pine in a jointer

[Kevin Guarnotta]

Hi Guys,
I'm relatively new to the forum. I've been reading it a bit, but this is my first post.
After all I have read, it seems like it would be best to get a jointer & planer to make sure all my boards are square and true, to get the best jointing out of them.
I am looking into making some large doors-and given the cost of materials, I planned on making a mockup out of some basic 2x pine. My question-will using this cheap pine be bad for my blades? On the one hand I figure it is really soft, so it should not be bad for the blades, on the other hand it is pine-so maybe the sap would be bad for the blades.

Any thoughts-or alternatives on the mock-up?

thanks

[Jamie Buxton]

Pine isn't bad on blades, but knots are. Knots are likely to put knicks on your knife edges.

[David Christopher]

Kevin, first off, welcome to the creek....Ive run 100s of BF of pine through my jointer and never a problem

[george wilson]

Except for knots,pine should be easy on your jointer. Are you cutting resin impregnated heart yellow pine?

[Michael Schwartz]

Hi Guys,
I'm relatively new to the forum. I've been reading it a bit, but this is my first post.

Welcome to the Creek

After all I have read, it seems like it would be best to get a jointer & planer to make sure all my boards are square and true, to get the best jointing out of them.

You have the right idea, there are other methods but if you have the means to get a jointer and planer they are the fastest

I am looking into making some large doors-and given the cost of materials, I planned on making a mockup out of some basic 2x pine. My question-will using this cheap pine be bad for my blades? On the one hand I figure it is really soft, so it should not be bad for the blades, on the other hand it is pine-so maybe the sap would be bad for the blades.

Just check it for staples, (dirt/gravel if it is that cheap) etc... Knots can be bad as well but you can avoid them. I have put hundreds of board feet of 2x10 pine through my jointer/planer and a few projects later I am on the same set of knives Allot of pine will pitch up equipment but even that can be cleaned up. [

Obviously use cheaper blades if you can. I have a cheap combo blade I throw on my table-saw when I am cutting junk, and well I never use my SCMS for final crosscutting so I am too lazy to ever change the blade in that until it is dull


Any thoughts-or alternatives on the mock-up?

Your not going to run it through a jointer or planer but Mdf or Particle board can also work for mock ups, as well as insulating foam, hard board, cardboard, paper, whatever does the job

thanks

Don't worry about it, be careful of major knots and run pine through your planer and jointer to your hearts content. If you run major amounts you might need to clean up some gunk at some point but you have to make a mess at some point to be a woodworker.

A good source for nicer pine, fir, etc... at home depot are floor joists as they are usually much straighter, and clearer as they need to be to meet the grade. 2x4's are nasty, period.

[Kevin Guarnotta]

I was just going to be using 2x6's, 2x8's and 2x10's. They are from HD, and not the best quality. I just picked stuff that was relatively straight.
It sounds like I should be using knot free wood? Don't imagine I'm going to find that in the cheap 2x from HD. I'd have to get their best wood for that. I guess I could do that too, and just glue the stuff up.

If I glue stuff together to get to the thickness I want, I'm thinking I need to glue it up first, then joint/plane it. as I imagine there is no way to glue it totally aligned. But then I'm jointing glued up stock-and I'm thinking the glue will gum up the blades. Am I over thinking this...what is the best sequence for this?

[David Christopher]

I was just going to be using 2x6's, 2x8's and 2x10's. They are from HD, and not the best quality. I just picked stuff that was relatively straight.
It sounds like I should be using knot free wood? Don't imagine I'm going to find that in the cheap 2x from HD. I'd have to get their best wood for that. I guess I could do that too, and just glue the stuff up.

If I glue stuff together to get to the thickness I want, I'm thinking I need to glue it up first, then joint/plane it. as I imagine there is no way to glue it totally aligned. But then I'm jointing glued up stock-and I'm thinking the glue will gum up the blades. Am I over thinking this...what is the best sequence for this?

A knot or two isnt going to hurt your blades, joint what you need to joint.....if a knot is going to chip your blades just imagine what really hard wood will do

[Jamie Buxton]

..if a knot is going to chip your blades just imagine what really hard wood will do..

In my experience, really hard wood slowly dulls blades, but it doesn't nick them. Knots, however, can nick the blades. I think what's happening is that the near-endgrain near the knot shocks the knife to nick the edge.

There is also some species-to-species difference that I don't understand. For instance, the knots in aspen just chew up planer knives. That's why the aspen in my local dealers has been surfaced with an abrasive planer, not the usual kind.

[David Christopher]

In my experience, really hard wood slowly dulls blades, but it doesn't nick them. Knots, however, can nick the blades. I think what's happening is that the near-endgrain near the knot shocks the knife to nick the edge.

There is also some species-to-species difference that I don't understand. For instance, the knots in aspen just chew up planer knives. That's why the aspen in my local dealers has been surfaced with an abrasive planer, not the usual kind.
Im not saying it cant happen, but if I need to joint a board, I will take that chance.....if I didnt use my jointer on bad or cheep lumber it would never get turned on. LOL

[Dan Forman]

If you are in the south, you should be able to find southern yellow pine, which tends to be much more clear of knots, especially in the longer and wider lumber, than we can find here in the Pacific northwest.

Dan

[Mike Cruz]

The only thing I would "warn" you about is sap build up on your machines when you run a lot of pine. The blades may "fling" sap inside the machine. Won't hurt it, but you might want to clean it up after you are done.

[Rod Sheridan]

I was just going to be using 2x6's, 2x8's and 2x10's. They are from HD, and not the best quality. I just picked stuff that was relatively straight.
It sounds like I should be using knot free wood? Don't imagine I'm going to find that in the cheap 2x from HD. I'd have to get their best wood for that. I guess I could do that too, and just glue the stuff up.

If I glue stuff together to get to the thickness I want, I'm thinking I need to glue it up first, then joint/plane it. as I imagine there is no way to glue it totally aligned. But then I'm jointing glued up stock-and I'm thinking the glue will gum up the blades. Am I over thinking this...what is the best sequence for this?

Kevin, welcome to the forum, and good luck with the dimensional lumber from HD.

There are a couple of issues with dimensional lumber, one is moisture content. I suggest you let the stuff sit in a dry area for a month or so.

The other issue is internal stresses in the wood.

You may find that the material warps so much that you can't get straight pieces without removing a large amount of material.

When I glue up items, I joint and plane them, glue them and then scrape/sand them.

With flat straight material, it will glue up flat and straight without requiring mechanical alignment methods. I tighten the clamps slightly, then use my finger tips to see if the pieces are aligned, a light tap with the side of my hand and they slide into alignment.

Regards, Rod.

[Pete Bradley]

Kiln dried S-P-F 2Xs often have knots hard enough to nick a blade. You could use doug fir, but a lot of that is sold green. You might look to see if there's a sawmill in your area since they're likely to have something "cheap" for sale.

Pete

[Roger Benton]

Kevin, welcome.
as others have said, should be no problem running pine through your machines. depending on your location you'll probably be getting either doug fir or southern yellow pine from HD, either way my only advice is to stick to 2x10's and 2x12's as much as possible, rip them down to needed dimensions in your shop. the bigger boards tend to be straighter and less knotty. good luck.

[Brian Kincaid]

The only thing I would "warn" you about is sap build up on your machines when you run a lot of pine. The blades may "fling" sap inside the machine. Won't hurt it, but you might want to clean it up after you are done.

Ditto this for your saw blades and router bits. Sap (pitch) build up will cause heat to build up and will cause your blades to dull faster. Clean'em up after a project.

-Brian

[Ken Higginbotham]

Kevin, welcome.
as others have said, should be no problem running pine through your machines. depending on your location you'll probably be getting either doug fir or southern yellow pine from HD, either way my only advice is to stick to 2x10's and 2x12's as much as possible, rip them down to needed dimensions in your shop. the bigger boards tend to be straighter and less knotty. good luck.

That's a good idea - I've been getting 2x6s which do seem to have a lot of knots. I'm going to check out the 2x10s :)

[Glen Butler]

I seems you would spend more for premium wood than the cost of new knives or resharpening them anyway. Just make sure your wood is clean. Dirt and staples is the worst thing for them.

On a side note, I have run thousand of BF of knotty matrials over my blades with no knicks. But as stated early different species may have tougher knots. Pine is not one of those.

[Ken Higginbotham]

In my limited use of a jointer/planer I've a run a good bit of pine with knots and (knock on wood :p) have yet to 'knick' a blade :) And what little sap I get cleans up with alcohol.

[Kevin Guarnotta]

Well a few have asked about the wood I am using - it is pine. I am in the Northeast, and that is the standard wood for framing. Sometime we get some fir in, although it is a bit rare.

I know this wood will move a lot-I am just trying to get some practice on my machines, and get an understanding of how the whole thing will come together. I am not as concerned about tight joints, as I am about how to treat the edges, how I am joining the pieces, and what the proportions will look like. I have done some drawings of my plan, but not every joint. I like to sort of work it out with wood, after developing the plan on paper first. Then back to the paper to refine it, then build it out of the nice material.

I hope that makes sense.

Thanks for all your feedback...I appreciate it.

[Ken Higginbotham]

You may want to get the free version of SketchUp - :)

[Paul Simmel]

Hey Kevin,

It just so happens that I use almost exclusively 2 x construction grade lumber.

Buy 2 x 10’s or 2 x 12’s x 16’. Sticker them for a few weeks ifs they seem “wet”.

Don’t worry too much about the knots. Just about ANYTHING will ding a knife a bit. So what.

Here’s a great tip for you: If you look at the end grain you will see heart in the middle. If you want to glue up anything, slice off the right and left sides in 1” strips. Stack them on top of on another (if you get me). You’ll have perfect quarter sawn panels/stiles, etc. after glue-up and VERY stable parts.

Any curved grain (middle portions of the 2 x stock) can be switched around and included in your glue ups.

Just remember, curved grain WANTS to straighten out. IOW, that’s the genetic message ingrained in a tree… and why there are twists and bows in ripped lumber. You can virtually eliminate this issue if you follow the above.

I like working with #2 lumbar because it is cheap and of you buy 2 x it’s thick enough for just about any project… painted or natural (if you like pine, which I happen to). I also like working with it because of the challenge. It’s the “poor” mans alternative but the results can be spectacular.

I’ve had many successes with jointed and planed 2 x 6’s without slicing them up and repositioning the grain pattern, so don’t freak out.

Go for it and learn. Lots of good advice here. Edit: I should have said "here on this board". which I had in mind... but it did not come out right. Now we are all set.

Good luck,

Paul