Door Panel question

[Richard M. Wolfe]

We recently got a set of doors in to finish for a house being built on a ranch near here. The doors are special order and the owner bought them from an out of state supplier. The doors are custom made in Pennsylvania and were shipped to us to be finished. After a base coat the owner came down to approve the finish job but then said, "This isn't what I specified." The doors are rail and stile with a solid wood panel. There was no specific profile cut into the inside edge of the rails and stiles - the look is as if two boards were butted together. That is, it just looks like a miniature stair step. The "drop", or offset between rail/stile and panel is 5/16". After going round and round with the manufacturer the owner has decided they will take the doors and have asked to have the rail/stile edges rounded over.

There are 22 doors - half are maple and half walnut. They were all custom made for a specific opening so the panel size on each door is different.

Does anyone have any good ideas for rounding over the edges? Adding a molding that looks like a tiny quarter round molding has been ruled out. It would be too much of a pain to color match, anyway. Since the relief is only 5/16" I don't see how any kind of router bit could be used. So that seems to pretty much make the job either sanding or planing, and there are many feet of this stuff.

There will be enough compensation to make the job worthwhile; it's just coming up with a workable solution. Anyone have any ideas? Thanks in advance.

[Jamie Buxton]

Eyow! Doing that by hand, free-handing it, is quite daunting.

How 'bout this?... Get a 1/4" roundover bit (or maybe a 3/16"). Remove the pilot bearing, and grind off whatever it is mounted on. Now you have a roundover bit without a pilot bearing. (Now that I describe this, I think I've seen these, without any customization.) Make a shoe that fits on a small router. It is an edge guide. It reaches down and guides along the edge of the stile or rail along the edge of the panel. It is going to be tricky. It needs to grab the stile or rail, even after the roundover has gone past and removed most of the face. (That's why maybe a 3/16" roundover is better.) Also, you won't be able to get all the way into the corner with this approach, so there's going to be a little careful cutting with a sharp chisel to complete the operation. But it should be possible, and not too expensive.

[Jamie Buxton]

Ah, yes --- http://www.amanatool.com/bits-fv/56100.html for a roundover bit without a pilot on the tip.

[Fred Preston]

round over bit without bearing. you can make a sliding guide frame that is adjustable for each size and use the appropriate guide bushing slightly larger than the bit. or you can do the smallest doors first and use a piece of plywood as a guide by cutting a square hole the size you need plus the distance that the guide bushing takes up. use scrap on the bottom and some cleats to clamp the ply to the doors. after you do the smallest you re cut for the next size. rinse and repeat. you will need to clean up the corners as stated above. this method takes some time and finness but it will work.

[Conrad Fiore]

Rich,
Who pays for a new door if you make a slip?

[Greg Sznajdruk]

You didn't create the problem, it looks like a no win situation to me. After 40 years I've learned when to walk away, in this case I'd run.

My .02

Greg

[Mitchell Andrus]

I'm with Greg, mostly. Get in writing that this isn't standard practice and a ruined door or two will result at the owner's expense. Failing that, charge enough so you can buy/make a new door or two.
.

[James White]

You could also use something like an EZ Smart guide rail to run the router base against. Set the rail with gouge blocks. Perhaps Dino will have something you can use as a stop at each end of the panel so you don't over shoot the mark. In fact after going to the web page he has a router guide package that has stops.

http://www.eurekazone.com/

James

[Charles Robertson]

Rich,
Set a drill press at high speed. Install a small drill bit to find dead center in 3/4 sacrificial table. Install a pin to follow the back side of your door panel-(stile and rail). Mount your router bit. Here is where a third hand is, well-handy. Turn on drill press, lower to set depth, lock. Proceed with routing. I believe you will move the panel counter/clockwise. Make up a scrap angle, so owner can authorize depth. It's safer than you think but don't let a newbie do this. I've used my drill press to take the place of an ov/hd pin router several times with great sucess. I know the safety police will try to ostrasize (?) me but they won't be able to change me. Good luck with your project. C.R.

[Frank Drew]

Richard,

Are these cabinet doors or house doors? At first I assumed the latter, but probably I'm wrong.

Myself, I'd go back and revisit the applied molding solution; much faster, and safer for the doors, and many more design options available.

[Richard M. Wolfe]

Thanks for the replies on the question. Frank, the doors are full size passage doors - room doors, closet doors, etc. That eliminates moving the door under a trimmer of some kind. We looked into several options of putting a molding on the 'lip' but it just doesn't look right with the rest of the door being flat.

It seems the favored option is some kind of routing. Thanks for the source for a flat bottomed roundover bit. The problem with using a guide is the narrowness of the rails and stiles, which are about four inches wide. Maybe I can look into using a small router like a laminate trimmer. Actually, the guy I work with took on the "extension" to the project, which was finishing the doors, although I imagine I will get in on some of it. :rolleyes:

[David DeCristoforo]

I would modify the doors under the following conditions:

1) The work would be done on a "time and materials" basis. I would not even offer an estimate of how many hours would be required until I had done one door.

2) I would require the customer to sign a waiver absolving me of any responsibility in the event that something went awry.

3) I would some use variation on the pilot-less router bit suggestion which would probably involve some sort of "carriage" into which the doors could be clamped and to which the necessary straight edge guides attached. This (these) would, of course have to be included in the overall cost.

The inside corner "miters" would have to be carved in by hand. This is not difficult when you are dealing with a small round over. But it can be fussy and time consuming.

4) One door would have to be completed and approved (again in writing) by the customer before any further work was done. The "miters" are not going to look like "sawn" miters but are going to be cut into end grain at each corner. It will not be too prominent with a small RO but I would still want customer approval before I committed 22 doors.

If the customer was OK with all of that, I would not hesitate to do the work.

I am curious about one thing. Were the doors shipped directly to you? And then coated without the customer ever having seen them first? If so, I would suggest that was an oversight you might want to try and avoid in the future...

[John R. White]

Quarter rounding joined stiles and rails leaves ugly joints. There's no way around it, except carving it to look coped. Doors and windows that I have seen treated like this look like someone without a clue was let loose with a running router. Fun to watch, but a pain to clean up after.

Try stop chamfers. You can pitch it as "Craftsman Style Stop Chamfers". Stay 1" from all the corners, and there's no carving.

John R. White