Millers Falls Breast Drills ?

[Mike Holbrook]

There are quite a few models of these drills over many years. It took me quite a while to figure out which of the egg beaters I wanted and I am hoping to find a short cut on the information trail this time. I have the Millers Falls info sight but it does not discuss how well the various models work.

Are particular models of the Miller's Falls breast drills significantly more desirable than others? I see innovations like extended hand cranks, multiple gears, adjustable shoulder/breast plates.... I am wondering if any of these features is particularly useful? Since the breast drills were designed to allow the user to exert more power and use larger bits I am particularly curious as to whether or not features like gears or extended cranks make significant improvements.

Thanks all you old tools,

Mitch

[Gary Herrmann]

I've got a nbr 97. I think the different gears do come in handy depending on the size of the hole, depth and material. But I'll also admit to just being fascinated by the ingenuity of multi-speed drills. It is a heavy drill though.

I've also used a 120B which I liked.

[Dave Matson]

Hehe. Indeed the breast drill market is far muddier than it is for hand drills. For the small diameter bits it's easy - get a MF no. 2. The choices get more important for their big brothers though since the torque required to turn bigger bits really starts to come into play.

The most desirable....that would be the No. 97. It has two speeds adjustable on the fly and has a double ratchet so you can move the gear crank in either direction and it will still advanced clockwise (unfortunately the one I have has a seized ratchet but thats a different post) Also just as desirable is the No. 2200. Its lighter than the 97 but lacks the continuous motion ratchet.
The bells and whistles help but are not necessary. Adjustable handle lengths like on the No.13 help with giving you a longer moment arm to turn large bits, but a more efficient way is with gear reduction. Any drill with a 1-1 and 3-1 gear ratio or similar, will serve you well. Also pay attention to the chuck type as a three jaw chuck works much better for round twist bits than a two jaw (round bits will just spin in my No.13 so I had to find some square shank twist bits for it). Many of the iterations made by MF where to simply change the chuck on one model of a drill. In addition the handle type can be a factor. The split frame drills (like the 97) can be easier to hold compared to the rod type frame. I find I rarely use the drills as they are named - against my chest, but more often hold them vertically like a smaller hand drill.

I personally have a No. 13 which I purchased for its 4.5-1 gear ratio (works great where speed is needed) and a busted ratchet No.97 (all the bells but no whistles). The No.97 is awesome but its a little heavy. I can certainly see more of breast drills in my future.

[Mike Holbrook]

Ahh very good information guys. There is light at the end of the tunnel!

Thanks,

Mitch

[Joshua Clark]

I'll cast my vote for the MF No. 97 as well. It's by far the most gizmo-laden drill they made. The transmission in that thing amazes me. If you're looking for one keep in mind that they originally came with a side handle and an auxiliary breast plate that fit over the smaller hand-sized breast plate. The auxiliary plate was used when securing it against your chest. The smaller plate was used when gripping it like a pistol with your trigger finger through the hole in the cast handle.

The Yankee 1555 was North Brother's breast drill with similar features to the MF 87. http://hyperkitten.com/pics/tools/ads/yankee3_mid.jpg
Josh

[Harlan Barnhart]

I have one and I like it. I never thought of it as a "breast drill", more like a heavy eggbeater. Some of those ratcheting features seem over the top but overall it is a smooth, well designed tool.

[Joe Rogers]

With regard to the Millers Falls #97 and #96, the frozen ratchet selector sleeve and ratchet can be freed up with the judicious use of carburetor cleaner and a couple of properly sized hose clamps. The clamps I am referring to are the ones you can get at an auto parts store for small radiator hoses or large heater hoses. The hose clamps allow you to grip the sleeve and housing without damaging them and the carb cleaner is to dissolve the congealed oil that has bound up the mechanism. I spray the assembly after securing the clamps. The spray won't hurt the clamps or the ratchet assembly. Be careful with other painted surfaces though. Dribble the cleaner on the sleeve and housing and patiently apply torque to the screw part of the clamp. It will eventually break the sleeve free. Continue to apply the cleaner and move the selector sleeve until it is moving easily. Then treat the assy with penetrating oil like Kroil. Several treatments of solvent and oil may be necessary to fully disolve the old oil and rinse it out. When you are satisfied with the operation oil liberally and enjoy the tool. It is fascinating.
JR

[Mike Holbrook]

Great information gentlemen!
The 97 is a monster and from what I have seen it is very expensive, would love to have one but may have to settle for something a little smaller and less expensive. It seems from what I have read that a brace is the better tool when one wants to drive large bits anyway? However, most of the braces I see have two jaw chucks, like the MF 1710 I just got. I was trying hex shanks in my 1710 a little earlier and the jaws in mine do seem to be able to grip a hex decently, although round shanks seem to slip. I also just got a Stanley 100 Plus #610 with a three jaw chuck which holds hex and round bits well but is anything but heavy duty.

What I think I will shoot for now is a hand/breast drill with multiple speeds. I was thinking about a shoulder drill but much of what I am reading suggests that few people use the shoulder feature anyway. There seem to be cross over drills where similar drills are offered in hand and shoulder versions with similar features and multiple speeds. The shoulder versions like the 97 have tops that work with hand or shoulder support. The hand versions seem to have large wooden handles with flat often larger tops that can be used against the shoulder. There is an issue I am having with the hand versions though. The information on the Miller Falls site does not provide gear ratios for hand versions like they do for the shoulder/breast versions. The hand drills list numbers of pinions instead. Maybe the hand versions have the same gear ratios as their shoulder counter parts?

Interesting information on freeing up the gears on the seized 97. Does carburetor fluid work better than: Kerosene, WD-40, Goof Off, Degreaser, 3 in 1 Oil?

Thanks

[Gary Herrmann]

You can find a 97 for $40 - $50, if that's in your budget. There is a guy on ebay trying to sell one for ovre $300, which is insane. Other than that one, I haven't seen one in awhile though.

[Dave Matson]

I think I bought my seized one for $45 which was a pretty good price since it was complete with the auxiliary breast plate and side handle. I have tried using WD-40 to free the ratchet and it didn't budge. Thanks so much for that carb cleaner tip joe! I'll try it soon.

You will probably find any breast drill useful mike, so long as it has a 3 jaw chuck. Don't rule out Goodell-Pratt. Several of their models where continued on in the MF line after the companys merged.

Heres a decent G-P one with a speed selector that ends in 2 hours!
ebay: 320434002774

Happy hunting!

[Joe Rogers]

Interesting information on freeing up the gears on the seized 97. Does carburetor fluid work better than: Kerosene, WD-40, Goof Off, Degreaser, 3 in 1 Oil?



My guess is any would work with differing times to success. I had the "Gum Cutter" on the shelf. A spray can with a tube extension on the nozzle seemed to get the solvent into the action efficiently. The big advantage to my method is really the hose clamps wich prevent chewing up the sleeve. I didn't want to grab it with pliers or channel locks. The frame would make that difficult anyway.
Good luck with the process and post your results.
Joe

[Gary Herrmann]

Dave are you pulling out the adjuster knob outside the main gear and then trying to change the ratchet position? I don't know if it's the correct way of doing it, but it makes it easier for me.

I like the MF 97, but I do think the NB 1555 has a more positive gear engagement mechanism.

[Mike Holbrook]

I just won a drill on Ebay, Millers Falls #980:
http://oldtoolheaven.com/hand_drills/drill5.htm
It is actually called a hand drill. At 15 3/4 - 16 " it is a little smaller than a #97 Shoulder Drill but about as big as "hand drills" get.. The end of the handle is similar to a brace but a little smaller. The #980 is the same as a #98 but has a larger handle end. The better to apply a little extra pressure with. It has some similarities with the #97 but has a few less features.

It is hard to tell from pictures on Ebay but I think the drill will clean up well. A large portion of the varnish was scratched off the handle but there does not appear to be any significant damage to the actual wood. The seller claims there are no functional problems and that it feels tight operationally. Mine appears to be one of the later models as it has the idler pinion and and a solid handle. I got it for $20 + shipping.

Can't wait to get my hands on it and start the restoration process. I intentionally bought a drill that I thought needed some but not a large amount of TLC as my learner in this regard. Here is hoping I do not have the seized up issues mentioned above.

[Mike Holbrook]

Dave, thanks for the tip on the drill for sale. By the time I got it I had placed the bid on the drill I won and the one you mentioned had timed out.

There is something I have noticed about these older tools that I am trying to figure out. They seem to get something in or on the surface that is not rust but darkens the metal. I am guessing that this substance is a combination of elements. I know there are some products out there that are even designed to place a protective coating over steel. I have a product made by Empire Manufacturing called "Top Saver" that claims to have a "surface sealant/conditioner. I also have some "Renaissance- Micro-crystalline Wax Cleaner/Polish that was recommended by Highland Hardware to protect the tops of table saws and the surface of tools. A little dirt and grime rubbed into an oily surface possibly also containing some substances like the ones I mention may cause the surface condition I am seeing.

My question is whether or not some of these solvents/lubricants remove or add to this condition? I doubt that many substances will remove that sort of film chemically. I am thinking that some sort of mild abrasive would be required to get it off. I am asking myself whether or not it would be wise to try to get that kind of film off or not? Even a mild abrasive is going to remove some amount of the metal surface in the process. I bought copper and nylon brushes and I have copper, nylon & stainless steel brushes for my Dremel tool. I am wondering where and where not to use those types of devices. I am sure one wants to be judicious in their use, but how judicious?

Shine on,
Mitch

[Bob Easton]

Is it safe to assume, Mitch, that you intend the drill to be a "user" and not a collector's item? That darkening of the metal is the "patina" that some collectors value, and should be left as is if you see the drill as a collector's item.

I have a Goodell-Pratt 5 1/2 that I bought as a user. I used it as I found it for a couple of years, complete with about a hundred years of accumulated grime. By the way, the two speed transmission worked just fine. Last month, being between major projects, I decided to refurbish the drill much like what Wictor Kuc does.

The only chemicals I used was common mineral spirits for removing old dried oil and grime, and a borg variety paint stripper (rather mild stuff). Much of the rest of the cleanup was with a brass bristle brush, and in some areas Dremel steel brushes. That brightened up the metal. I followed that with very fine micro abrasive film for further polishing.

Not enough metal was removed to make any difference in operation. See more of it at this blog entry (http://www.bob-easton.com/blog/?p=807).

http://www.bob-easton.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2009/10/goodell-pratt-refurb-1.JPG

[Mike Holbrook]

Bob, very nice work! Yes, like yours, mine will be a user. I have been considering doing a restoration project with it from the get go though. I think refurbishing one or more of these drills would be a hoot. I was glad to read in your blog that you have found your drill an asset as a user.

I believe WK Tools has a couple refurbished drills for sale on Ebay right now, including a GP #5 1/2 and a MF #2. I'm following them to see if anyone gets to the reserve. My plans are more along the line of doing the work myself not buying them. IMHO your work looks just as good, very encouraging for me.

In regard to the painting, your blog says you did 3 coats. Is it safe to assume that you brushed on an enamel? Good to know that working your drill with the wire brushes did not make a change in it operationally.

I am wondering what kind of boat(s) you build? I retired from the white water boats and just paddle flat water and fishing canoes lately. I have been giving consideration to building a McKenzie boat. Even though the rivers in and around Metro Atlanta tend to be rocky.

[Gary Herrmann]

All I've ever done is take the drills apart and clean out the gunk. I've seen Wiktor's drills. Bob, your's is right there with his. Beautiful job.

[Bob Easton]

Bob, very nice work! ...

In regard to the painting, your blog says you did 3 coats. Is it safe to assume that you brushed on an enamel? ...

I am wondering what kind of boat(s) you build? ...

Thanks! The paint is very simple, Rustoleum spray enamel. I used a coat of light gray primer and then two top coats of red. Unlike Wiktor, I did not bake the paint. It seems durable enough without the baking.

Boats? A little further down in my blog you'll find a build log for a 12 foot decked canoe. Another similar boat starting soon.

[Mike Holbrook]

Thanks for directing me to the boat building section, missed it before. Very nice paddle. It looks sort of like the ones my buddy Tom Blackburn use to make. I have a Blackburn Designs Lutra (designed for Mike Galt) hanging on the wall in the other room, plus a few more old wooden designs, almost as nice to look at as to paddle with. I'm afraid to put the Lutra in the water for fear of breaking it. One day I will have to try making a paddle myself I have thought about it enough.

You think that canoe is tippy when you get to Atlanta I'll let you try getting into my 12' Blackhawk Proem. Initial stability was not part of the design plan. Almost turned her over once myself- ;-)

[Mike Holbrook]

Since I selected a drill and have now begun the restoration project I will start a new thread instead of continuing to creep off topic here.

I am hoping to get a little help from some of you who posted here. The drill I got was covered with gunk and restoring it looks to be quite a challenge. I think the speed shifting device is frozen. Pictures on the new thread....

Mitch