vectors, etc but there's always something new to learn and new technology to keep up with. It's true what Rodne was saying about having to be a designer, marketer, businessman, etc.

I must agree that as much as I would like to pursue the artistic side of laser engraving, I too feel that there isn't much money in it (unless the customer wants the item badly enough to pay for it, which is pretty rare these days). On the positive side, I believe real money can be made in jobs with quantity involved (ex: name tags, signs, awards, etc).

[James Stokes]

I think we have a pretty good understanding what are we trying to get our self involved to.
Unfortunately at my current life and our economy situation I don’t see any other way to possibly earn a decent retirement base as my age is approaching.
Rodne, thank you ones again for sharing your wisdom and experience.

With just a laser you are not going to make near enough money to live on. In the 10 years I have been doing this I can give you 2 or 3 people in this area each year that bought lasers thinking they were going to make a killing at it After 10 years I am about the only one still in business but since the price of lasers have dropped there are at least 2 or 3 every year that start up and just about every one of them will caii me at some point wanting to sell me their laser. They are the same ones trying to sell an engraved photo on granite for 10 bucks.