Leather decorating

[Todd Suire]

I have a customer who will potentially order some leather portfolios. Other than burning the design into the material, what other methods can be used to color the design? He's looking for a gold design imprint.

[George D Gabert]

If the pattern is not to intricate you can gold leaf the design. You put on the size (glue) and then press in the gold leaf. And then seal.

GDG

[Todd Suire]

George,
Do you laser the gold leaf, or cut the outlined design after glueing the gold leaf to the material? And, is it pretty sturdy, as in it won't wear off easily? These are going to be executive gifts.

[Mike Null]

Probably the most common method is hot stamping or embossing/debossing.

[George D Gabert]

The size is the glue, the hard part is to get the glue in the proper place / pattern. The gold leaf is put over the size and pressed into place. The gold leaf is thinner than tissue paper. And then rubbed into place. Where the size is not the leaf just floate away.

It is my understanding that this is how they used to put the gold trim on olden time bibles and and book bindings.

The last project I did using gold and silver leaf, I got the matereials from our local craft store. It was to be put on a motorcyle gas tank decoration. But to stand up to the elements we clear coated over it.

GDG

[Todd Suire]

Thanks guys. I appreciate the help.

[Colleen Williams]

Todd,

What about Laser Foil? I haven't had a chance to play with it yet, but the place where I purchased my laser from stocks it and the rep was showing me items that had been done with it. It comes in several different colours, gold being one of them, and they had indicated that it could be used on many different substrates. I know that the LaserBits website has it on there as well. You may want to check it out.

[Joe Hayes]

[QUOTE=Colleen Williams;1275073]Todd,

What about Laser Foil? I haven't had a chance to play with it yet, but the place where I purchased my laser from stocks it and the rep was showing me items that had been done with it. It comes in several different colours, gold being one of them, and they had indicated that it could be used on many different substrates. I know that the LaserBits website has it on there as well. You may want to check it out.[/QUOTE

The foils work nice for some items. You place it on then kiss cut it to get your lettering or artwork then remove the part you don't need (weed away).
In this case you would need to be very careful not to cut into the leather. Secondly you would have problem with the foil not "wearing" good on a
portfolio. Since the foil is about 2 mil thick it does not handle being "handled" as much as a portfolio might be used. IMHO

[Martin Boekers]

How about cloth appliques? Never tried it but they use it for leather jackets and sport uniforms so it should stand up to abuse.

Also I would check with a local leather shop, they may already have a product that they use.

check with Twill USA , you would need a heat press though.


Marty

[Bill Cunningham]

I used to have a lot of hand settable type for the hot stamping machine, but those 'one offs' got to be a real pain.. If the portfolios are all imprinted with the same logo, then hotstamping is the way to go..(If you have a hot stamping machine) The hot stamping foil itself can also be used as a 'cheap leaf'. A fine brush, or a glue pen can be used to coat a shallow laser etch with glue, then pressing the hot stamping foil onto the glued surface and pulling it off will let it separate from the carrier and stick to the surface.. The etch is only the pattern guide for the glue.. Old foil that's lived past it's shelf life works best for this, because it barely sticks to the carrier anyway..

[Martin Boekers]

Here are a couple of possibilities.

This is a decal system I used for a limited run of books I published awhile back.
It has a few steps involved, but at the time i couldn't find a better way to do short runs with keeping expenses down.

http://www.pulsarprofx.com/

You may be able to accomplish this a bit easier by using CLT transfer paper then heat pressing it on to the journal. After you do that use a toner reactive
foil to adhere to the toner you just put down. Check these guys out for more info.


http://www.thermotype.com/


This foils are pretty cool and can allow you to make certificates, scratch off cards, business cards many different things without the expense
of a foil press and custom dies.

If you do have a foil press I believe there is a material you can laser to make your die, not cheap, but cheaper than having dies made. I just can think of the supplier offhand.


Marty

[Lee DeRaud]

If you do have a foil press I believe there is a material you can laser to make your die, not cheap, but cheaper than having dies made. I just can think of the supplier offhand.Would delrin work?

[Doug Griffith]

Would delrin work?

I laser quite a bit of Delrin and it lasers great. Another name for it is Acetal

Industrial Plastic Supply has a fairly good deal on it for small quantities:
http://www.indplastic.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=detail&id=2688722&product=65

[Lee DeRaud]

I laser quite a bit of Delrin and it lasers great. Another name for it is AcetalSorry, I know it's laserable...my question should have been, "Will delrin work in a foil press?"

[Martin Boekers]

Lee,

I'll try to find my notes on that. I'm not sure how much delrin costs.
It seem this material was about $35 for a 6x8" piece. This will drive me nuts till I find it now.:mad:


Marty

[Doug Griffith]

Lee,

I'll try to find my notes on that. I'm not sure how much delrin costs.
It seem this material was about $35 for a 6x8" piece. This will drive me nuts till I find it now.:mad:


Marty

Take a look at the link I provided earlier. It's about $17 for 12" x 24" x .125", $28 for 12" x 24" x .187"

[Martin Boekers]

I'm not sure if Delrin will work. I did find the link to the product.
Quite a bit more than I remembered it!:eek:

$74 for a 6"x6" sheet!!!

There may be more suppliers out there but Jackson Marketing is one that's been around for a bit.


http://www.rubberstampmaterials.com/browseproducts/Silicone-Hot-Stamping-Die-Material.html


Marty

[Todd Suire]

Guys,

These are all great ideas. Sorry for not keeping up...my Internet connection was down for a few days. I was on the verge of withdrawals...

I've got some sample portfolios coming in a few days so I'll be able to do some testing.

Thanks again.

[Paul Brinkmeyer]

In the "for what it's worth" catagory,

If the customer is not stuck on imprint, and depending on the portfolio design, and you have access to embroidery, I have embroidered leather portfolios in the past and customers have loved them.

Sure is a lot of "ifs and ands"

[Mike Milli]

I'm a real newbie here, and to laser engraving, but I am doing a process that may work on leather.

I am engraving black plastic that I want to highlight with color. What I am doing is taking wide packing tape and masking off the area I am engraving. I engrave right through the tape, then mask off the rest of the piece and spray the area with Krylon paint. After it is all dry, I peel away the mask, and the intricate engraving is all filled with paint.

The paint actually lies below the surface, so wear has not been an issue. I don't know, but gold paint may give you a cool effect.....

[Todd Suire]

Thanks Mike,

That idea sounds like it's worth a try, and it's relatively cheap and simple. I emailed the folks at Laser Bits about the durability of the Laser Foil and am waiting to hear back from them.

[Mike Null]

I use laser foil regularly. It is not durable. I use it only on plaques for that reason.

[Bill Cunningham]

Sorry, I know it's laserable...my question should have been, "Will delrin work in a foil press?"

I don't think so.. I'm not sure if it will withstand the heat usually about 200-250 dF .. The laserable stuff is aluminum backed silicone. The silicone used is a harder material than normal silicone, and it ain't cheap.. Especially if you screw a piece up, and will require a metalcutting bandsaw to cut the master block down to size. Have used the hard metal backed water washable photopolymer for H.S. dies, and they work well if you keep them working. If the phone rings, and you don't pull the die out of the machine the heat will ruin it.. The Silicone dies withstand heat no problem, and they have some flexibility to overcome poor surfaces, but 11 point unmounted mag dies held with heat tape are far cheaper in the long run..

Silicone Hotstamping Die Material (http://www.rubberstampmaterials.com/browseproducts/Silicone-Hot-Stamping-Die-Material.HTML)

[Todd Suire]

I use laser foil regularly. It is not durable. I use it only on plaques for that reason.

Thanks Mike N.;
Haven't heard back from Laser Bits, so I'll probably try the paint first whenever my samples come in.

[Todd Suire]

I'm a real newbie here, and to laser engraving, but I am doing a process that may work on leather.

I am engraving black plastic that I want to highlight with color. What I am doing is taking wide packing tape and masking off the area I am engraving. I engrave right through the tape, then mask off the rest of the piece and spray the area with Krylon paint. After it is all dry, I peel away the mask, and the intricate engraving is all filled with paint.

The paint actually lies below the surface, so wear has not been an issue. I don't know, but gold paint may give you a cool effect.....

Mike,

Do you engrave the entire area of your design, or just an outline?

[Mike Milli]

I am real new to this, so I have not ventured very far, or had time to do so, but here is what I have been using that process on.

Here is a picture of a stock that has been masked-off, and engraved. I then mask the stock off completely and paint it with Krylon Fusion paint. When the paint is cured and dry, I peal away the masking, and it leaves the paint at the bottom of the engraving. The letters are blocked, so the entire letter is engraved away.

You must make certain the mask is stuck to the product very well before painting it. If you are not careful you can get paint bleeding under the mask. If you make a couple of light coats, rather than one heavy coat, it works much better as well.
http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f340/dtech1/IMG_0909_s.jpg

http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f340/dtech1/gg3ss.jpg

[Dan Hintz]

Mike,

What kind of results have you had with durability of the Fusion? Without testing myself (or know someone that has), I would have leaned towards a 2-part ceramic fill, or some other similarly hard paint.

It looks good, though!

[Mike Milli]

The paint lies far enough below the surface that it doesn't get worn or scratched. The first stock I had done this way, a couple of years ago, long before I was doing the engraving myself, is still just as nice as the day it was done.

I'm not against getting a better product, but the "Fusion" from Krylon is supposedly "made for bonding to plastic". So far, seems to be working well.

[Mike Null]

Not that you need another option but if you should want to use an enamel you can first prime with a suitable plastic coat then paint whatever you want over it. That's according to Rustoleum tech support.

[Todd Suire]

I ran some tests last night. First I just rastered the portfolio bare, and it came out very nice and clean. Then I tried using masking tape to cut out the design and I was going to paint fill; I was doing something wrong and never could cut the mask out of the tape in order to paint. In the process I burned thru the skin of the portfolio and had internal cardboard flaming inside my machine. :eek: But I caught it in time (laser surveillance :), good ventilation, and 50psi thru the air assist cone) and all is still good.

I called the customer and explained what I COULD do and he was excited! So now I've got the order and will simply raster the portfolios and ship them on their merry way.

"Thank you" to all of you who have offered guidance.

Although, I would really like to figure out how to cut a tape mask in order to paint-fill a design. I have a sign just waiting to be burned and painted.

Cheers!

[Mike Milli]

At the power/speed you can engrave leather at may make it tough to go through the mask, unless it is very thin.

When I first started experimenting with the mask, I didn't have tape wide enough to cover the entire engraved area. I used two swaths of tape, and over lapped them by 1/8". BAD move on my part. The added thickness of the tape where it was double prevented the laser from penetrating, ONLY in that area. The product looked good, so I picked it up. Well, that was the end of that piece! If I had been paying attention, I could have re-burned it and probably been OK, but I just replaced the plastic part and started from scratch.