Left handers, how about that TS blade tilt?

[daniel lane]

All -

Yes, I know this is a common question. I've done the search and I've read the threads, and I (mostly) have a good idea on the differences here. However, I'm only asking LEFT-HANDED people for their opinion because I am only SEMI-ambidextrous and would like the viewpoint of other lefties on this subject.

I'm looking to upgrade to a cabinet saw and have the time to wait and hope for a good CL listing. However, I'm trying to make sure I have all the "must haves" figured out. I currently have a left tilt Delta contractor's saw. I find it mildly awkward because of where I have to stand to feed - I really don't like being in the kickback zone, but I also don't like to use my right hand as primary when I'm near the blade. (Yes, I use push sticks/etc.) I plan on more dados than bevel rips, so I've been thinking that might be enough to push me in 'right' direction - no pun intended - but sticking to a right-tilt only limits me on manufacturers, especially w.r.t. SawStop.

I've also been reading a lot about people using the miter gauge in the left or right slot, and thinking about how I perform certain steps lefty. It's too bad there aren't fully left-handed tablesaws, I think I'd be more comfortable all-up with the rails to the left of the blade. :rolleyes:

Anyway, lefties - is the right tilt a must have?



daniel

P.S. Okay, yeah, I know that it's not a MUST have because lefties have been using left tilts for a while, but I think you know where I'm going with this...

[Jason White]

I'm left-handed and prefer left-tilt.

Jason



All -

Yes, I know this is a common question. I've done the search and I've read the threads, and I (mostly) have a good idea on the differences here. However, I'm only asking LEFT-HANDED people for their opinion because I am only SEMI-ambidextrous and would like the viewpoint of other lefties on this subject.

I'm looking to upgrade to a cabinet saw and have the time to wait and hope for a good CL listing. However, I'm trying to make sure I have all the "must haves" figured out. I currently have a left tilt Delta contractor's saw. I find it mildly awkward because of where I have to stand to feed - I really don't like being in the kickback zone, but I also don't like to use my right hand as primary when I'm near the blade. (Yes, I use push sticks/etc.) I plan on more dados than bevel rips, so I've been thinking that might be enough to push me in 'right' direction - no pun intended - but sticking to a right-tilt only limits me on manufacturers, especially w.r.t. SawStop.

I've also been reading a lot about people using the miter gauge in the left or right slot, and thinking about how I perform certain steps lefty. It's too bad there aren't fully left-handed tablesaws, I think I'd be more comfortable all-up with the rails to the left of the blade. :rolleyes:

Anyway, lefties - is the right tilt a must have?



daniel

P.S. Okay, yeah, I know that it's not a MUST have because lefties have been using left tilts for a while, but I think you know where I'm going with this...

[Jason Strauss]

Jason,

I too prefer the left tilt. It might be just a "gotten used to it" thing, but now I am much more comfortable with the "rightie" saw.

The best way I can explain it - it's like when I play golf - it's a right handed man's world and I conformed long ago.

[Bob Vavricka]

I'm a lefty and prefer the left tilt also. I have just learned to use the saw like a right handed person and think it would feel strange to try it any other way. I'm also a right handed mouse user for my computer and have used one left handed, but prefer right. The only place I am having trouble going right handed is bowl turning on a lathe and I am working on it. For some operations on the lathe, I don't know which is left or right handed.
Either way, stay out of the kick-back zone.
Bob V.

[Cliff Rohrabacher]

I'm left handed: I prefer the blade tilt away from me - to my right hand side.
I stand on my left hand side of the blade.
On a conventional TS I use the miter slot on my left hand side of the blade.

Now however, I have a slider and they all tilt to the right.
>>So there<<

[george wilson]

I am left handed,ad also prefer left tilt. You should select whatever feels best to you.

[Phil Thien]

I'm left handed, and have a right-tilt saw. It is a BT3K saw and I've added a rather long miter slot to on the left-side of the blade, and I use that with a rather large sled to cross-cut rather large pieces. I'm pretty happy with that configuration.

[Mike Cruz]

Daniel, the cynic in me says you really don't care about the tilt of a saw blade. What you are REALLY trying to do is out leftys!

Careful, Leftys, now we know who you are....;)

PS I'm a righty and use a RIGHT tilt saw.

[Wayne Sparkman]

Most lefties wind up more or less ambidextrous, so that helps somewhat. Still, I prefer the left-tilt saw. But more importantly, isn't a right-tilt saw more prone to kickbacks and binding against the fence? I thought that was why everyone was touting their left-tilt saws.

[daniel lane]

Thanks for the input, folks. I'm still thinking, and you haven't made it easier! :D

The right-tilt-is-more-prone-to-kickback thing isn't something I've considered seriously except for bevel rips with the fence on the right of the blade. If the blade is at 90º or the fence has been moved, I don't think there's a difference between left and right tilt. Please correct me if I'm wrong! Also, I'm thinking that a good-but-large (wide) crosscut sled will alleviate some of my concerns about left crosscuts for most things, so I may will be building a nice large sled to go with whatever I buy.

For disclosure, part of this discussion was prompted by the discovery of a unisaw (36-812) available for sale. A 3hp cabinet with RT blade is tempting, especially if the price is right. I didn't mention it up front in part because I didn't think I could afford it right now (on revisiting, it would be tight, but doable, if I can negotiate) and in part because I wanted input on what people are doing, not what they think I should do. I've been very happy with your responses so far, so thank you!

One thing that came up via my brain + inspiration from a PM is a true "lefty" saw. Has anyone actually put the extension tables on the left and moved the rails that way, too? I can see myself being really happy with a TS set up that way, but it seems so....odd. Still, I'm going to look into it, if only for the intellectual exercise.

Anyway, thanks for the input so far, and since we've already been contaminated by righties (thanks, Mike!), I think I'll allow any of them to say their piece from here on. :p


daniel

[Josiah Bartlett]

I'm an ambidexterous guy. I have an old right tilt unisaw with a Shop Fox bies clone with 7' rails. I set them up so I can do 24" to the left of the blade and the remainder on the right. I like it that way- I rarely bevel pieces any larger than that, or just run them on the shaper with a bevel cutter. I use the miter gauge on either side- I have one miter gauge set up with a long fence to the left, and another to the right, set up for zero clearance to the blade.

The main gotcha to using the fence on both sides of the blade is that you have to set the fence up exactly parallel to the blade or shim the faces so you don't pinch on either side.

[Nathan Callender]

I'm a lefty and I use a left-tilt saw. I have the fence set away from the blade at the rear (when on the right side) so if I'm doing a bevel cut, it's not a great idea to switch the fence to the other side.

Honestly, I think I do things differently than most here. I stand to the right of the fence (which is right of the blade) and use my left hand and push block to push the material through the cut. I get the impression that right handed people have the saw set up the same, but stand to the left of the blade and push the material through with their right hand, so they are in essence reaching over the cut line. Maybe I'm misunderstanding others though.

I use the miter gauge in the right slot as well primarily because that's the side I stand on.

[harry strasil]

I must be ODD man out, my saw tilts to the right, I am right handed, but I use the fence on the left almost always and stand to the right of the blade and push the material with my left hand and I use push sticks. My saw is shop made so has no extensions its just one big table with 25 in. to the right and 26.5 in. to the left of the blade. And I have yet to have a kick back since the early 70's when I built it.

[Mike Cruz]

Nathan, if you asked me, how YOU stand makes sense. It just isn't how I learned. That is how I WANTED to stand and use the fence (but in reverse because I am a righty...so fence on the left side of the blade, standing to the left of the blade, pushing wood through with my right hand). But that isn't how everyone in my shop did it. So I did it the way they did it. It doesn't make sense in a way, because it puts me in front of the wood I'm cutting...istead of out of its way.

But I understand WHY we rightys do what we do when we do what we do. It frees up our left hand to drind a beer...oops, I mean to hold or free excess wood after/during the cut. Oh, G*d, did I just give away the fact that I don't use fingerboards, guards, riving knives, anti-kickback thingymajobies? OOPS! :eek: Yeah, maybe that has a lot to do with whow I learned, too. Stare down a blade turning at 4000 rpm and you WILL pay attention...unless you are a candidate for a Darwin award...

Anywho, to please all the leftys, I will end this with the saying that compiments them all: If the right side of your brain contols the left side of your body, then leftys are the only ones in their right minds. Of course, any of us Philosophers will tear that up to no end...but it sounds nice. :) (hint: a brain is not the same as a mind....unsound logic)

I've had too much beer and the Redskin were a TOTAL disappointment...AGAIN! I'm going to bed.

[bob hertle]

I must be ODD man out, my saw tilts to the right, I am right handed, but I use the fence on the left almost always and stand to the right of the blade and push the material with my left hand and I use push sticks. My saw is shop made so has no extensions its just one big table with 25 in. to the right and 26.5 in. to the left of the blade. And I have yet to have a kick back since the early 70's when I built it.


I'm a lefty, my Unisaw tilts right, and I stand and push just the opposite of Harry! Whatever you're comfortable with.

Bob

[Don Morris]

I'm a lefty and love my Grizzly 1023SL. That's L for Left tilt.

[Paul Wunder]

Another un-ambidextrous leftie here, with a left tilt blade. I guess I never thought about when I first started years ago. (Except that the whole world conspires against lefties... starting with scissors and penmanship lessons.

Get a left hand tilt and take on the conspirators.

[Josiah Bartlett]

I've never understood why guitars are fingered with the left hand for the majority of supposedly right handed players- it takes far more dexterity to finger chords than it does plucking strings, even with complex hand picked rhythms. Its ok with me, though, I was probably left handed because my kindergarten teacher caught me writing with either hand and switching off, and forced me to pick my right hand. I still write, golf, bat, and shoot with my right hand, but I do most other things left handed or with both hands and switch off.

[Paul Ryan]

Another south paw here. I have never used a right tilting saw that I know about so all I have ever know is a left tilter. So that is what I am used to and 9 times out of 10 I stand in the kick back zone, because well I am stupid I guess. I am trying to change that but it is hard to teach old dogs new tricks. If had to learn to do most of my ripping on the left side of the blade I think I would quite woodworking. That scrares the bajeibers out of me, it would be like using the wrong hand to do something personal. ;);)

[Jeff Duncan]

Another lefty, and I really don't care which way the blade tilts. Is the saw accurate? Will it make the cuts I need to make....then I'll use it. In a perfect world I'd have a saw that tilted both ways:D

I would caution against learning to use a tablesaw the way Nathan describes, although it may seem safer, it's not the correct position for using the machine. I'm no safety expert, but usually the correct position is the safer one.
good luck,
JeffD

[Phil Thien]

But more importantly, isn't a right-tilt saw more prone to kickbacks and binding against the fence?

I think that is a wives tale.

I've heard the "if the blade is tilted towards the fence, it can trap a piece of wood and result in kickback" argument over and over.

But kickback requires the blade to hit the teeth towards the top dead center of rotation. And for this to happen, the wood needs to lift from the table. Problem is, it is trapped by the plate plate (acting as a sort of riving knife).

If you examine a left-tilt blade, however, you'll see that it is very possible for the wood to lift from the table and ride the blade's tips. And therefor for kickback to occur.

The true benefit of a left tilt saw is that, when ripping bevels, the good side is up. Therefor you get less tearout on the money side of the piece.

[george wilson]

I think having to lower the blade and bring the fence to the left of the blade for bevel rips is a big inconvenience. When I first got into school shop,they had the standard right tilt Unisaw. I was bevel ripping a narrow piece of wood,and it shot across the shop,sticking into a grubby old wooden boat. Fortunately,I had had sense enough to be standing well to the left of the blade. I didn't try that again.

So,either handed as you might be,I prefer my old right tilt Dewalt. I never could see why Delta made them right tilt in the first place.

[daniel lane]

Thanks to everyone for their input. I'm intrigued at the distribution of answers (nearly 2-1 for left tilt), but then again I didn't actually know, so that's why I asked.

Re: the unisaw available, for the time being, I think I've decided to stick with my left tilt Delta contractor's saw while I spend money on other things. But I still need to decide if I have a preference. At the moment...no. And as I said before, you guys haven't made it easier! ;)

Go lefties!


daniel

[Kent A Bathurst]

... except for bevel rips with the fence on the right of the blade. If the blade is at 90º or the fence has been moved, I don't think there's a difference between left and right tilt. Please correct me if I'm wrong! daniel

Correct, AFAIK. I am a righty (push with right, stand to left) with left-tilt for that bevel-rip reason. I got one of the first Unisaw L models, when they were bascially cobbling together a solution out of the R saws. Still very happy with it. I was thinking about that same solution you mentioned of just moving everything to the left of the blade on a R saw - seems like a good idea - assuming the cast extension table holes match on the other side (or drill new?)

[george wilson]

Phil,it isn't an old wive's tale!!!! I have had my left tilt Dewalt since 1964,and like it a LOT better than he old fashioned right tilt Delta that we used in the toolmaker's shop since 1970. I always had to lower the blade and move the fence to the left of the blade to do beveled cuts. It CAN kick back if you don't move the fence,and that is from real experience.

[Phil Thien]

It CAN kick back if you don't move the fence,and that is from real experience.

Real experience here, too. I've been using a right-tilt saw to make bevel cuts w/o moving the fence for well over ten years, never had a problem.

You may be surprised to learn that in Europe (where safety standards for tools are arguably much more stringent than in the U.S.), "trapping" the workpiece between the right-tilted blade and fence is the standard.

If kickback is the result of the workpiece hitting the top of those teeth, then how the heck are you gonna do that with a "trapped" workpiece? The blade plate is gonna prevent such an occurrence.

LT is superior in that the money face is UP, and that you can do alternate side bevels w/o having to worry about getting pointy stock stuck between the fence and the table.

[george wilson]

You do it your way,and I'll do it mine,and avoid damaging things in my shop with flying wood.