Drawer Slide Length???

[Jason Strauss]

Hello Creekers,

I’ve landed a job building kitchen cabinets for my wife’s uncle. I’ve completed the measuring and design work, and have drawn up the plans. He’s okay’d them. So, now I’m putting together my quote. I’ve pretty much got that wrapped up; sourced and priced the prefinished ply; calculated and sourced the necessary BF of hickory; and sourced and priced most of the hardware. My question has to do with drawer slide lengths. He wants full extension side mount sliders – I’ll likely get these from Rockler. If the cabinets have the standard 24” finished depth, does that mean I get 24” drawer slides? Or do I get 22” to account for the thicknesses of the face frame (¾”) and plywood back (also ¾”)? I would assume there’s some sort of spacer or extension clip to allow for this. Any nudge in the right direction would be appreciated!

[Jim Kirkpatrick]

Jason, Your slide length should equal the distance of the actual drawer outside depth. If your drawer is 22" long, get 22" slides.

[Rafael Carias]

If you get the 22" slides and make your drawers 22" deep you'll be fine.

Since you'll likely buying in bulk I recommend you to look into getting your slides from a different source, Rockler can be pretty spendy for hardware.

[Mark Boyette]

I always use 20" hettich full extensions on 24" deep kitchens and found them to be plenty deep. I'd bet you can find quality guides for a lot less outside of rockler.. just a thought.
Mark.

[Tom Veatch]

Jason, last time I needed drawer slides for shop cabinets, back in January, I got a couple of dozen of the "economy" full extension slides from here (http://wwhardware.com/catalog.cfm/GroupID/Cabinet%20Drawer%20Slides/CatID/Drawer%20Slides%2C%20Full%20Extension%20Ball%20Bea ring/SubCatID/Economy%20Full%20Extension).

Prices and delivery were right, and quality seems to be on a par with Accuride - at least initially. For all I know they may fall apart a few years down the road, but so far, they seem to be doing the job quite well.

Disclaimer: Just a customer, not affiliated otherwise, in any way.

[Jim Kirkpatrick]

I always use 20" hettich full extensions on 24" deep kitchens and found them to be plenty deep. I'd bet you can find quality guides for a lot less outside of rockler.. just a thought.
Mark.

Jason, just so there's no confusion. If you use a 20" full extension slide on a 24" drawer as Mark suggests, when open, you're gonna have 4" of drawer inside the carcass.

PS I agree, Rockler is a bad source for slides when buying in bulk. I use Woodworker's Hardware ( wwhardware.com ) after first searching eBay.

[Rick Dennington]

Look--it's real simple. If your cabinet sides are 24" deep, get 22" d.s. That way, you won't hit the back of the cabinet. If you use 24 " the slides won't work. Make your drawers 22", slides 22", and your ok to go !!

[Rick Dennington]

You can buy good ball bearing slides at H.D. or Lowes either one. Any size-save on ordering, s&h.

[Mike Nguyen]

I bought them in bulk of 20 pairs at the time from ebay. http://cgi.ebay.com/22-Full-Extension-Ball-Bearing-Drawer-slide-6-9-pair_W0QQitemZ390097793628QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_De faultDomain_0?hash=item5ad3a3f25c&_trksid=p3286.c0.m14
Mike

[Kevin Groenke]

I've used thousands of the economy slides from WW's hardware. These slides do have fewer ball bearings in the "travelers" than the "premium" Accuride, Blum, K&V, etc. but IMO it does not significantly affect function or durability. We've had them in institutional use for 5+years and the only failures we heard of were from removal/reinstallation of heavily loaded drawers(whch could happen with any drawers

We cycle tested a pair 10,000 times with a 90lb bag of portland cement in it with no visibly discernable wear or damage.

GlideRite is another vendor with attractive prices.
http://www.gliderite.com/bearing.htm

I think most of the suggested alternative sources would be less expensive (w/shipping) than buying retail from Rockler or a BORG.

-kg

[Doug Shepard]

I just went through getting some full extension Accuride slides and after reading their specs sort of came to the same conclusion that Rick stated so I got them 2" shorter than the cabinet depth. The best prices I was able to find were from this outfit and no complaints with their service.
http://www.ahturf.com/

[Jason Strauss]

Gentlemen,

Thanks for the great information! It appears that 22" is the way to go and Rockler is to be avoided for bulk purchases. Looks like I'll be surfing the web this weekend for some better pricing. Again, thanks!

[Steve Clardy]

22" is standard in the industry.

24" slides are 23-3/4" in length. And the price jumps considerably.

[Rob Cunningham]

You can also get full extension slides with 1" overtravel. They allow full access to the drawer. KV 8405 are ones that I have used, I'm sure there other brands. I get most of my hardware from Woodworkers Hardware.
http://wwhardware.com/

[Jason Strauss]

Okay, here's some related questions. If I'm using face frames, conceivably there's some overhang of the frame inside the box (that’s how my Medallion brand cabinets are at home).

- If I attach the slides directly to the cabinet box, wouldn't the frame impede the movement of the slide?
- Do you have to build out the inside of the box to be able to attach the slides? Or do you just size the box to be flush with the inside of the face frame?
- If I were to use 1½” wide stock for face frame construction, wouldn’t this leave way too much material hanging off the outside of the box? Does the even matter? The cabinets that are in my kitchen, which I installed, only had ¼” hanging off the side.
- Am I over thinking this? Please help!

[Doug Shepard]

My recent shop project had a mix of face frame and inset drawers. I think maybe the face frame are OK as far as being able to go the full cabinet depth but the inset drawers are where 2" shorter was called for. They make some sort of extra brackets that work with the face frame drawers and there will be numerous experts here on those. I skipped that and just glued/bradded some ply filler strips inside to get the slide where they cleared the face frames, but in my case that was just 1/2". If you've got 1-1/2" I think you'd want to get the extra hardware.

[Bill Orbine]

Okay, here's some related questions. If I'm using face frames, conceivably there's some overhang of the frame inside the box (that’s how my Medallion brand cabinets are at home).

- If I attach the slides directly to the cabinet box, wouldn't the frame impede the movement of the slide?
- Do you have to build out the inside of the box to be able to attach the slides? Or do you just size the box to be flush with the inside of the face frame?
- If I were to use 1½” wide stock for face frame construction, wouldn’t this leave way too much material hanging off the outside of the box? Does the even matter? The cabinets that are in my kitchen, which I installed, only had ¼” hanging off the side.
- Am I over thinking this? Please help!

Jason, it's becoming obvious to me you never built a kitchen before. For the first timer, I wouldn't say you are over thinking the project. You have a lot of questions than answers. An experience fabricator has more answers than questions he's not going to bother asking himself.

I'm not sure if you have the job or not, only that you have an approval on a design. Usually, once a job has been secured and before you start to build or cut a single piece of wood, you'd do a full scale layout which will help you determine how you'll build the kitchen and provides you with all the sizes of the every piece of the cabinets, doors, frames and so forth. The layout can be done on a single board the that's the longest length/ height of the kitchen cabinets.

Secondy, the drawings you provided....... since you are likely a first timer, I'm sure you did a scaled drawing of the cabinet interiors (for yourself, mostly.... not the client). This to determine hardware, roll outs, trash bins, appliances, plumbing, electrical and so forth so you can "SEE" what's you'll need (drawer slide length, for example), and make sure you don't have any major issues. This to help you factor in the the cost of materials and labor. After building kitchens a number of times, I don't need to do scaled drawings for myself, though I do design drawings for my clients. Still and ALWAYS, I do a full scale layout in the shop once I've been commisioned to do the job regardless a kitchen, a hutch, a vanity, a library....ect.

As for some questions you asked, normally 22" slides are sufficient for 24" cabinet depth. Frame overhangs can be remedied with packouts once cabinets has been built and frames installed. The packout is something that's as long as the inside depth of cabinet, the width (or height) of the slides, and as thick as it needs to be to make the slides flush with the frame. I try to avoid doing packouts as much as I can with the layout, but many times it can't be done without. Good Luck.

[Eric Gustafson]

GlideRite is another vendor with attractive prices.
http://www.gliderite.com/bearing.htm

I-kg

+1 on the Gliderite slides. I am using the #70 in my shop and they are holding up well. I can find no fault with them and they are a fraction of the cost of other makes.

[Bob Carreiro]

22" is what you need.

"Full Extension" is misleading. The drawer back will still be inside the cabinet when fully extended up to a few inches depending on brand. If your uncle wants fully extended drawers, purchase "over-travel" slides. These will allow the drawer back to extend completely outside the cabinet face up to a few inches, likewise, depending on brand.

Good luck with your project.

Bob Carreiro
Poulsbo, WA

[Steve Clardy]

Okay, here's some related questions. If I'm using face frames, conceivably there's some overhang of the frame inside the box (that’s how my Medallion brand cabinets are at home).

- If I attach the slides directly to the cabinet box, wouldn't the frame impede the movement of the slide?
- Do you have to build out the inside of the box to be able to attach the slides? Or do you just size the box to be flush with the inside of the face frame?
- If I were to use 1½” wide stock for face frame construction, wouldn’t this leave way too much material hanging off the outside of the box? Does the even matter? The cabinets that are in my kitchen, which I installed, only had ¼” hanging off the side.
- Am I over thinking this? Please help!

I fill the sides in with pine.
1-1/4 or 1-1/2 material, running full length on the cab box sides, by whatever thickness it needs to be to flush the side with the face frame. Glued and nailed

[Darrell Bade]

I used Blum slides on my face frame cabinets. I used the bracket they sell as an option to mount the back of the slide and screwed the slide to the face frame on the front. For the pullout out drawers I used screwed two pieces of 3/4" material to the cabinet side so the slide was even with the face frame.

As others have said, woodworkers hardware will be way cheaper than Rockler for the same thing.

[Chris Friesen]

"Full Extension" is misleading. The drawer back will still be inside the cabinet when fully extended up to a few inches depending on brand.

I must have gotten lucky with all of mine then... on pretty much all the ones I've used the inside of the drawer back is almost flush with the outside of the cabinet.

Of course if your drawer is longer than the slides then the extra length won't be directly accessible.

[Karl Brogger]

I used to like making my drawers a 1/2" longer than the slides. I don't know why, but it always bothered me when the drawer would come totally out of the box.

[glenn bradley]

My experience is like Chris mentions. Many slides come in metric and most cabinet shops use metric. The 22" slides I use are actually 550mm so, about 21.65" more or less. I just build accordingly.

[Scott Hildenbrand]

Since you'll likely buying in bulk I recommend you to look into getting your slides from a different source, Rockler can be pretty spendy for hardware.

+1 on this..

I've dealt with http://wwhardware.com/ before for buying (70+) knobs and had great service from them. They offer discounts on their slides per case of 10 or more.

[Geoff Potter]

Try Custom Service Hardware. I don't think you can beat the pricing on quantity and shipping is reasonable and timely.

http://www.cshardware.com/

[Michael Heffernan]

Here is an Ebay vendor that I have purchased from before.
http://cgi.ebay.com/Full-Extension-22-Ball-Bearing-Drawer-Slide-100lb_W0QQitemZ310112672704QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLH_D efaultDomain_0?hash=item483427dbc0&_trksid=p4634.c0.m14.l1262
These are Fulterer FR5000 full extension slides at $8.08 each. Shipping is cheap ($5.75 for the first slide, $.75 for each additional one.) You can contact them for bulk discounts.
You definitely need 22" slides for a face frame 24" deep cabinet.
You might want to think about 1" overtravel slides. That extra 1" is great for face frame cabinets as well as 25" deep countertops. Your drawers will open all the way.

[Mark Boyette]

24" cabinet, 20" guides and 20" drawers.



Jason, just so there's no confusion. If you use a 20" full extension slide on a 24" drawer as Mark suggests, when open, you're gonna have 4" of drawer inside the carcass.

PS I agree, Rockler is a bad source for slides when buying in bulk. I use Woodworker's Hardware ( wwhardware.com ) after first searching eBay.