Help me choose a miter saw pls.? [Archive] - Sawmill Creek Woodworking Community

Mike Rees

12-03-2009, 10:49 AM

Hey Gang,

I'm on to my next major tool purchase. Miter saw. I had originally planned on buying the DeWalt 10", but it seems most everybody I talk to tells me to get the 12. I don't know if its a typical 'more horsepower is better' type deal you get when you talk about cars or what not. Of course, once you step up to the 12 you can go single or dual bevel. And if you're looking at duel why not just get the 8.5" slider instead? And so it goes, on and on.

Expected uses for my saw:

Case out my non-cased windows
Build shed
Crown (I have 9' ceilings downstairs and 8' ceilings upstairs if that helps w/ the size crown I might expect to buy)
Finish my basement
Trim my basement after finishing
Build clubhouse for my girls
Pergola?
Might build a miter saw stand
Storage tables/shelves
A better workbench
Built-in closet organizer/storage

So, what would you guys opt for? Do you mostly cut crown on the fence or laying face down and using a digital angle finder? I have read that the Cut-N-Crown system is a collosal waste of money for what you actually get however the results are easily attainable/good. To use the system though you need a 12" saw. Some say a 12 wobbles too much and you should get the 10 and cut on the fence if your crown isn't too big.

I'm so confused.

Mr. Jeff Smith

12-03-2009, 12:50 PM

I have the 12" SCMS Milwaukee, like it a lot.
Previously had the 10" Makita, also very nice. The 12" actually has a bit better precision for me and can handle bigger projects.

There are a lot of discussions on this topic, so lots of opinions for you to check out.

Michael Drew

12-03-2009, 2:17 PM

The Dewalt 12 compound slider, in my humble opinion is the best one you can buy. It’s hell for stout, plenty powerful and easy to use. I’m on my second one since they first came out about eight years ago. I dropped my first off a two story floor of a home I was framing up, or I’m sure I’d still have that one. The 12” capacity is very nice as it allows you to by more creative with crown molding of large dimensions. I use mine for everything from rough framing, to interior / exterior trim to woodworking. I’d also suggest you pick up a good portable work stand for it. Get one with big tires so you can drag it up / down stairs. I have an older Delta, ‘kickstand portable work stand and love the thing. Unfortunately, they don’t make them anymore.

Dave Gaul

12-03-2009, 2:33 PM

For one, it depends on what your budget is. Smaller diameter sliders are great for wider stock, but limits you on stock thickness.

I have used an entry level Delta 10" SBMS and Craftsmen 10" SBCMS and they served their purpose just fine, nothing much more that 2X4's and picture frames.

Currently using a Ryobi 10" SBCMS and while it is no top-of-the-line saw, equipped with a Frued Avanti finishing blade it works quite well for my needs.

If $$ is not too much of a concern, I've been seeing GREAT reviews on the newer digital Milwaukee 12" miter saws, I think WOOD had a review recently on them.

Mike Rees

12-03-2009, 2:38 PM

I'm definitely cost conscious - those Milwaukees go even higher then the DeWalts I was considering. I'd really like to think a 10 will cover me - I'm not the kind of guy that likes to over buy unless there is a great reason for doing so.

For instance, my Drill is a DeWalt XRP DCD960. WAY more than I need, but I bought it b/c of the Nano lithium batteries that came bundled w/ it. The batteries allow me to buy other tools bare, thus saving me money in the long run but giving me added benefit.

Now for the miter saw? I just don't know enough about them to say the 12 is worth the extra 100 bucks over the 10. I'm pretty sure I don't need a slider, but like anything you ask somebody who has one and they all go "Oh yah can't live without it spend the extra money".

Mac McQuinn

12-03-2009, 2:39 PM

I was also at HD yesterday and noticed the Ridgid & Milwaukee being promoted with free collapsible work-site stand and Makita is offered with either free circular saw or worm drive saw thrown in:eek:. Makita is assembled in USA. Ridgid, China. Not sure on the Milwaukee, perhaps Mexico. Store Associate told me Milwaukee and Ridgid are owned by same company now. If you need a circular saw the Makita might be a good bet. If you need a stand look at both Ridgid or Milwaukee. I personally own the Hitachi CF10fs and love it. Physically it's lighter and smaller than most of the rest. I love the accuracy of my cuts. The Makita, Milwaukee and Ridgid all seem very heavy to me, if your going to be moving the saw a lot, this could be a factor. JMO

Mac

Dave Gaul

12-03-2009, 3:05 PM

Then I would say get whatever you can get the best deal on, like Mac's examples. I don't think you'll go wrong with DeWalt, Rigid, Hitachi or even the mid range Craftsmen's. Ryobi's even get decent reviews. Don't go slider if you don't need it... they can be tough to handle sometimes... heard of some horror stories with 'em.

My $100 Ryobi has been doing everything I need so far!

Scott T Smith

12-03-2009, 3:21 PM

I've had a 12" Dewalt SCMS, a Craftsman 10" SCMS, a Makita 10" miter saw, and a Kapex.

The Dewalt has been the workhorse for construction activities. I had the Makita before buying the Dewalt, and it's capacity was too limited for my construction needs.

The Dewalt is great for general construction projects, but limited in terms of precision for detailed cabinet type work.

The Craftsman was a nice saw, and I really enjoyed the laser system. It was probably the best compromise saw of all, as it was more precise than the Dewalt.

Not much needs to be said abou the Kapex; the precision makes it a joy to use. I hate to wear out a saw of this caliber on general framing needs though; it's reserved for the wood shop.

The Makita sat unusued pretty much for several years after I obtained the Dewalt and then the Craftsman - that's how much I utilized the SCMS aspect of both.

Karl Brogger

12-03-2009, 3:32 PM

The best saw I've ever used for crown was a Makita with an odd sized blade. 5-1/2"? something like that anyway. It was tiny. I was using it to cut 8-1/2" crown, and would not have wanted anything other than that saw. I can't find it on their website though. Mitres were like glass it cut so smoothly.

Personally, I stay away from anything from DeWalt.
For the most part I would also stay away from the 12" sliders, unless you really need the extra capacity.

Dual compound is a waste for crown. You bevel it one direction then flip from either the top or the bottom of the crown being against the fence, and change the corresponding angle. (At least it works that way with 45* crown, I'm unsure about others.

Hitachi makes a very nice 10", also an 8-1/2", but the fence is pretty much useless on the 8.5" for cutting smaller crown standing up.
The Makita 10" sliders are also pretty nice.
I know the 10" Hitachi has a soft start feature, I'm willing that adds some life to the tool.

Using a good blade is important!

I don't have any experience with the Milwaukee slider. They discontinued the standard 10" chop saw which was a bummer. For the money that thing was hard to beat. I've used up a couple of em'.

Dave Gaul

12-03-2009, 3:42 PM

Scott and Karl have great points too...

Love the laser on mine, and wasn't fully happy with my Ryobi with the stock blade, I put the new thin kerf Freud Avanti finish blade, 60 teeth I think.. and WOW what a difference!! VERY smooth cuts!

Gerry Werth

12-03-2009, 4:13 PM

Mike,
As you can readily see, lots of opinions here. Most everyone has their favorite tool. I too looked around, compared prices, capabilities, prices, warranties, etc, and chose the Ridgid 12" SCMS, with the MSUV. I have since mounted my SCMS on a permanent bench, and sold the MSUV. I just didn't need portability, as I almost exclusively work out of my shop. Go to this site to read some reviews, http://www.consumersearch.com/miter-saws, which also have links to other wood mags and their reviews. I like the lifetime warranty on Ridgid.
The laser if very accurate, and adjustable. I upgraded the blade to an 80 tooth for better finish cuts, but their 60 tooth is good for most miter work. The only thing bad about the Ridgid is the weight...it's not really "portable" for me, but mounted on the MSUV its not too bad.
Now, cutting crown molding is very easy, you don't need the jig you referred to, and you can certainly make your own jig to hold it in the upside down position against the vertical fence. For this you don't really need double bevel or even compound cuts. For most cuts you set the miter either 45* left or right. :):)

Todd Moody

12-03-2009, 4:41 PM

I recently purhcased a 12" Milwaukee SCMS myself after a great deal of waffling on selection of saw. I was also considering the Makita but was unable to locate a store that had one on display.

With respect to the 12" SCMS DeWalt, I've read a lot of reports (mainly Amazon) that the newer DW718 is not as stout as the original DW708. I can't say from personal experience if this is true. I can tell you my father-in-law has used his 708 in his shop for business probably every day for the last 5-6 years for furniture refinish work and its a great saw. He has it on the DW723 stand. I watched CL for awhile trying to find a 708 before giving in to the Milwaukee.

I purchased my Milwaukee for $649 from a local HD, but then it recently went on sale and they refunded me the difference (nice customer service.) I thought the DeWalt was more expensive, actually.

I put the Milwaukee on the Bosch T4B gravity rise stand to make it easy to move around both my small shop & my property in the event I want to build outbuildings.

I subscribe to the theory that I'd like to not be hassled with buying too small and having to deal with selling/buying in the future, so I went for 12" out of the gate.

-Todd

Michael Drew

12-07-2009, 7:33 PM

I have to take my words back…. This past weekend I happened to be wandering around a tool store (uh, of course!) and they had all the major saws on display. I was dismally disappointed with all of them. The Dewalt I have and love is definitely not what they are making now. I found the new model to be quite cheesy is comparison. I have my doubts it would hold up to heavy construction in comparison to mine. I then looked at the rest and if I had to buy one today, I would probably walk out with the Bosch. It looked to be the most robust of them all with some nice user friendly functionalities (like the adjustable grip). It also looked to me to have the quickest / best angle gauges. One complaint I’ve always had with mine is the difficulty reading the tilt angle. After using my ‘old’ dewalt for years, I would have difficulty with any of the new models with the exception of the Bosch. I’m glad mine works perfectly, still….knock on wood.

One other plug for the compound dual slider worth mentioning is it is quick. If you are running a lot of trim on a job that you had to bid with low contingency, it’s very nice to not have to get creative when dropping the board on the saw. It cuts in all directions, so you don’t have to flop the board back and forth. Hard to describe that with any sort of intelligence, but others who have ran a lot trim, hopefully, will understand my point.

Don Morris

12-07-2009, 8:03 PM

I have a 10" Makita SCMS. Love it. I thought I'd go up to a 12" but after a few years of looking and testing, I'm staying with my 10". I just added a couple inches to the height of the fence for taller crown. Some of the 12"s start to wobble at the end of their slide. So if you're looking for precision...10". The Kapex, the $1300.00 top-of-the-line saw is just a 10", does that say anything? Take a machinist's engineer square to the BORG that has them all and drop the blades down and pull them out all the way at the 0 degree mark. Put the engineer square up against the fence/blade. Is it right on? Can you move it? Sometimes the vertical or horizontal positioning of the handle is more comfortable on one or the other and that may be the swaying factor for you when you're working with it for a long time. Lasers tend to wash out in bright sunlight, I'm not excited about them. The comments about good blades are ever so true. My Forrest Chopmaster is worth every penny, but adds to your total. The 12" DeWalt cuts a wide board. If that's your need. Go for it.

Robert Chapman

12-07-2009, 8:08 PM

Mike - I just upgraded from an older Porter Cable compound miter saw to a Bosch 4410 10" dual bevel sliding compound miter saw. So of course I'm going to say that it's the best saw going. I went with the 10" slider because it will cut up to 12" wide boards - didn't think that the little more added by the 12" saw was worth the money.I figured that I might as well get a saw with all the capabilities so I don't have to upgrade again. Not a cheap saw at $614 from Amazon. Read all the reviews and the saw was well rated. So far I really like it. It is dead on accurate out of the box. All the controls are up front. It is heavy at about 55 lbs. but I'm not moving it. The only down side that I can find is dust collection - it's a joke without attaching a vac or dust collection system which I have not done.

There - end of Bosch commercial.

Sean Tracey

12-08-2009, 12:08 AM

Victor Robinson

12-08-2009, 1:31 AM

I've got the Hitachi C10FCE2. It was my first CMS and I got it for many of the same purposes you've listed, Mike. It's frequently available on sale at Amazon for $100 (currently $125).

The max. cutting width is approximately 5.75". If you anticipate you'll be wanting to crosscut wider molding or stock frequently, get a SCMS. We just installed new 5" baseboards in our kitchen and the Hitachi was excellent. I've also used it to cut 4x4's and 2x6's without any problems, with the stock blade. I haven't yet used it to make finish cuts in hardwood, but when I do I'll probably switch out the blade.

Only thing I wish it had was a laser - but that can be added aftermarket for around $20.

Mike Rees

12-08-2009, 9:22 AM

My problem is this isn't the only tool I still need to buy. I still need a nailer, another battery, starrett angle finder, etc. etc. If the only thing left to buy was a miter I'd probably walk up the price ladder but right now I'm tight.

10" sliders will never pass the household CFO (wife) - so for me its either a straight up 10" compound (I still like the DeWalt version 713), or MAYBE the 8.5" slider. Downside to the 8.5" for me is the crown you can nest is very small so I'd need to cut it flat. Which means I need to buy the Bosch Miter Finder angle tool - I'm a lunt at this stuff and hopefully the tool would pay for itself in miscut wood.

The DW713 can cut up to 4.5" crown on the fence - I probably wouldn't go much bigger than that unless I built it up. This saw might be perfectly fine for me (and it can cut a 2x6).

Kent A Bathurst

12-08-2009, 9:41 AM

Mike - FWIW -

My Delta 12" has been working great for 6+ years, but out of production, so was recently helping a friend set up a general-purpose shop in his garage, had him get the Dewalt 12". Have used it often - I like it. He's not very tool-friendly, but it took him only 10 minutes to square-plumb-level (with me peeking over his shoulder) and another 10 minutes (with no peeking) to get the accessory laser installed and aligned dead-nuts.