college major?

[curtis rosche]

so im looking through different colleges, and im not sure what to pick as a major. i want to do engineering, but i havent be able to find specifically what i want.
i guess that it has to be under some other name. im looking for the type of engineer or designer that is given a problem to solve, for example, Delta would come to them and say "heres our new unisaw, we need to put a riving knife that looks like this, onto this machine right here, make it work"
im not lookin to build bridges or houses or anything like that.
i have done a couple different searches, but different colleges explain their majors differently, so look like they might be that type, and others dont.
any one have and idea for what i should be lookin at to do what i explained?

[Tony De Masi]

Maybe you could explain that to your guidance counselor? If they still have those in scholls now a days. I would imagine he/she could certainly help you there.

Good luck Curtis.

Tony

[curtis rosche]

yeah they still have those. she wasnt sure either.
i figured that with all of the people on this site that there would be someone who does this type of thing, and then i could do a search based on what their offical job title is.

[Dan Friedrichs]

Hi Curtis,

I'm an electrical engineer, and just finished undergrad, so maybe I can give you some help.

First, there are really only a 3 *major* branches of engineering: electrical, civil, and mechanical. There are other smaller branches, like biomedical, industrial, and chemical, but these aren't as popular as the big 3. There are also more hands-on types of programs like "Construction management", "Electrical engineering technology", and the like - these are NOT generally considered to be in the same category as more traditional engineering majors.

One distinction that many HS students sometimes fail to make is that engineering is not usually a "hands on" job. Engineers use math and science to solve problems. There are also programs of study that will train you to be a technician, where you apply the solution designed by the engineer. As an example, an engineer designs the attachment mechanism for a riving knife, and the technician figures out how to manufacture it. Both positions are important, but you need to make sure you choose which job is right for you.

The only other notable thing to mention is that engineering is a wide field, and no particular college program can adequately prepare you to do one particular job. The point of engineering school is to learn to use the tools at your disposal (math and science) in order to be able to solve a wide range of problems. In your case, if you say "no bridges" and aren't into electronics, you'll probably want to major in mechanical engineering. With that degree, you'll be qualified to be an entry-level engineer on projects ranging all the way from steam turbines to building new consumer products.

When I was in HS, I was hesitant about engineering because I don't like math that much. Turns out it's not really that bad, and very little is done by hand. Learning calculus may not seem fun now, but the point of learning it is just so you know what magic is going on behind the screen of your calculator.

I don't know if you've selected a university, yet, but when you do, a quick check of the quality of the engineering program is if it is "ABET" accredited. ABET is essentially the only organization that certifies engineering programs. A program that has been accredited for many years without any lapses is high-quality.

[Jim O'Dell]

I would think that would be Mechanical Engineering, as opposed to Electrical, Structural, Bio, Chemical, etc. Good luck. College is only the tip of the iceburg in the learning process! Jim.

[Joe Mioux]

if i remember correctly most first and even second year engineering students pretty much take all the basics.

three or four calculus classes, three or so physics, a couple of chemistry, speech comm/writing, and a few other social science/humanities/etc type classes.

so you have some options and are not necessarily locked into a EE or CE or ME etc curriculum.

[Kevin Groenke]

The task you described would probably be done by somebody with a degree in Mechanical Engineering, Industrial Design or Product Design. There is a lot of discipline cross-over in manufacturing and much design is now done by teams of engineers/designers. With global manufacturing, design details are sometimes determined by sub-contractor personnel who may or may not have formal training in engineering or design. Many engineers I know spend as much managing manufacturing in overseas plants as the do with actual design.

You'll have to consider Engineering VS Design.
Engineering will encompass very specific material, mechanical and physical sciences and functions. (math, physics, matl sci intensive) Design will focus more on ergonomics, aesthetics, functionality and problem-solving (coursework in human factors, "design thinking", materials sci, manufacturing processes, representation)

google "design vs engineering" for endless discussions and articles on these professions' fuzzy boundaries.

Check out core77.com for more info on Design.

Good luck,

-kg

[Montgomery Scott]

I graduated with a BS in Mech Engr. I now work as a contract aerospace strutures stress analyst for a local company and am currently contracted out to work at Boeing on the 787 program.

The guys in my company make between $60-$80/hr with 1.5X OT pay. Since we are contract we usually get to work on the new programs unlike a lot of the direct people. The work is usually challenging and schedule driven so it's rather easy to make $180k/yr.

The downside is the cyclical nature of the business. Most contracts last only six months to a year then you move to another part of the country or a different company within the state, but I have known people who've worked as job shoppers for 20+ years at Boeing.

[Cliff Rohrabacher]

I was hiring masters level Engineers in the mid 1990's and I could get 'em for $23-Gees a year~!! In New Jersey~!! The cost of living here is among the highest in the nation.

It was so bad then that I had grown men in my office weeping with desperation to get a job. These were guys with kids in college and elders in homes dependent on them and the world had no use for them any more. Great people, lots of experience, good education, and they were utterly unemployable. All the work had gone to India.

At the same time I'd have young women fresh out of college in my office looking for work and they were getting offers. They were being offered substantially more $$ than men twice their age with lots of experience.
The world was in a wild tumble. Political Correctness was ruling the day and jobs were in mad flight offshore.

That's when I decided I had had enough of wage slavery. No more would I ever allow myself to be at the mercy of the whims of other people.

Find something you can do that does not involve you applying for a job.

If you can't do that, get your CPA.

[Jim Becker]

That sounds like mechanical engineering to me. I hope you'll consider my alma mater, which has a great engineering school. And it's right smack in the dead center of Pennsyltucky in a nice town called State College. You'd look good in blue and white... :) Or maybe the engineering school at Drexel where Professor Dr SWMBO is on the faculty, albeit in a far different field.

[Keith Gwin]

I am a civil engineer and like someone posted before there are so many sub disciplines you can go into. It sounds like you would probably like the mechanical end more than most of the others. One thing to consider is that if you do not like sitting at a computer drawing it may not be for you. It wouldn't be a bad idea to find some local engineering firms and visit them to see what their engineers do day in and day out.

[Chris Kennedy]

Curtis,

I'm a math prof, but I'm going to let the advisor in me come out.

For your school applications, mechanical engineering seems the most applicable option, and it seems the best fit for you at this moment. For the purposes of admission for most schools, the specific type of engineering isn't of tremendous importance, but engineering vs non-engineering is VERY important (lots of wanna-be's come in as non-engineers hoping to transfer).

Also, as Joe Mioux pointed out, your first year or two is completely determined no matter what engineering you do. They put you into a general core of courses that will serve you well no matter your choice. The upshot -- don't fret exactly what type of engineering. One of the great things about college is that you see things that you have never thought of. The specialties, the intricacies, and discovering what exactly you just find fascinating -- that's the fun part.

If I can help with any questions, feel free to send me a PM.

Cheers,

Chris




For the purposes of applications and starting your college career, put

[Rick Moyer]

Even though I may not be quite qualified to answer this, I'll echo what Chris says above, especially about all the other benefits of college beyond the textbook experience. You see, I decided that I wanted to attend college and maybe become an engineer, but I never became one as I quit after a year and a half, for a variety of reasons. I feel however, that the experiences I gained in that 1 1/2 years were very valuable, albeit w/o the better job income:(. So I will say that whatever you decide, please try to finish your education whatever path you choose.
Also, while I am a PSU fan, I would point out that Lehigh and Bucknell (my almost alma mater) both have excellent engineering programs as well. Good luck!

[Scott T Smith]

Curtis, look into a Mechanical Engineering Technology degree plan. MET programs forcus more on the application side of engineering, as opposed to an emphasis on the theoretical side.

I've had some that worked for me and I was very pleased with their skills, abilities and knowledge.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mechanical_engineering_technology

[Wes Bischel]

Curtis,
Kevin posted some insightful info. The problem statement you posted could have been handed to Engineering or Design. The new Unisaw was developed by a team of Mechanical Engineers and Industrial Designers. And I can say I've done my fair share of "engineering" (note the small "e") as a Industrial Designer.

Your Guidance Counselor may not know about ID, which would not be unusual. Just for info, there are two schools in Philly that have programs:
http://www.philau.edu/designandmedia/html/ap_ind_design.html
http://www.uarts.edu/academics/cad/id/bsid.html
To add to Core-77,
http://www.idsa.org/webmodules/articles/articlefiles/what_is_id_brochure.pdf
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Industrial_design

Mechanical Engineering may be closer to what you are looking for, but I thought I would add a bit of info on ID.

Wes

[curtis rosche]

thanks for the information.
i dont like math, but im good at it.
which type would be more hands on work, or using 3d computer modeling? i love hands on and using programs like SolidWorks.
thank you for you help with this.

[Dan Friedrichs]

Curtis, look into a Mechanical Engineering Technology degree plan. MET programs forcus more on the application side of engineering, as opposed to an emphasis on the theoretical side.

I've had some that worked for me and I was very pleased with their skills, abilities and knowledge.

Be careful, here. While ME's and MET's work on the same types of problems, the day-to-day work they do is drastically different, and only linked by the common field they work in.

MET is a valuable degree, and it may be exactly what you want. I once had a colleague, though, who had an MET degree, and was repeatedly turned down for engineering positions because he didn't have an *engineering* degree.

Analogy: Pharmacists and pharmacy technicians work side-by-side, mostly doing the same job. Based on pay, education, and responsibility, NO ONE would suggest their jobs are "similar", though. Likewise, engineers generally are more rigorously educated and take a wider responsibility than those in technical programs. A particular characteristic of a licensed Professional Engineer (someone who has done engineering work for some time and passed several written tests) is that he/she can approve plans for manufacture or construction.

[Larry Frank]

I think that there has been a lot of good advice given and that mechanical engineering sounds like a good fit. Two of my children completed college a few years ago and have pretty good engineering jobs in the areas of thier interests. I do have a couple of suggestions for you. In order to get your dream job, you will need to prepare yourself very well.

Take a good look at the various schools that you are interested in and look at the employment rate for the engineers that graduate. There tends to be a pretty wide spread. Unfortunately, some of the schools with the best record of this type are also not the least expensive.

While going to school, get summer intern jobs in the area that you are interested. This experience will go a long way on a resume. It will also let you get a better understanding of what some of the companies are like to work at. Again, it is pretty difficult with the current economic conditions to get summer internships.

What ever you decide to do, work at it as hard as possible. Companies are going to look at grades, classes, projects, outside activities and other related experiences. I know that some say grades are not that important but they are important when competing against other engineers. Getting your dream job is a competition between you and a lot of other engineers. The stronger your resume with these type of things then the better your chance of landing the dream job.

When I interviewed engineers for positions, I expected a very strong academic background and then looked at other things such as their activities, jobs and interests. I always asked one type of question which was have you every taken something mechanical apart and put it back together and are you familiar with using tools. I was very disappointed with the number of engineers who had never touched a wrench.

[Randy Cohen]

My son has a degree in Industrial Design, which is an art degree where he went to school, James Madison University. He received a lot of computer design instruction as well as a lot of studio time. Studio time=build stuff using a wide range of power tools.
He is by no means an engineer and his math skills are limited.
Someone mentioned above about being a CPA...which is what I am. CPA's are in a unique position in the professional world in that there is a lot of seasonal work available on a professional level (tax season). I work as a CPA for 3 months per year and am free to do what I want the rest of the time. Something to think about.
I suggest that whatever you chose go to a school with a good reputation in your chosen field. The higher the rating the better.

[Montgomery Scott]

Curtis, CATIA V5 is Solidworks, as Dassault System bought out the company 12 years ago. V5 has been the design tool for the 787 and, as you know, is a good program, unlike CATIA V4.

[curtis rosche]

so it sounds like i would want either a tech program or go for industrial design if i want to do more hands on stuff and less theory?

[Steve Schlumpf]

Curtis - just wanted to throw in my 2 cents - if you do the tech program, understand that you will end up working for an engineer. A lot of the engineers that I worked for/with enjoyed the hands on stuff and were involved as much as their schedule would allow. Point being, the engineer had the option a lot of the times of rolling up their sleeves and being hands-on because he/she ran the program. If you are a tech - that will not be one of your options.

[Dan Friedrichs]

so it sounds like i would want either a tech program or go for industrial design if i want to do more hands on stuff and less theory?

The degree to which your job is "hands on" depends entirely on the job you take, not the major field you study in college. There are many people with engineering degrees who sit in offices all day, and many people with engineering degrees who do hands-on stuff all day.

As others have told you, the good/fun/exciting jobs are hard to get, so you need excellent grades, internships, involvement in professional activities, etc.

If you are a good student (getting A's in HS), you may find the career you get into through a tech program won't hold your interest very long, and that an engineering degree may provide you a path towards more life-long excitement and challenge.

In HS, I was all into electronics. I loved building things, soldering, etc. About 8 months of doing that as a hobby entirely burned me out - it was fun at first, but once the novelty of building it myself wore off, it was tedious and repetetive. I realized what I actually wanted to do was *design* things, then let someone else worry about how to fit all the parts in the box.

[curtis rosche]

ok. thanks for the input. you guys have given me really good insight

[Ken Fitzgerald]

Curtis,

Mechanical engineering sounds like the field for you. I would go for the engineering degree for the following reasons.

You can use the degree to get a job that suits you. I install and maintain MR scanners, CT scanners and x-ray equipments. A lot of the service engineers I work with are degreed engineers..... others have BSEETs. Over the 34 years I have been in the business I have seen as many technicians as engineers doing this job.

In most cases you will need a strong math and science background whether you work as an engineer or a technician implementing and perfecting the design of an engineer.

Keep in mind, it's easier to get your education while you are single, unmarried and don't have the added responsibilities of a wife, children, a home, pets and the additional bills that come with those things.

You will seldom find youself apologizing for having too much education. IMHO...What appears to be good luck to some....was really good preparation waiting for an application.

The degree will get you hired....your performance will determine your future within a company after you are hired. Develop a lot of self-discipline, show interest, work hard, be honest, have a positive attitude and show a little common sense.

[Chuck Saunders]

I am with you Curtis, I don't like math that much. That is why I did BSME in Material Science and MSME in Heat Transfer. Sometime things just workout funny that way. Heaven or Hell you stop in Atlanta and you aren't going to graduate without Heat Transfer.
Keep at it and get all the education you can get. Nobody has ever been too smart.

[Jesse Espe]

The pitch:

Get an Engineering Degree.
Join the Navy.
See the World.
Solve Problems.

The details:

You have more opportunity to get as hands-on than you could ever want. There are plenty of technical fields where you could apply your engineering degree to solve real-world problems. I have a BS in Mech Eng, but during my 13+ years, I've dealt with significant mechancal, electrical, IT, and "other" issues.

The Disclaimer:

I am not a recruiter. I have 13 years experience on multiple surface ships (including aircraft carriers). I joined the Navy to see the world and blow stuff up, and had no idea about how technical the Navy could be until I got here. I'm now involved in one of the most technically intense fields in the Navy, and I'm humbled by the amount of engineering that goes into it.

BTW, stick around a while and the pay is GOOD. And steady.

My $0.02,
Jesse

[Mitchell Andrus]

Dan's advice is sound. Can't offer better. Good luck in whatever you do..

[phil harold]

I am going to throw another choice for you.

Do what you like!

Maybe I am wrong but you seem to enjoy woodworking and turning

Why not get paid for it?

Get an Art degree
combined with woodworking and you will go far

here is a list of schools (some bigger than others)

http://www.finewoodworking.com/SkillsAndTechniques/SkillsAndTechniquesArticle.aspx?id=28165

I always wanted to go to the college of redwoods or one in nyc

[Rob Cunningham]

Curtis,
As others have said, it sounds like Mechanical Engineering would be what you would enjoy. Since you are near Phila. I would look into Drexel or University of Penn. Both schools have excellent engineering schools.
My son is going to Drexel (computer eng) . He is in the 5 year co-op program which I feel is a great program. You get to actually work in your field as you go to school. It's a great way to make contacts, get some good work experience, and also find out if you enjoy your chosen major.

[Frank Kobilsek]

Curtis

Look for a Manufacturing Engineering Technology program. I bombed out of Mechanical way back when because I just could not get through Calculus in the Math Dept. Calc taught by engineering instructors was much more understandable. That degree and a night school MBA 10 years later have taken care of me.

I have done tool design, plant floor troubling shooting in Automotive mfg enviroment, design integration with OEM companies, sold OEM parts, created and joint venture in Brazil, sold capital machinery to mfgrs and even a bit of marketing.

Most educated as Engineers work as Technologists. Very few Engineers do the high powered theroy and desing they were trained for.

College is proof to future employeers that you can finish a long term project. Let's face it, that is what they will eventually be hiring you to do.

I tell my 37 nieces and nephews that I am 49 years old and I still don't know what I want to be when I grow up. Just roll with the oportunities and life will be fun.

Frank

[Ben Hatcher]

...and don't be in a big hurry to graduate! Enjoy college.

[Rob Fisher]

Curtis,

I graduated 6 years ago from Virginia Tech with a Bachelors of Architecture. At VT the Industrial Designers were in the same college (and building) as the Architecture students, and the ID program was very design(artistic) based. As others have said it was very hands on with lots of time in the metal, wood, plaster and plastics shops. The students typically did drawings that ranged from technical style to very artistic and then where expected to make a prototype. The building was laid out with a very open floor plan and studios that flowed into each other. As a note the shops at VT where incredible, with every machine you could want down to CNC and a laser cam. There were also print shops, screen and plate, cermaics studios and photography labs (for those who are still into film). From what I remember my friends who graduated with degrees in ID went on to work in a wide range of fields from automobile design to product design to studio potter (ceramics).

There are many schools out there that have very good design based programs. Your best bet is to go to the school and see if you like it there. As a great side note if the school has nice shop facilities you could continue your woodworking while at school.

My opinion is that Jims comment about Pennsyltucky is so very true. Get out and enjoy college. I personally went to school 6 hours from home for a reason, I couldn't wait to get outta here. Now 6 years after school I am back and I love it here. Perspective is everything, but the distance of 5 years and 300 miles away let me see that.

If science and math are your thing then engineering may be your best bet, if its art than I would give Industrial Design a look.

Rob