Caveat Emptor

[Ben Franz]

I just received three books from Taunton Press - ordered during the recent 25% off sale. While flipping through FWW Design Book Eight, I noticed a familiar look. I got out my copy of FWW Furniture - 102 Contemporary Designs, purchased earlier this year. IT'S THE EXACT SAME BOOK WITH A DIFFERENT COVER :mad::mad::mad:. They added a two page introduction and a 5 page "Exercise in Design" article at the end. Otherwise, the publications are page for page identical.

I subscribe to 3 differnt Taunton magazines, bought the FWW compilation DVD and have several other books of theirs. Most readers are aware of the repetition of material from magazine to books. The same article might appear in a furniture construction book and a book on a particular tool or family of tools for example. I think this instance has crossed the line into deception and fraudulent business practice. I will be asking Taunton for a refund and reimbursement of shipping costs both ways. I'm interested to hear of any explanation for this misrepresentation and then I'll decide if I remain a customer and subscriber.

I'll post results here. Arrrgggghhh!

[Mike Henderson]

I agree they should put a statement something like, "The bulk of the information in this book was previously published in the book XXXXX". To not do so is misleading.

Mike

[Peter Quinn]

Yeah, they are big into recycling. I'd be surprised if they don't make it right though on the return once you express your feelings about the issue. Sometimes I buy those compilation special editions knowing every bit of it exists in some other magazine I already have just for the convenience of having the material in one package. But there is clearly nothing convenient about buying the same book twice with two different covers.

[Keith Christopher]

I've been disappointed with FWW for a while now. I really only subscribe to woodsmith anymore. I am thinking about going with woodworking mag though. I dunno, so much has been done/said rarely anything new anymore.

[Matthew Kenney]

Ben,

I'm an editor at FWW magazine. I'm sorry that you're not happy with the Design Book. If you contact customer service, I'm sure that you'll be able to return it. Did you buy it directly from Taunton? When I read your post I went to the store on our website and checked the description given for Design Book Eight. This is the 5th paragraph of that description:

(Virtually all of the content in Design Book Eight has appeared in one of our special newsstand publications, entitled Furniture: 102 Contemporary Designs.)

I imagine that it being in the 5th paragraph of the description makes it easy to miss. Again, I'm sorry.

[James Carmichael]

I've been disappointed with FWW for a while now.

LOML bought me a subscription to FWW for Xmas and I've really been enjoying it, of course, I only purchased it occaisionally over the past few years, so I don't really have much experience to compare it to.

I especially liked the May issue and am planning to build the Morris chair.

[Chip Lindley]

In the early '80s I was hungry for any woodworking information I could get my hands on! FWW filled the bill very nicely. For 10 or more years, I thoroughly learned the basics (and more advanced aspects) of woodworking.

But there comes a time when rehashed information has no utility and is
not useful to a reader who has advanced beyond that point. FWW seems to rely on a stream of new readers who glean their retreaded articles.

By 2000 I dropped my subscription to FWW because of this very reason. Too little NEW information! Sure, there may be one article per issue worth my while, but is one article worth the price of an expensive subscription, or even more expensive news stand price?

[Steve Rozmiarek]

Ben,

I'm an editor at FWW magazine. I'm sorry that you're not happy with the Design Book. If you contact customer service, I'm sure that you'll be able to return it. Did you buy it directly from Taunton? When I read your post I went to the store on our website and checked the description given for Design Book Eight. This is the 5th paragraph of that description:

(Virtually all of the content in Design Book Eight has appeared in one of our special newsstand publications, entitled Furniture: 102 Contemporary Designs.)

I imagine that it being in the 5th paragraph of the description makes it easy to miss. Again, I'm sorry.


Matthew, glad you stopped by. PLEASE read some of the many posts here about FWW slipping in quality. I really like the potential of the magazine, and I believe it used to include higher quality content. I strongly believe thats it's slipping into the average catagory, just like all the rest. I haven't got a useful bit from it in quite a while. Remember Lonnie Birds secretary? IMHO, that project was superb.

[Mike Henderson]

Matthew, glad you stopped by. PLEASE read some of the many posts here about FWW slipping in quality. I really like the potential of the magazine, and I believe it used to include higher quality content. I strongly believe thats it's slipping into the average catagory, just like all the rest. I haven't got a useful bit from it in quite a while. Remember Lonnie Birds secretary? IMHO, that project was superb.
I'll second that. More projects showing how to make complex furniture would be very appreciated.

Mike

[David DeCristoforo]

Yes, they "recycle" articles "ad infinitum". But if you happen to be an author, it's even worse because they do not pay the author for reprinting the work... no royalties or even a "token" payment...nada. It's in the "fine print" of their contract although I think you have to dip the contract in lemon juice or something to get it to appear.

In the end, there is only so much one can write about woodworking techniques. Eventually every publication has to start repeating. Sometimes someone comes up with a new "spin" but mostly the topic is just given a "fresh face" (or a new cover).

[Tom Welch]

I agree, at the premium price charged at the news stand for the mag, you would expect a premium product. The quality has slipped. Need more advanced articles. I used to buy FWW, in fact I have a complete shelf of them, but I stopped buying them about a year ago. My 2 cents.

[Wes Grass]

Stopped at the market tonight, checked the magazine rack while I was there. American Woodworker, I think, 'Special Edition' somethin' or other, about 1/8" thick. 6 bucks. Sealed in plastic so you can't even see if there's anything worthwhile in it. Which is probably why they seal it in plastic to begin with.

Subscribed to several mag's 10 years ago. Still have them. Some of them had typical covers proclaiming 'build the ultimate miter station', or tablesaw sled, or whatever. They were usually the 'rags' of the bunch. FWW stood out as the high end publication. And now I see FWW covers with 'build the ultimate ...'

Bummer. I'll stay subscribed for another couple years and see how it goes.

[John Schreiber]

Matthew, glad you stopped by. PLEASE read some of the many posts here about FWW slipping in quality. I really like the potential of the magazine, and I believe it used to include higher quality content. I strongly believe thats it's slipping into the average catagory, just like all the rest. I haven't got a useful bit from it in quite a while. Remember Lonnie Birds secretary? IMHO, that project was superb.
I don't think that it has really slipped in quality. I think they have just targeted a different market. There are very few people who will build or even appreciate a Lonnie Bird secretary, but there are lots of people at the grocery store looking for something they can build. They are at the high end of that group, but it's not targeted toward professionals or high-end hobbyists.

[Matt Meiser]

I just let my subscription lapse as well. No reason to repeat the reasons. I continued to get Wood for a long time since they discount the heck out of it. But IMHO, Fine Woodworking's elitist "you'll pay what we say you'll pay" attitude rubs me the wrong way when you consider the decline of the magazine from one about fine woodworking to one about everyday woodworking over the last few years. (Edit--John posted my take exactly while I was typing this.) I'll continue to check the newsstand and buy an occasional issue but even there I think they are up to $7?

Woodsmith and ShopNotes are both good IF there's a project you are interested in, but with only a couple projects per issue and precious little else, there's probably only a few a year.

American Woodworker, Woodworker's Journal, and Woodcraft are really poor IMHO. The latter two are just ads for Rocker and Woodcraft respectively--ones they want you to pay for. Then there's Woodworker's Journal's marketing techniques...

I'm down to just Popular Woodworking and Woodworking and I could see dropping the latter.

[Steve Rozmiarek]

I don't think that it has really slipped in quality. I think they have just targeted a different market. There are very few people who will build or even appreciate a Lonnie Bird secretary, but there are lots of people at the grocery store looking for something they can build. They are at the high end of that group, but it's not targeted toward professionals or high-end hobbyists.

I can only speak for myself, but I doubt I'm alone when I say that I completely disagree with that approach. You're right, it is what they are doing, but that crowd is the one looking for a $2 magazine, not a $7 magazine. Why on earth would you remarket to a different market at the expense of your existing one? I know, it's all about $, but it sure leaves a vacuum for the 201 level and higher skill niche.

I decided last year to not renew, then got a gift subscription, but I will not spend my own money on FWW, or any other magazine, until they actually include something for us more mature woodworkers. Good greif, I'm not an expert woodworker, not even close, so If I'm bored, are pure beginners their only market? We're a loyal lot (whats your predominate brand of tool?), the ones that stick with this sport that is. Give us a good magazine and we'll buy them until they quit printing. On the other hand, we're also pretty good at spotting useless glossy gimics that just waste our lumber funds.

BTW, where did Matthew go?

[Ken Fitzgerald]

Steve,

I'll disagree with you. I think the magazine to stay in business should spread its reader base....from beginners to "more mature" hobbiests and pros. Of course that means they'll have to broaden the material they print too. It may sound like a big goal but I think it's doable.

With the advent of information on the internet, the print industry has a big problem.

Why should advertisers spend their advertising dollars on a limited market?.....Subscribers only?

They could if they wanted spend their advertising at a number of woodworking websites and probably dramatically broaden the number of folks who will see the advertisement.

I see the print industry having some real problems in the not too distant future.

JMHO.

[John Schreiber]

BTW, where did Matthew go?
I'll bet he's smart enough to stay away. I'm glad he made suggestions to the original poster, but unless he's the editor-in-chief and or the owner of Taunton, he can't do anything for us.

Personally, SawMill Creek is the best bargain in a woodworking magazine I've ever seen.

[Matt Meiser]

future

The future is now.

We dropped our local paper because it turned to a piece of garbage. I actually caught them running the exact same AP article in two places in the same day's paper more than once. Their local coverage has gone to nil and what there is is so light on information it is useless, if its even correct. The paper isn't even thick enough to use as a drop cloth--takes a couple days worth to get enough thickness. We switched to the Toledo Blade and I'm not positive we'll keep that. The Ann Arbor News is out of business. The Detroit News and Free Press only deliver a couple days a week. And that all just isn't a result of our local economy because its happening everywhere. I know of a couple magazines that are gone from other hobbies I've had too.

They all blame their advertisers and readers for the cutbacks. I say if they'd adapt and print something worth reading, they wouldn't be losing their readers, and their advertisers would still be willing to pay to reach a decent size reader base.

[Ben Franz]

I submitted a return request a couple of days ago via email; hadn't received any response so I called this morning. Customer service said they had forwarded my request for an explanation to editorial and were waiting for their input before responding. The CS rep said she would issue a credit for the book cost + shipping and said I should keep the book anyway. From a CS standpoint I'd say that's more than good :D. I'll be interested to hear the editorial explanation promised.

I do appreciate the earlier response from the FWW editor posted above. In fairness, I have to say I didn't read the item description before I ordered it - just clicked on the buy button next to a thumbnail on the initial page of the site. I've bought the Design Book issues before so I didn't think I needed to read the item description. Even if the headline of that description had been 1" high and said GIGANTIC RIPOFF it would not have helped me (see signature line below). I still think it's kind of sneaky.

[Steve Rozmiarek]

Ken, you're right of course about print being in trouble. I like to have a shelf full of FWW mags, I do have a full set, and I personally prefer print over internet for some things. Here, we all communicate in a couple sentences, maybe even a few paragraphs. Print tended to be more in depth in the past. The abbreviated communication works here, because the exchange is so fast.

Seems to me that the magazines are trying to compete with the internet, which they will never be able to do without a new strategy. If you're right, and their way to make it is to dumb down the mag to gain subscribers, I wish them the best, but they'll be going it without my support. I guess I can start over in my old mags, and glean new info!

[Kent Cartwright]

I still like FW for the gallery in the back, which provides me the inspiration to push myself on each new project. I know there is a lot of retreading that goes on with the articles, but once you reach a certain level of competence in our chosen hobby/profession, your learning comes in snippets rather than buckets. I know when I go to conferences for my day job, nowadays I am happy to come away with 2 or 3 new ideas, versus when I first started when everything was new.

I also subscribe to Workshop News, which is more of an industry magazine, but at $10 a year I find it has a lot of useful information. Plus they showcase at least one woodworking shop each month, from the business point of view. As I am a business guy in my day job, I find that slant very interesting.

[John M Bailey]

My friends, I also recieve several woodworking magazines and catalogs including WOOD, Woodsmith, FWW, and others. I hear, understand, and agree with your complaints about woodworking magazines and newspapers.
I work in the print industry. The company I work for is the second largest printer in the world. All of the publishers and printers are in big trouble. This has been reality for us for several years. Now we have a recession which is hammering nails into the coffins of many publishers and titles and printers. But what you must understand is that they were in trouble long before the recession.
Of all the costs of magazine production, there is one cost the publisher and printer cannot change or control. This is the cost of Postage. Postal charges have risen faster than any other cost for the last 15 years. The postage costs have now surpassed the cost of producing the magazines. Think about that. The publishers are trying to cut costs as much as possible, but the greatest cost of the magazine is out of their hands.
I have worked in the finishing department for 16 years, I have first hand knowledge of these things. The USPS is in constant change, the regulations and sorting of mass mailings are constantly being changed. The USPS spends millions on some new sorting or barcode regulation or technology, then the printers spend many more millions of dollars to keep up with that change, then the USPS changes that regulation or method before the printers have time to comply.
Everyone can see that almost every company, business, industry, every part of the economy is doing what ever is possible to contain costs. In the print business, the big players are acually printing a large precent of the titles below cost. Then we have the USPS, who is hemoraging money. We have all heard of "spending a million to save a thousand", but the USPS spends tens of millions to save a couple of hundred.
I'm done ranting now
:D

[Steve Rozmiarek]

My friends, I also recieve several woodworking magazines and catalogs including WOOD, Woodsmith, FWW, and others. I hear, understand, and agree with your complaints about woodworking magazines and newspapers.
I work in the print industry. The company I work for is the second largest printer in the world. All of the publishers and printers are in big trouble. This has been reality for us for several years. Now we have a recession which is hammering nails into the coffins of many publishers and titles and printers. But what you must understand is that they were in trouble long before the recession.
Of all the costs of magazine production, there is one cost the publisher and printer cannot change or control. This is the cost of Postage. Postal charges have risen faster than any other cost for the last 15 years. The postage costs have now surpassed the cost of producing the magazines. Think about that. The publishers are trying to cut costs as much as possible, but the greatest cost of the magazine is out of their hands.
I have worked in the finishing department for 16 years, I have first hand knowledge of these things. The USPS is in constant change, the regulations and sorting of mass mailings are constantly being changed. The USPS spends millions on some new sorting or barcode regulation or technology, then the printers spend many more millions of dollars to keep up with that change, then the USPS changes that regulation or method before the printers have time to comply.
Everyone can see that almost every company, business, industry, every part of the economy is doing what ever is possible to contain costs. In the print business, the big players are acually printing a large precent of the titles below cost. Then we have the USPS, who is hemoraging money. We have all heard of "spending a million to save a thousand", but the USPS spends tens of millions to save a couple of hundred.
I'm done ranting now
:D


John, I had not considered the postage impact on publishers. Interesting point.

[johnny means]

I think the biggest problem facing publishers nowadays is the fact that printedd media just is not really seen as necessary by a large part of the population. I for one haven't bought a periodical in years. Why would I? I can get a gazillion articles a day on my cell phone. The younger generation just has no need for printed material. They have grown up on digital media and feel very comfortable with it as their primary source of information.

Remember the days when you had to mail a question to some expert and hope it would be answered in an upcoming issue. How useful is that now?

The days of the printed page are numbered.