$120 chainsaw lesson

[Reed Gray]

It's that time of year to go through the log pile to sort out turning wood from fire wood. I cut up a bunch, and took a lunch break. Came back out after lunch and tried to start the saw. The pull cord wouldn't budge, no matter how hard I pulled, and I can pull pretty hard. Well, I took the housing off, and the pull cord would pull, but the motor wouldn't budge. Off to see Mr. Chainsaw. They called me back, which is never a good sign, and the repair guy said the piston looked like it was covered in caramel, and it was frozen up tight. About $120 to fix it.

"What are you running in the saw for gas?"

"Shell premium."

"The only thing I have seen do this is too much oil, or cheap gas that sat too long, or leaving gas in it all winter long and not using it and the gas evaporates out of the carborator, and gunks it all up."

Well, after thinking about it, I figured there were two possible causes. One was earlier in the year when I was fueling up the saw. I always refil the bar oil when I add gas. I took off both plugs, and accidently put the bar oil in the gas port. Realizing that, I poured out all I could, then added a small bit of gas to rinse and dilute with, , poured that out, and repeated a couple of times. I didn't think that was it. I also now only take the plug off the one I am filling, not both at one time.

The other thing was the culprit. I had the gas can (plastic) on a workbench outside the shop. It had a canopy over it, which kept it under shade most of the day. The can had sun bleached out, and just in the last few weeks, the spout developed a small crack. I didn't thing anything about it. Well, that caused the gas to evaporate, and condensed the oil mix considerably, which caused the piston to coat and freeze up.

From now on, the can stays inside the shop, except when I am out cutting. More advice from the repair guy: if the gas is more than 6 weeks old, even with stablilzers, toss it. Don't use any additives. Alcohol has been in gas since we went to unleaded. It is actually good for your saw as it removes/absorbs water from the gas. What are you really saving compared to the cost of the repairs? Pennies. Mix up only what you use. Forget the 5 gallon cans.

robo hippy

[Kyle Iwamoto]

I argee with you. Toss your gas. I've "fixed" many saws that had gummed up.
If you're not going to use the saw for a week or so, take the cap off, dump out the gas, start the saw to run out the gas in the line and carb. This is more important than dumping out the gas. My opinion of Stabilzers is to avoid it. It's pricey, and doesn't work all that well. May as well buy 1 gallon, mix it and toss it out at the end of the year.
To clean out your saw, pull the spark plug, TURN THE IGNITION OFF. pour a little gas (mixed with the oil) into the carb and the spark plug hole. Pull the cord, and the motor should turn, if not let it sit until the gas dissolves the oil. Repeat until the saw pulls freely. Let the saw dry out and put it back together. You can imagine what will happen if you leave the ignition on and you get a spark..... Don't try it.

[Steve Schlumpf]

Reed - thanks for the great advice! Sorry to hear about your chainsaw!

[Jeff Nicol]

Reed, It sounds like a bad day in the end! What kind of saw were you using? I have 2 Stihls and one is in its 18th year and it has never been apart and I use it less than the bigger MS 290 which is only 4yrs old. I mix only a gallon at a time and sometimes the gallon may not get used up in a couple months. I have never tossed any gas and never had a gum up, I did the same thing you did with the bar oil in the gas tank trick one day also! Did the same fix so that must work. Just wondering though your saw should have been smoking like a bug fogger if the gas had evaporated down that much, was it? Just trying to think of all the things that make us scratch our heads.

Good luck with the fix,

Jeff

[Matt Ranum]

I've talked with guys too who get rid of their gas if its more than 2 months old but I routinely use gas thats sat for 6 months with no troubles. I could see an excessively oil rich mix or the bar oil mistake causing the problem but as Jeff said it should have smoked like your fogging the motor down.

Hope you never have that problem again.

[Reed Gray]

Well, the saw is a Husky 365 I think, about 7 years old. There was no smoking. Don't really know how far down the gas evaporated. No signs at all that some thing was going wrong.

Another thing the saw guy said is that the saws are made to run at 2 speeds, idle, and full throttle.

robo hippy

[Bernie Weishapl]

Thanks for the info Reed. It is good to know. Sorry to hear about the saw.

[Randall Hodge]

One gallon at a time and if that gas gets left longer than a month I add fuel stablizer. Although most 2 cycle oils already have it in them. The gas that was recommended by the manufacturer was premium too. Everything with gas in it come Fall gets the fuel stabilizer treatment and in 6 years time there's never been a problem.

[Wayne Kuhn]

I am a firm believer of precise gas/oil mix at 1 gallon at a time with stabilizer-always.No problems here.
Wayne K

[Nathan Hawkes]

Reed, I just had a similar experience with my Husqvarna 394XP, which resulted in a new piston & cylinder. I usually run a little rich on the oil, and set the carb rich, but apparently something happened to make the saw lean out a bit, and I didn't really notice it. It had been running hot the last several times I'd used it, but about a month ago it got HOT during a long cut on a 50" maple log. Bad words were said. A lot of them. I checked into the price of parts, and husky wants about $450 for a new OEM cylinder & piston, and there is no aftermarket supplier. DOH. Ebay it was. I managed to get one for less than $75, and an entire afternoon of disassembly and reassembly. I do my own repairs if I can. This was actually pretty straightforward. Just put it back the way it came apart, and don't scratch the piston with the ring compressor (a piece of greased aluminum sheet metal and a big hose clamp... :D). Runs like a champ. I hope yours is back in action soon. Thanks for the tip on the oil. I just thought I was doing it a favor with extra oil because I often make LONG cuts with it--I have an alaskan mill and like making flitch slabs from big logs. Sometimes the cut might last 10 minutes or more depending on the log. I've had to stop and add gas and oil in the middle of a long cut on a 24" white oak. I didn't know about the gunking up. I use "sea-foam" in the saw, which is a bunch of petroleum distillates and alcohol, which is supposed to keep that from happening, but the used piston/crankcase that I got was FILTHY inside. Appreciate the info. Happy safe sawing to you!

[Dave Ogren]

Reed,

Sorry to read about your problem. I never have had a problem like yours. I have a an early 70's Homelite 360AO and a Jonsred 625 about 15 years old. I always double the amount of the oil in the gas (suggested by a lot of repair guys) and only mix 1 gallon at a time. My 4 2 cycle machines always start by the 5th pull. The 2 cycle oil contains a stabilizer. A lot of times my hedge trimmer is only run about 4 times a year, I leave the gas in and no problems. About once a year sometimes twice I will add a hefty dose if Chevron with Techron to the fuels of all of my yard machines. I really thing that is a big key.

Good luck,

Dave

[charlie knighton]

sorry about your saw, thanks for the heads up, i am very guilty of leaving gas in saw, i use electric around the house as much as possible, almost worth buying invertor for using electric chainsaw in field

[Dick Strauss]

Reed,
I just heard about a product called "Start Your Engines" made by the makers of Stabil. It is supposed to be able to dissolve varnish buildup from all components when a tool has been left in storage without a fuel stabilizer (kind of like liquid plumber for a small gas engine's fuel system).

http://www.goldeagle.com/brands/start_your_engines/default.aspx

I have no connection to this product but hope it will save you a few $$$$.

[D-Alan Grogg]

I've used chainsaws for years, but I've never had that particular problem. I don't dump my fuel (don't want it polluting the ground water, etc). I always use stabilizer during the winter months.

[Hilel Salomon]

As a chainsaw and yard equipment nut, fuel and storage are important considerations for me. Especially since I stay in either SC or VA for many weeks at a time and the machines lie idle. In the past, you were supposed to dump out all the mixture in your machines before storing them. Now, however, a lot of people suggest that you keep the machine full and store it that way. The reason is that most people use gas/alcohol mix and when dry, the gaskets will rot. After having stored it for a while, dump the mixture from your machine and put fresh mixture in it WHEN YOU ARE READY TO USE THE MACHINE.
The additive that helps keep gas fresh is necessary but, if you can, also use gas w/out alcohol. I have a 365 and it is great. It also starts a hole heap easier now that I use the full tank method when storing. I have a couple of 372's as well and lots of Stihls. The higher end Husky's and Stihls are excellent machines.
Good Luck,
Hilel.
Hilel

[Nathan Hawkes]

Hilel, where are you finding gas without alcohol?? I've tried several places locally and can't seem to find it! I've heard from several sources that the 10% ethanol makes saws run hotter, though it does supposedly help with the varnishing. Hot is bad as far as I'm concerned, after my recent piston/cylinder change. Thanks,

Nate

[Hilel Salomon]

Nate,

Several gas stations carry non gasohol products. I'll PM you with one near you.
Hilel