LN Boggs spokeshave flat or curved?

[NICK BARBOZA]

Good afternoon all!

I'm getting myself into a project that has a number of curved pieces. The curve consist of both inside and outside but only in two dimensions (i.e. a piece of 8/4, same thickness throughout but the two edges are curved).

I am getting more and more into hand tools and am considering getting a spokeshave for just this purpose. I am looking at the Lie Nielsen Boggs models. Ideally, as I see it, I "should" get both the flat bottom(for outside curves and general work) and the curved bottoms (inside curves). But at this point that isn't in the budget to purchase both.

So the question: would a curved bottom spokeshave work on both types of curves? Would you recommend one before the other? Is one more versatile or useful? any other input gratefully accepted!

Thanks alot!
NWB

[Mike Henderson]

I find a curved spokeshave harder to work with. You have to adjust it very carefully and can't take too much of a cut or it'll chatter.

That said, I haven't used the LN curved spokeshave but own an LN flat spokeshave and it's wonderful. Tight mouth so you can't hog off wood but very good for finish shaving.

Mike

[Sean Hughto]

The LN shavs are great. It would not be optimal to try to use the curve bottom shave on flat work.

If scratch is a problem, consider trying out some old Stanley shaves off eBay. They are extrememly inexpensive and work well. I mean just until you save up for the LN of course....

[Bill Houghton]

In my opinion, you're making a good move by getting a shave WITHOUT those adjusting nuts, which I find can interfere with inside curves.

I concur with the other statements: your first shave should be a flat bottom. You will find it limits the minimum radius you can shave. I think the best metal shave for tight inside corners, although it's harder to find, is the cigar-type shave, of which the historic model is the Millers Falls No. 1 shave. You can find them used, and there's someone, but I can't recall who, making them new.

If your tight inside curves are limited in number, you can use a rasp or (gasp!) sandpaper until you can afford a second shave.

This is, by the way, a slippery slope all its own (quite a few of those, actually...).

[Don C Peterson]

I have both and without question the flat bottom is the workhorse of the two. I actually used a fine file to make the curved spokeshave more curved and I use it when I need to and it does the job, but the flat bottomed spokeshave is easier and more predictable. But the flat bottomed spokeshave just can't always get the job done, so you really need both IMO.

I also agree that the fiddly adjustment screws are just that, fiddly and in the way sometimes. I adjust my LN's with quick, light taps against the bench or shavehorse and it works great once you get the feel for it.

[David Keller NC]

I suppose this is an answer that's "not desired", but you really cannot get by without both. I use spokeshaves frequently in what I build, and a curved-bottom is simply not easily usable on an outside radius or flat work, because whether the tool takes too big of a shaving and stalls or doesn't take a shaving at all is very, very sensitive to the angle at which you hold it to the work.

On an inside curve, a flat-bottom spokeshave is only usable to a point until the width of the sole prevents taking a cut, in which case it isn't usable at all.

So what you decide on depends greatly on your anticipated amount of curved work. If you're going to make only one or a just a very few curved pieces, you may be better off with a rasp and sandpaper. If you're going to make a lot of them, spokeshaves are an enormous efficiency leap because the surface left behind needs no sanding.

I'd also mention that the LN Boggs tools are among the LN tools to which there is no comparison to an antique (their adjustable block planes are another example). I have both wooden bodied and old Stanley and Preston metal shaves, and none of them work anywhere near as well as the LN Boggs design.

[James Baker SD]

I have both, but being lazy, I usually grab the curved one for everything. I have used it enough that it doesn't give me a problem on flat surfaces. Only with really nasty grain will I dig out the flat one.

James

[D-Alan Grogg]

I only had the LN curved bottom shave when I did my Windsor chair recently. While a flat bottom would have been preferable for the outsides and flats, the curved bottom did the job quite well. You only have to get the hang of holding the "correct" angle. For me, that was so the front sole was referencing off the work piece. Also, the curve on the sole is very slight, so it's affect is not so extreme as to preclude working outsides or flats.

[Howard Mahoney]

I have a lot of shaves I inherited from my grandfather ( a wicker worker for several East Coast furniture companies--he left me some cool things). Working with them taught me there are subtle differences and speed and perfection are the results. Were it me and I was on a budget, I would get a Lee Valley curved shave and take a chance at the Borg flat shave that is a rip off of the Lie-Nielsen-Boggs. They are available at Japan Woodworker. There are differences in the flat bottom and curved when working so you need both.

There are ethical questions, but in these times a 90.00 difference is $90.00. However, if a great tool is to be used and enjoyed for life, I can also see ignoring the price difference and going for the best. I own four Lie-Nielsens (small cured shaves and all the Boggs). They are beautiful and work extremely well, but they don't significantly outperform the older Stanleys and Prestons I own in a flat bottom design (curved and concave are a different animal). Just sharpen with diligence, as the older blades don't hold the edge as long.

[NICK BARBOZA]

So I took the advise you all gave and order the flat Boggs. got it late last week and it works great! I had little experiance with spokeshaves until now but they have opened a number of doors for me. Cleaning curves with it has been a pleasure, and FAR better than sanding!!!!

I liked the flat so much that on Tuesday I ordered the curved Boggs and it should arrive today. You all were right about needing both. The curves on this piece are relitively mild, but the flat really couldnt touch them.


Thanks for the help!
NWB

[Gregg Feldstone]

If the curved (concave) Boggs shave is intended for outside (convex) curves, why don't they make one with the opposite shape; a convex blade intended for inside (concave) curves?

[John Keeton]

If the curved (concave) Boggs shave is intended for outside (convex) curves, why don't they make one with the opposite shape; a convex blade intended for inside (concave) curves?Not an expert on this subject Gregg, but I think you have it backward. The curved Boggs is convex and used for concave surfaces. Convex surfaces are done with a flat shave.

[NICK BARBOZA]

Not an expert on this subject Gregg, but I think you have it backward. The curved Boggs is convex and used for concave surfaces. Convex surfaces are done with a flat shave.


Im no expert either, but you got it John. On the same note with my minimal experience, when you hit the "sweet spot" on the curved shave, it will do outside (convex) curves just as well as the flat.

NWB

[James Owen]

.... I think the best metal shave for tight inside corners, although it's harder to find, is the cigar-type shave, of which the historic model is the Millers Falls No. 1 shave. You can find them used, and there's someone, but I can't recall who, making them new. ....


Tools for Working Wood used to sell a very nice reproduction of the MF #1, but just looking on the web site, it looks like they are not available; don't know whether this is permanent or temporary....

[Don C Peterson]

If the curved (concave) Boggs shave is intended for outside (convex) curves, why don't they make one with the opposite shape; a convex blade intended for inside (concave) curves?


I suspect we might be talking about two different things here... There are three different spokeshaves: The flat bottom, curved bottom, and concave. The flat bottom shave is good for flat and convex curves, the curved bottom shave is for concave curves, and the concave shave is for making rounded (convex) shoulders etc...

If I understand the question, you are asking why there isn't a convex shave that will make a cove shape (concave) on work surface. The answer is that there are convex spokeshaves out there, but LN doesn't make one. I can only assume that the demand for them has not been sufficient to drive them to make one.

[Gregg Feldstone]

Lie Nielsen's catalog lists a "Boggs Concave Spokeshave" , which is obviously intended for outside or "convex" curves, and a "curved sole" available on their regular shave. No picture is shown of the "curved sole", but I assume it has a convex curve, allowing it to handle concave surfaces. So, I think I just answered my own question, but I would appreciate someone who owns these shaves to verify. Thanks!!

[Danny Thompson]

I have the curved version only but wish I also had the flat bottomed one. In theory, you can use the curved one for both, but don't expect smooth, flat cuts without some real practice.

For those confused about the curved and concave shaves. Remember, Boggs is a chairmaker.

The concave shave has a curved (concave) blade meant for shaving spindles--i.e., surfaces that are convex across the width of the blade.

The curved shave has a straight blade with a convex base and is meant for shaving inside curves--i.e., surfaces that are flat across the width of the blade but concave in the direction of the pull stroke. In a pinch, the curved shave can be used to shave flat surfaces and outside curves (surfaces that are flat along their width but convex in the direction of the pull), but you have to be really good to make this work well.

The flat shave has a flat blade and a flat base--ideal for flat surfaces and easier to control on outside curves than the curved shave.