Methodology for attaching face frame to carcass

[scott vroom]

For cabinet making, do you guys dado your face frames for attachment to the carcass? It seems this would be a bullet proof method to ensure face frames are squared up to the carcass. Do you dado before or after gluing up the frames? For those that don't dado, what technique do you use to square the frames to the boxes?

Thanks!

[Keith Gwin]

I am working on building a dresser for a child that will be here in 11 weeks!!!
I bought a Festool Domino a while back and used it to attach the face frame and it worked great. I just had to be careful to make sure that each piece was clamped down and perfectly flat before cutting to make sure that the edges lined up without any overlap.

[Norman Pyles]

I just use biscuits.

[donald bugansky]

Kreg pocket hole system?

[Chuck Isaacson]

Kreg pocket hole system?

+1 on the pocket holes. That is what I used to do mine and it worked out really good. I just drilled a few holes, clamped the frames to the carcass and screwed them in. Simple.

CHuck

[scott vroom]

+1 on the pocket holes. That is what I used to do mine and it worked out really good. I just drilled a few holes, clamped the frames to the carcass and screwed them in. Simple.

CHuck


Chuck, what method did you use to square the face frames to the carcasses? Also, where on the face frames did you drill the pocket holes to attach tom the carcass? Did you plug the holes with dowling?

I was thinking that if I dado the stiles I would guarantee a perfectly square and screw-free attachment to the box. To acommodate this, I imagine I would want to cut the carcass top and bottom pieces slightly narrower than the carcass sides (since a dado on the stiles would cause the frame to recess into the box by the depth of the dado). Anyone out there using dados? Would love to hear your construction details.

Thanks-

[Jason Strauss]

+1 on the pocket screws, too. You actually put the pockets for the screws in the carcass. The pockets are then hidden on the sides, bottom, and top of the carcass by the other cabinets and counter top. I use a little glue on the back of the face frame for added strength.

I align the face frame by first lining up and clamping on one corner and then working my way around the cabinet w/ clamps, making adjustments as I go. If my face frames and carcasses are within reasonable tolerances of sqaureness, this works out pretty well.

I use dados on both side panels that receive the cabinet bottom. I use a rabbit in the back to receive the back panel, and a rabbit along the top edge of each side panel to receive 3" wide strips; one front, one back.

[Philip Johnson]

I'm no cabinet maker. but I need to make a few cabinets. So far I have made a few practice ones and hung in the garage. I copied the custom cabinets in my kitchen made by a cabinet maker. He used a dado for the face frames so did I. It worked great. I did the sides first, cut a dado down the side, left about 1/4 inch overhang on the outside edge, on the corners you need to cut a dado going the other way for the top and bottom, you may have to clean the dado up with a chisel. I left the sides a bit long and trimmed them once I had the top and bottom cut to fit. The bottom piece I used the same 1/4 inch edge but you want the 1/4 inch lip on the inside of the cabinet.
It worked great for me, probably takes a lot longer then pocket screws or biscuits but I'm not in a hurry.

Phil

[Lee Schierer]

I use two methods mostly. If I want a flush edge, then I cut a rabbet in the sides of the face frame after it is glued up. Otherwise I still glue it up first and just glue it to the front of the cabinet. Many times I use the face frame as the starting structure and build the cabinet back from it by attaching the sides and then inserting the internal frames, which I usually attach with pocket hole screws. That way I can trim the frames to the exact width needed.

[scott vroom]

Phil, have you considered simply cutting the top and bottom carcass pieces narrower by the depth of the dado, thereby making butt joints to the rails (and eliminating the need for the tricky horizontal dado cuts at the ends of the stiles)? Last evening I tried dadoing all 4 pieces (stiles/rails) and encountered the same problem you describe at the top and bottom of the stiles: it is indeed tricky to cut the short horizontal dados that acommodate the carcass top and bottom pieces. I like your suggestion of using a chissel to fine tune the dado.

[Scott Schwake]

Here's a recent thread on the topic:

http://www.sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?t=122592

[Charles Krieger]

Questions for those who use biscuits:
1) Do you use the biscuits in the stiles only or both stiles and rails?

2) Do you assemble the face frame before attaching to the carcass or do you attach the individutal pieces?

3) If you pre-assemble the frame and use biscuits in both stiles and rails isn't there an alignment problem?

4) If you attach the individual pieces how do you get the rail to stile joints tight?

[Chuck Isaacson]

Chuck, what method did you use to square the face frames to the carcasses? Also, where on the face frames did you drill the pocket holes to attach tom the carcass? Did you plug the holes with dowling?
Thanks-


+1 on the pocket screws, too. You actually put the pockets for the screws in the carcass. The pockets are then hidden on the sides, bottom, and top of the carcass by the other cabinets and counter top. I use a little glue on the back of the face frame for added strength.

I align the face frame by first lining up and clamping on one corner and then working my way around the cabinet w/ clamps, making adjustments as I go. If my face frames and carcasses are within reasonable tolerances of sqaureness, this works out pretty well.


Scott, +1 on what Jason did. If you take your time and measure up good, it will be just fine. Good luck.

Chuck

[NICK BARBOZA]

Questions for those who use biscuits:
1) Do you use the biscuits in the stiles only or both stiles and rails?

2) Do you assemble the face frame before attaching to the carcass or do you attach the individutal pieces?

3) If you pre-assemble the frame and use biscuits in both stiles and rails isn't there an alignment problem?

4) If you attach the individual pieces how do you get the rail to stile joints tight?


1) I've done both. either way works fine.
2)Absolutely!
3)No, just do some math to make sure alignment works. Or eliminate one set (stiles or rails)
4)Ref #2.

Cheers,
Nick

[Cliff Rohrabacher]

20 penny nails Hot dip galv' if I can get 'em.

[Charles Krieger]

Caveman style! ROFL

[Nicholas Bukky]

I have a small cabinet shop and use both biscuits and pocket screws.

I will build all my face frames/stain and finish then build the boxes.

I use pocket screws to assemble the faceframes and it holds them square if your cuts are square:D

I have a bearing router bit that is the same thickness/ depth as a #20 biscuit. I rout the stile edges on the boxes that are 1/4in smaller in width than my face frames and pocket screw the bottom of the cab underneath.
(I use 3/4 ply and center the grove on the plywood edge)

I have my biscuit cutter set up 1/8in deeper (total of 1/2in so there is 1/8th of ff sticking out from the carcase) to cut the face frame. You can then put as many biscuits in the face frame as you like and not have to lay them out on the cab.

Now I glue biscuits and put them in the faceframe and put glue in the grove on the cab and line up the top of cab and faceframe and run the pocket screws in to hold it at the bottom and put a few clamps on the top till the glue sets up in about 15 to 20 min.

I don't know if this helps you or not but it's how I do it.

Nick

[Craig Feuerzeig]

Glue and clamp.

[Mike Heidrick]

Glue and clamps and pocket screws from the undersides of fixed shelves into rails if I can hide them.

[sean m. titmas]

I make my f/f flush to the inside of my cabinet sides and bottom(for easier drawer slide attachment) and use 4 biscuits in the corners for alignment and secure with pocket screws. This method is quick and accurate even for custom quality cabinets. I make separate bases so i use butt joints with pre-glued dowels to align the top and bottom, tack with a few staples than secure with a few screws from the outside.