Shop Progress ... Need some advice.

[Adam Carl]

So I got the panel installed. Now I need to decide how to run circuits to the machines. I'm leaning towards insulating the walls, adding drywall and running everything in EMT. The ceiling is still up for debate. What do people think about the ceiling? Part of me wants to keep it open, the other part is thinking about how to effectively heat it. I am going to add collar ties so I can remove the lower supports but I'm undecided on adding a drop ceiling.

The attached pictures should show what I mean.

As far as getting power to the table saw I have 2 options. a) Since the shop is on the second floor I could run the circuit under the floor. b) Drop the service down from the ceiling. Does a drop down get in the way?

Other thoughts on this space welcome.

[JohnT Fitzgerald]

OK, that is one seriously awesome space!!! nice.

I'm not sure about *all* the machines...but if running stuff under the floor (from the 1st floor ceiling) is an option, I would definitely run power AND dust collection to the TS that way....

[Von Bickley]

My personal opinion would be to use romex and conceal all the wiring if you are going to insulate and use drywall. For the tablesaw, I would come from under the floor with a stub-out for the saw and for receptacles on an out-feed table.
For the ceiling, I would insulate and drywall that. I would paint that ceiling white to reflect the light. I would also add ceiling fans in order to circulate the air and move hot air down during cold weather.
Just my opinions and everybody has one......

[Mike Cruz]

I would run all your wires in the walls... in, what do they call it, MX? Put press board (the stuff they use on the outsides of buildings) on the walls, not drywall. That way you can screw jigs and things ANYWHERE you want, not just at studs. Also, you don't have to worry about punching holes in the walls with boards and flying objects.

How the heck are you going to shoot hoops if you put in a drop ceiling? Duuuuuuuuuuhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! !!! :D

Seriously, I would leave the high ceilings. Flipping even an 8 foot board with a 10 foot ceiling means only a foot clearance at each end of the board...not to mention if you have lights or anything else below ceiling height. Put a fan (or two if need be) on the ceiling to push the hot air back down.

What I would do, and plan to in my shop, is put sheet insullation (comes in 4 x 8 sheets at the borgs) on the ceiling. Screws right up there with screws and washers. Be sure to have the area between the sheet insullation and the roof vented to you don't get hot air trapped creating condensation.

Add a large fan on one (or both) gable end to vent the shop. It will get rid of dust (so you don't have to run a filter all the time) AND get rid of hot air in the summer.

GREAT space by the way. LOVE it. It looks like what a shop should feel like.

[Gerry Werth]

Adam,
Very nice shop in the works...looks like NYW. :) I would think you would want to insulate the walls and ceiling, but like you, do you really want to cover up the wonderful wood. Personally, I would drywall or use OSB or ply and paint it white for maximum light.
Using EMT gives you more flexibility if you change your mind about machine placement, or add machines. I personally went with the "in the wall" romex, and hopefully don't have to make any major changes. I did the drop down from the ceiling for table saw, planer and jointer in the middle of my shop. The drop down has not caused any problems for me, but I see that you also have your router mounted in the TS extension, and since you have access from below, I would run that line up from below. Had I thought about that ahead of pouring my concrete floor, I would have buried conduit to pull wire from the floor. :confused: Too late now. I did use heavy enough wire, 10 and 12 ga. so I can go to 220V if need be.

[Mike Cruz]

Oh, yeah, forgot to address the drop down issue. Yup, I have drop downs for my DC, TS, Planer, and Jointer. No issues. For me, they don't get in the way.

[Scott T Smith]

Several observations.

1 - might as well plan on insulating the shop - you won't regret it later.
2 - if you have the option of bringing power and dust collection up from below, it will keep the shop much cleaner and easier to use.
3 - I lost my old woodshop to a fire last year - most likely because the previous owner sunk a staple too deep in some romex and it arced on a hot day, causing a fire in the rafters. Having learned a hard lesson, I now prefer wiring to be inside of conduit and located in a place where you probably wont' drive a nail into it.

In my new shop I installed an oversized conduit infrastruture through the slab and walls, that will allow me to pull wiring in the future as needed for new equipment. This keeps things clean and hidden, protected and safe, yet versatile to handle future needs.

[Don Jarvie]

Very nice space. To echo what the others have said.

Even with the collar ties you should have plently of room. I have a similar ceiling and have 12-13 ft in the middle.

I did the wiring in the wall with insultation and plywood, like Mike said you can hang anything anywhere.

Wire the whole shop before you cover the walls so you can see if you have enough outlets. I used 12g with 20 amp plugs/breakers for everything. 10g for the TS and heater. I found 20a outlets on the net for 1.50 a pop.

Run wire for - electric heater if that will be your heat source, ceiling fans, air cleaner, under cabinet lights, task lights like track lights for certain machines. Speaker wire if you want to have a stereo.

Run anything to the middle of the shop including DC under the floor. Nothing can get in the way.

[Mike Thomas]

No ceiling! Many times I wish that I had not put one in my shop. And, how awesome is it to take a break from cutting up some wood and shooting some hoops! I vote for electrical and dust collection in the floor if possible. Makes connection to the various pieces of equipment much easier and convienent especially if you have a fixed set-up and don't move your tools around a lot.

[Cliff Towle]

What would keep you working out there more? Ambiance (high, wood ceiling), or comfort (insulation). Personally, I'd keep the great looking high ceiling and add a woodstove & ceiling fans.

[Lee Schierer]

It would help to know where you are located as climate will dictate the insulation needs.

You'll also have to decide if the hoop stays or goes away.

In NW PA where I live, I would insulate the walls, covering them with OSB, then cover and insulate the roof up to the 10'-12' level and leave the peak area open for ventilation, installing either a good sized gable vent or a roof ridge vent and possibly a fan.

[Wayne Cannon]

I guess I'm in the minority here, but if the cosmetics don't bother you, I would run the electrical on the surface in PVC conduit. Mine are in ceiling and in the walls, but it's a pain any time I want to modify a circuit. I ran lots of 120 V and a number of 240 V receptacles before paneling the ceiling and walls, but still find I want to make occasional modifications, like a new 240 V receptacle or a separate 120 V circuit for my disk/belt sander for automated dust collection control.

Have you considered insulating and paneling the rafters for better insulation, a lighter color, and still retain your great vertical clearance?

By the way, be careful and read about foam insulation board or consult your local building department. I seem to recall something about the fire code requiring that foam insulation panels be covered, since most varieties are flammable.

[Adam Carl]

I am located in Western NY just south of Buffalo. Like NW PA it gets pretty cold.


It would help to know where you are located as climate will dictate the insulation needs.

You'll also have to decide if the hoop stays or goes away.

In NW PA where I live, I would insulate the walls, covering them with OSB, then cover and insulate the roof up to the 10'-12' level and leave the peak area open for ventilation, installing either a good sized gable vent or a roof ridge vent and possibly a fan.

[Adam Carl]

Fire is definitely a concern. Running the electric in conduit seems like it would help with this.



Several observations.

1 - might as well plan on insulating the shop - you won't regret it later.
2 - if you have the option of bringing power and dust collection up from below, it will keep the shop much cleaner and easier to use.
3 - I lost my old woodshop to a fire last year - most likely because the previous owner sunk a staple too deep in some romex and it arced on a hot day, causing a fire in the rafters. Having learned a hard lesson, I now prefer wiring to be inside of conduit and located in a place where you probably wont' drive a nail into it.

In my new shop I installed an oversized conduit infrastruture through the slab and walls, that will allow me to pull wiring in the future as needed for new equipment. This keeps things clean and hidden, protected and safe, yet versatile to handle future needs.

[Adam Carl]

No ceiling! Many times I wish that I had not put one in my shop. And, how awesome is it to take a break from cutting up some wood and shooting some hoops! I vote for electrical and dust collection in the floor if possible. Makes connection to the various pieces of equipment much easier and convienent especially if you have a fixed set-up and don't move your tools around a lot.

The basketball hoop was there when I bought the place. I am tempted to leave it in some form or another. I will have fixed setup and I removed all wallboard on the ceiling below so I have access beneath.

[Chris Damm]

I insulated well and covered the walls with OSB. I surface ran conduit for my electrical. I love it as no workshop layout is stable and it makes reconfiguration easy. If you're in Buffalo you will want good insulation over aesthetics!

[Eduard Nemirovsky]

By the way, be careful and read about foam insulation board or consult your local building department. I seem to recall something about the fire code requiring that foam insulation panels be covered, since most varieties are flammable.

I am in process of building my shop and I did decided to use spray foam insulation. My county inspector asked for ES report of product (ICC Evaluation Service, report ESR-2600). It is depend what product you are planning to use but generally you will need a thermal barrier of 1/2 inch thick gypsum wallboard or " an equivalent 15-minute thermal barrier complying with". And county inspector decided that 3/4 plywood or 1/2 drywall will be sufficient as a barrier.

Ed.

[Jim O'Dell]

Is this an attached building (to the house) or a detached building? Is the first floor a garage, or living space? The answers to these questions may dictate what you can put on the walls. Code in your area may require you to use drywall. If so, you could then put wood on top of that, but that would be an added expense. Jim.

[Don Jarvie]

Another thing to do. Check the structure itself like the rafters, walls, etc.

I reinforced my roof beam and added extra 2x4s in the walls, added joist hangers, etc to make sure it's structually sound.

For overkill I used deck screws for everything so its not coming down anytime soon.

[Pete Paris]

Looking at your table saw and the space in general, I would suggect a false column about 4'-3" to the left of the table saw BLADE. This would do several things. It would give you a place to run a single circuit for power to the saw, it would create a space for the dust collection with out a tripping hazard and as I did once, I put a small table around the post (Plywood with a square cut in it cut in half) I also put a place for my wrenches and built a box with slanted dados to house my blades. The reason for the 4'-3" is if you want to run sheet goods through the saw.

The ceiling, in my opinion needs to be insulated and covered. Don't forget to get the foam spacers to put between your roof and the insulation, very important then you can run a duct down the center for heat and air, but the return air has to come from a place outside the shop area so dust will not get into the system and the system may be in a position to be zoned off the one in the house already. As I read in earlier post the light will be brighter if put up against painted wall board. Anytime you can afford to cover electrical wire is a plus. It is hard to clean around and collects dust easy. I would take the time and figure out what you want to accomplish and one other suggestion as I am in the process of doing is making the space a future room. I have my shop designed that when I am gone my wife can move the tools out and put furniture in and rent it out or sell the place with a completed mother in law suite and that adds to todays property greatly. hope this is helpfull.

[Adam Carl]

Is this an attached building (to the house) or a detached building? Is the first floor a garage, or living space? The answers to these questions may dictate what you can put on the walls. Code in your area may require you to use drywall. If so, you could then put wood on top of that, but that would be an added expense. Jim.


It is a detached garage and the shop is on the second floor.

[Adam Carl]

Pete,

Thanks for that advice. The false column makes a lot of sense.

Adam


Looking at your table saw and the space in general, I would suggect a false column about 4'-3" to the left of the table saw BLADE. This would do several things. It would give you a place to run a single circuit for power to the saw, it would create a space for the dust collection with out a tripping hazard and as I did once, I put a small table around the post (Plywood with a square cut in it cut in half) I also put a place for my wrenches and built a box with slanted dados to house my blades. The reason for the 4'-3" is if you want to run sheet goods through the saw.

The ceiling, in my opinion needs to be insulated and covered. Don't forget to get the foam spacers to put between your roof and the insulation, very important then you can run a duct down the center for heat and air, but the return air has to come from a place outside the shop area so dust will not get into the system and the system may be in a position to be zoned off the one in the house already. As I read in earlier post the light will be brighter if put up against painted wall board. Anytime you can afford to cover electrical wire is a plus. It is hard to clean around and collects dust easy. I would take the time and figure out what you want to accomplish and one other suggestion as I am in the process of doing is making the space a future room. I have my shop designed that when I am gone my wife can move the tools out and put furniture in and rent it out or sell the place with a completed mother in law suite and that adds to todays property greatly. hope this is helpfull.