Help with a drain line

[Dan Mages]

I came across a small problem when disconnecting the drain line. the last plumber (assuming it was done by one...) installed the drain by inserting the 1.25" drain line directly into this coupler and then soldering it shut. I tried to melt the solder and to remove the coupling, but so far, no luck. Any bright ideas out there on the best way to either remove this or otherwise attach the new drain line? And yes, I did notice the debris in the pipe that you see in the picture, I will clean it out.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v647/DanMages/101_2483.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v647/DanMages/101_2484.jpg

Dan

[Joe Pelonio]

I hope it wasn't a plumber that did that!

The best way would be to put a pipe wrench on it and replace the whole pipe, but then we don't know what it looks like at the other end. The quick and easy way is a rubber sleeve and clamps. The are available as reducing sleeves. You might have to go to a plumbing supply rather than just a home
center. I wouldn't do it with pressurized water but luckily it's just a drain.

[Dan Mages]

To clarify, I will be using a PVC drain pipe for this install.

Dan

[David G Baker]

Dan,
The material used to fasten the pipe inside of the coupler may be lead and have a higher melting temperature than solder so you may need a higher temperature torch to melt the material.
I agree with Joe on the rubber sleeve, that is what I would do if it was my problem.

[Peter Stahl]

What a mess, looks like something I would have found at my brothers old house. Are these pipes inside a cinder block wall? I think I would try the rubber sleve thing before disturbing the old pipes. I hate old houses. I think the guys on this old house do too, seems like they go new with every thing now.

[Denny Rice]

It looks to me like there is a VERY BAD patch job around the pipes and drain too. If this was mine I would probably take a small hammer and bust away the concrete until I could get a good look at the pipes. I agree with the other post listed about removing the pipe and flange and replace. Working with pipe is not that hard, I own a house built in the 1920's and its all over my house. All of my drains in my house have been replaced with PVC. One day I would like to buy a manifold system for my hot and cold water lines and replace all the water lines in my home with plumb-pex. The stuff is cool and maintenance free.

[Lee Schierer]

At the risk of making a bad job worse, I would put a pipe wrench on that coupler and see if I could back it off the pipe in the wall or if the nipple comes out with it. Then install a new nipple and coupler using a liquid teflon pipe sealant (not teflon tape which doesn't seal well and is only a thread lubricant).

This will get the job done correctly and not produce another situation for you or another plumber to try to fix later on.

It appears that the original pipe was cut off and the joint soldered with lead by the previous worker who may or may not have been a real plumber.

[Dan Mages]

Based on feedback so far, I will first try to melt the potential lead off the threads using acetylene instead of propane. Hopefully I will be abe to make the threads useful again. If not, I will get my big can of liquid wrench and my pipe wrench and hope like hell I can budge this thing.

Denny. Its not as bad as it might look. The pipes do go through a concrete block wall into the basement (tri-level ranch) Originally, the whole wall was covered with a .5" layer of thinset and then tile, so the size and shape of the hole did not matter too much as the thinset patched it in.

Regarding a fernco coupler. This is one heck of a stepdown and may create a clog point. Secondly, this will be under a pedistal sink, so it will be visible.

Dan

[Lee Schierer]

If not, I will get my big can of liquid wrench and my pipe wrench and hope like hell I can budge this thing.


Some of the old pipe dopes would relax their grip when heated so if you try the pipe wrench try it while the fitting is still pretty hot.

[Tom Godley]

What is the drain pipe made out of ??

If it was actual lead -- then a plumber more than likely did it. I would not heat the lead with a torch - the lead fumes are not the best.


It fix depends on what the pipe is made out of - it almost looks like galvanized pipe with a coupling on it??


Some areas do not allow rubber (Fernco style) couplings -- some require the type with a stainless band.

[Randy Cohen]

i would remove the thinset that surrounds the coupling and saw off the coupling. Or if you used a hacksaw on the outside of the coupling parallel to the pipe you could probably split the coupling and then knock it off with a chisel.

[Dan Mages]

What is the drain pipe made out of ??

If it was actual lead -- then a plumber more than likely did it. I would not heat the lead with a torch - the lead fumes are not the best.


It fix depends on what the pipe is made out of - it almost looks like galvanized pipe with a coupling on it??


Some areas do not allow rubber (Fernco style) couplings -- some require the type with a stainless band.

You are correct, this is galvanized pipe for the drain. I will give it some heat and see if I can get it off.

[Tom Godley]

It does not look like the coupling was actually used - was a reducer threaded into the pipe coupling??

Normally the galvanized holds up quite well -- all that junk is probably just from the joint. Many time the mortar eats it from the outside!


If you can get the coupling off -- or if what we are seeing is a reducer -- get that out - you will be really good to go. I would try some penetrating solvent -- although with time those joints become very hard to separate.

A little time spent may be easer than trying to cut the pipe. Once cut you have a joint in the wrong place -- not sure what is on the other side of the block - if you can go back that far.

[Gord Pat]

Not that it will be much help getting the coupling off but what it looks like to me is a coupling that has had another coupling, one size smaller threaded on the outside then threaded into the larger coupling, then it's cut off flush with the end of the larger coupling, this is a make shift solution that old timers in the trade would use when a proper reducing fitting wasn't readily available.:)
Most couplings on steel/galvanized threaded piping used for P&D or HVAC work can be threaded on the outside and screwed into the next larger pipe size.
At least that was a trick I was taught when I was an apprentice some 60 years ago.:o

[Jude Tuliszewski]

Be careful when putting the torch to galvy pipe (or any galvanized metal). When the heat starts to cook the galvy layer that is on top of the sub-straight metal it will give off harmful fumes. So have good ventilation and wear a respirator while using the oxy/acetylene torch.

[Dave Johnson29]

If not, I will get my big can of liquid wrench and my pipe wrench and hope like hell I can budge this thing.


Probably too late, but the pipe wrench sounds like a foolish solution UNLESS you can get another pipe wrench on the pipe behind the offending coupling. By trying to turn the offending coupling off the pipe, you may unscrew the pipe behind it from the next fitting in the line. That may lead to leaks from that unsupported fitting.

I'd go with the rubber sleeve idea and use something to cover up the pipes and joints. Since you said you are using PVC they are not going to look all that pretty anyway. What about swapping the basin for one with a pedestal mount to hide the pipes?

[Lee Schierer]

Probably too late, but the pipe wrench sounds like a foolish solution UNLESS you can get another pipe wrench on the pipe behind the offending coupling. By trying to turn the offending coupling off the pipe, you may unscrew the pipe behind it from the next fitting in the line. That may lead to leaks from that unsupported fitting.

Actually having the pipe behind the fitting coming off isn't a bad thing as then he can also replace that piece which from the photo my need replaced. He can install the new pipe through the wall because he has access to the other side. Which ever joint comes free with the wrench will determine his project scope and cost.

[Dan Mages]

After blowtorching and dousing it with liquid wrench, the darn thing still wouldn't budge. I took my recipricating saw to the coupler and split that baby like a banana. The threads got chewed up a small bit in the process, so a neoprene gasket will used as a coupler. Thanks for all of the advice!

Dan