What Do You Consider a Full Set of Hand Planes?

[Jeff Wright]

I friend and I were discussing what a full set of Lie Nielsen hand planes would consist of . . . not a set that had every item of their product line, but rather a set that an avid woodworker - not cash constrained - would feel was complete. We assumed the woodworker would focus on furniture and cabinet making.

What is your list? Please be as specific as you can (LN model numbers if able).

[Sean Hughto]

It's really not a question that can be answered without more details. It's like asking what a full set of chisels is. While 3 chisels might handle 90% of tasks, it might take 10 other chisels to handle that last 10% of tasks as efficiently as possible (paring, crank-neck, fishtail, dovetail, mortise, etc). The same is true with planes, a 7, a 4, and a block would do plenty, but they'd be hard pressed to cut tongue and grooves like the 48. The only planes that could be eliminated would be those that are more or less substitues for one another separated only by preference of the woodworker using them (like a 7 & an 8, for example).

[Jeff Wright]

Thanks Sean.

At some point, I would think a final list of planes must be made, unless, of course, your hand plane addiction compelled you to buy the next new iteration! :D

Let me re-phrase the question . . . if you were to design and build the ultimate cabinet to house your planes, requiring you to establish the cabinet's dimensions before possessing all your planes, what planes would be on that list.

[Larry Williams]

Richard Neve, in his 1736 Builders Dictionary, gave a very good summary of a "if you can dream it, you can build it", complete set of planes. Sorry but no metal plane maker, including Stanley, ever offered a fully capable set. In fact, I don't believe any plane makers after the first quarter of 19th Century were offering planes of equal quality and capability to those Neve was familiar with and wrote about.

At any rate Neve's list is complete, relatively simple and not all that over whelming:

http://www.planemaker.com/photos/neve3.jpg

[Jim Koepke]

This is a very complex and difficult question which tries to infuse generalities into specific and what should be carefully considered options.

Furniture and cabinet making may seem to narrow the field yet there are many aspects within the field that require different approaches. Does one want to include marquetry and inlay into their work?
Is one making Shaker style furniture, arts & craft style or adirondack chairs?
Is the woodworker more inclined towards Maloof style rocking chairs or even something more avant-garde?

It is considerations such as these that have guided me toward my reasoning that instead of spending time to carefully consider these fine points, it is easier to spend my money in a quest to have at least one of everything.

:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D:D

jim

--guess who was up late last night.

[Gary Benson]

Jeff,
I have pondered the same question once in a while, and I think it can be answered for you at any one moment in time. But....It would be different for each of us, and change as time goes by.
Here is my version of a complete set.
-Scrub
-4 1/2 Smoother, likely compromise with a 50 degree frog
-(Might consider 5 1/2 as my traveling single flattening and smoothing plane)
-Low angle jack for shooting
-7 jointer
-Large and small router plane (love both)
-Small shoulder plane
-Low angle block plane
-Skew block with fence

While I would like a plow plane, LN has yet to make one, so that'll have to wait for tool cabinet 3.0. I have a 604 that I like, but rarely grab it over the LN 4 1/2 and would not consider it necessary. I also have a well tuned 605, but I never seem to use it. It is amazing what gets done just with a scrub, the 7 and the 4 1/2. I like the concept of having all of the bevel down planes use the same width blade and frog so they can be interchanged if needed, hence the preference for the 4 1/2, contemplation over the 5 1/2, and the 7.

Just my version of a set.... for now,

Gary

[Jeff Wright]

Now we're talking!!

Thank you all for venturing your opinions and viewpoints. Some real great ideas and resources. Keep the suggestions coming - please!

[Richard Dooling]

I would add a scraper plane to the list. I have the LV large scraper and it has proved very useful.

.

[Greg Crawford]

Jeff,

This is a picture if what I built to store what I considered the necessary planes. The empty long slot has since been filled with a Veritas BU jointer. I think the only one I have that's not shown is a Veritas Medium Shoulder Plane.

This covers prepping raw lumber, smoothing, rabbeting, shooting, grooving, edge trimming and lots of various other tasks. I hate sanding, so I try to have a plane or scraper for every occasion:)

I know LN is what you mentioned, but don't rule out Veritas planes. Some specialty planes are made only by Veritas or only by LN. I have several of both, plus old Stanleys. My 2 favorites or my LN 5 1/2 and my Veritas LA Jack. For me, the Veritas bench planes fit my hands better than a Stanley or LN. For big jobs, I try to go to a Veritas. With the others, I tend to get cramps in my hands and I'm more prone to getting blisters.

Have fun!

Greg

[george wilson]

When you can't get any more onto the shelf!!

[Narayan Nayar]

I'll bite, though it sounds like the premise is more about tool acquisition than it is about functional comprehensiveness. Not that there's anything wrong with tool acquisition, but to have tools in anticipation of potential need is a very different motivation than to have tools to meet actual needs. You state that the goal is "furniture and cabinet making" but that's a very big scope with lots of varieties.

As others have mentioned, one style might dictate a completely different set of tools than another. Someone who works with just cherry might want a fairly simple set whereas someone who works in a variety of figured woods might want multiples of certain planes such as smoothers. And people with larger builds might want heavier planes than others.

Assuming this list would just be planes, I'd consider a "complete" set anything that would allow me to take a board (and later, a variety of assembled pieces) from rough stock to finished surface and execute or finish a good sampling of common joinery. I would also say that my collection is, at this point, well beyond complete. I don't say this to brag; I mean to say that what I have definitely already covers just about every situation I encounter. I should also note that this fact doesn't prevent me from acquiring more planes :)

Anything I add to my collection at this point allows me to either do something I already do more easily, handle a greater variety of situations (particularly smoothing planes, of which I have six), have multiple "setups" for convenience, or branch into doing something new. So if I were building a cabinet for my planes, it would contain the planes I list below, which are planes I reach for in a majority of projects, and all other planes (not listed below) would go somewhere else.

And as fine as LN's offering are (indeed, they are well represented in my tool drawers), I think that if "making furniture" is the goal, limiting oneself to one manufacturer borders on absurd.


Scrub plane
Jack and/or fore plane
Jointer plane
smoothing plane
block plane(s)
rabbet plane
plow plane
shoulder plane
router plane
decorative plane(s) --molding planes, for example


I have several scraper planes but by no means would consider them essential to a complete collection. I think most people would be better served by just having a variety of scrapers.

[Jeff Wright]

I'll bite, though it sounds like the premise is more about tool acquisition than it is about functional comprehensiveness. Not that there's anything wrong with tool acquisition, but to have tools in anticipation of potential need is a very different motivation than to have tools to meet actual needs. You state that the goal is "furniture and cabinet making" but that's a very big scope with lots of varieties.

As others have mentioned, one style might dictate a completely different set of tools than another. Someone who works with just cherry might want a fairly simple set whereas someone who works in a variety of figured woods might want multiples of certain planes such as smoothers. And people with larger builds might want heavier planes than others.

Assuming this list would just be planes, I'd consider a "complete" set anything that would allow me to take a board (and later, a variety of assembled pieces) from rough stock to finished surface and execute or finish a good sampling of common joinery. I would also say that my collection is, at this point, well beyond complete. I don't say this to brag; I mean to say that what I have definitely already covers just about every situation I encounter. Anything I add to my collection at this point allows me to either do something I already do more easily, handle a greater variety of situations (particularly smoothing planes, of which I have six), have multiple "setups" for convenience, or branch into doing something new. So if I were building a cabinet for my planes, it would contain the planes I list below, which are planes I reach for in a majority of projects, and all other planes (not listed below) would go somewhere else.

And as fine as LN's offering are (indeed, they are well represented in my tool drawers), I think that if "making furniture" is the goal, limiting oneself to one manufacturer borders on absurd.


Scrub plane
Jack and/or fore plane
Jointer plane
smoothing plane
block plane
rabbet plane
plow plane
block plane
shoulder plane
router plane
decorative plane(s) --molding planes, for example


I have several scraper planes but by no means would consider them essential to a complete collection. I think most people would be better served by just having a variety of scrapers.

Narayan . . . did you just call me absurd? :p

You listed block plane twice; what am I missing? Two different block planes or did you intend to include a different one? Thanks!

The replies I am getting to my original post are revealing how much I still must learn about working with hand tools versus my garage full of power tools. It is much appreciated. There are a good number of nuances being discussed which will likely shorten my learning curve.

[Narayan Nayar]

No, not you. :) But with all the great choices out there at a variety of price points (including used), the restriction of plane selection to one manufacturer, or even "brand new" is definitely absurd.

Block plane twice--will fix that. Though I have....um...quite a few block planes.

I haven't followed your journey into the land of neander, but if I had one piece of more useful advice than a list of planes, it would be don't take the hand tool/power tool dichotomy as a dichotomy at all. I say this because you (and many others) use the term "versus" whereas I think the right approach is to use the term "with" or the phrase "in addition to".

And though planes are extremely sexy from a tool acquisition standpoint, I'd say that in furniture making, a good set of saws and chisels (and the techniques to use them) would probably be more useful in more situations than a set of planes, however complete. But again, depends on the furniture.

A cabinet filled with handplanes is impressive. Being able to saw to a line and not have to build a jig to prevent your fingers from being removed is priceless.

[Sean Hughto]

If you have a finite set of tasks to perform with the planes, then yes, a "final list" can indeed be made. If you don't know what else you might make, you don't know what other planes you might come to need.


Think of windsor chairmaking. The "kit" of tools needed is finite. You need a froe, lathe, adze, travisher, brace, etc. Now if you expand that to "chairmaking," the list becomes essentially infinite as chairmaking methods are limited only by ones imagination. The same is true of planes. There may be kits that suit a given set of tasks, but not every task.

Here's my "set," but it ain't complete:

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3469/3354647916_7d5c6e017a_b.jpg

[Jacob Mac]

I am new to wwing, and really new to hand planes, so my advice is worth very little, but here goes anyways.

If you are looking to get planes, try LV and other high quality planes (old Stanleys fit in here too). I like some LN planes, but they do not fit my hand nearly as well as LV planes. They are both great, so ergonomics made my decision. I think some times ergonomics are overlooked as a really important criteria. In other words, just because a plane is well made does not mean you will find it comfortable (same goes for chisels).

Also, with block planes, I like having both a low angle block plane and a standard block plane. The low angle excels with end grain, but I use my standard block plane for just about everything else.

[Pam Niedermayer]

A full set of planes is comprised of all the planes I need today plus any additional ones I'll need for tomorrow. :)

Pam

[mike holden]

Jeff,
a basic set would be a block plane, a jointer, a jack, and a smoother. To that I would then add a rebate and a router. Finally, a plough plane.
Anything beyond that is a specialty plane and would be added as needed.

Mike

[Ben Davis]

Jeff,

I'll venture an opinion that I, oddly, haven't seen yet. The more "specialty" planes one needs depends on much you like your router! Do you want to make edge details/profiles? Now we're talking 1 router bit vs. (potentially) multiple planes.

I agree with the above statement that the first 90% can be tackled by 3-5 planes, but that last 10% is a real bear and it depends on how much time you want to wear ear pro!

That first 90% IMO is covered by:
low angle block
smoother
jack/scrub plane (No. 5 basically)
jointer
shoulder plane

[Rob Young]

Block plane twice--will fix that. Though I have....um...quite a few block planes.



Obviously one for each hand... :)

[Roy Wall]

Jeff -

My list of LN planes would be:

#7
#5 1/2
#4 1/2
#62
Low angle block plane
Rabbet block plane or medium shoulder plane
#140 skew (RH)
#66 beading
Large router plane
#85 cabinet scraper

and I have the right to come back and edit......adding more....:)

[Sean Hughto]

Okay, here's how I've chosen to reimagine your question:

If you had to do it all over again - Planes edition

Imagine catastrophe - your workshop is swept away by a miniature black hole accidently created by a super collider. You get the insurance check, and need to reconstitute your shop. Let’s start with planes. What will you buy - in what order - and for what tasks?

1. Stanley 5 (pre-1935) and LN Stanley replacement blade (an excellent all around utility infielder; it can do it all while I wait for others to arrive).

2. LN 7 (truing faces and edge jointing)

3. LN 4 HAF (smoothing most anything)

4. LN 62 (regular and toothed blade) - shooting and smoothing/flattening curly woods

5. LN Rabbet block - (about the only block one needs)

6. Stanley 248 or Record equivalent plough - (I need grooves for panels etc.)

7. LV large router - inlays, butterflies, sizing tenons, rabbets and grooves

8. LV small router - great for hinges and small inlay

9. Stanley 78 or Record 278 - rabbets for laps and letting in backs etc.

10. LN 40 scrub - (I prefer a scrub for prepping faces of rough stock and thicknessing)

11. Alternative smoothers starting with a 3 (Stanley with a replacement blade is fine) for smaller jobs

12. Then a LN 4 ½ for bigger smoothing jobs like table tops or carcase sides

13. Then on to specialty planes like the LV or LN edge plane (great for quickly getting edges exactly square to a face

14. Then the LN 66 - love me some beading

15. Then the side rabbets (makes fine adjustments of grooves and dados a pleasure)

16. Next would have to be shoulder planes, starting with the LN 073 (the large) as I find this one most used even for jobs on smaller work - though I have never used mine to adjust shoulders (that’s not my method of work)

17. LN’s miter would be next - while not completely necessary, it sure makes shooting a pleasure

18. Next would probably be a scraper - LV’s large is my most used in plane form; in practice, I tend to use handheld cards all the time, and the 80 or large plane versions much less frequently

19. LN 48 - I like to use tongue and groove for backs and various other stuff, and this baby is smooth!

20. compass plane - I’d track down a good Stanley 113 as I have come to love mine for quickly cleaning up and refining sawn curves.

I could build a lot of cabinets with that set. Some molding planes would be next so that I could create edge profiles other ways besides the 66.

[Duane Mohney]

A full set of planes is comprised of all the planes I need today plus any additional ones I'll need for tomorrow. :)

Pam

Sounds like a plan to me.

-Duane

[David Keller NC]

Jeff - As you may have surmised by the replies, you have to consider another question first before you can even start a list: What do you want to do?, and "How far do you want to take the hand tool thing?"

You can break planes down by function:

Bench planes - used to joint and true stock before joinery, and to prepare a surface for a finish. These would include a fore plane (a #6), a jointer (a #7 or #8), and a smoother (a #4, #3, or a #4-1/2). One might want to add a "panel plane" to the list - a #5, #5-1/4, or a #5-1/2, depending on the size of the things you want to build.

Joinery Planes - These are the planes necessary to make joints. A basic kit includes a plow, a moving fillister, a few rabbet planes, and a panel raising plane. You could further expand the list with a set of dado planes, a router plane, and a match plane set (tongue and grooves)

Specialty finish planes - used to prep a difficult surface for a finish. This would include toothing planes, scraping planes, and spokeshaves.

Molding Planes - Used to make - you guessed it - moldings. These can be either generalist planes that one can use a set of to make any molding (a set of hollows and rounds, snipes bills, side snipes, and side rounds), or molding-specific planes, like ogees, ovolos, and coves.

I think you'll recognize that that last category makes it impossible to have a "complete" set of planes, though you could pick from the basic kit above and be ready to tackle most any furniture problem.

[Mark Maleski]

I find it curious that so few have emphasized a shooting board plane. Mine is indespensible - though perhaps that's an indictment of my handsawing skills. I've dedicated a BU jack for this purpose.

Also, I liked Larry Williams' answer, which focused on the use/purpose rather than the specific manufacturer/tool.

[jamie shard]

I like this, it's like buying without buying... so I'm in. And I'm going to make up for experience with enthusiam :D

If you had to do it all over again - Planes edition

I'd buy the first few as a set.

1. LV Low Angle Block
2. LV Low Angle Jack - for shooting
3. #8 Jointer - LN would be a dream, mine's a Stanley
4. #6 Fore - No need for anything fancy, so a Stanley
5. LV Scrub - it's a little bigger/more massive. I'm trying to "reclaim" a lot of old junky surfaced wood.
6. I think I'd go for a nice #4 smoother from LN, I have a LV BU smoother. But ultimately, I don't have enough experience with tricky wood and it would be easy to change the bevel on the LV BU -- that is my thinking.

Next are the ones that help do stuff that can technically be done with a saw and a chisel, but are much more fun with a plane.

7. Router Plane - LN looks pretty nice, but I went with LV for value.
8. Skew Plane - I went with LV with the long rods because I wanted to a a decent sized fence.
9. Shoulder Plane - In retrospect, I'd get the larger LV version. I have the medium LV. I'm realizing I really don't need this for shoulders... more for cleaning out large rebates and using it for making long tenons that are hard to saw, like table breadboard tenons.

Next are the general lust items and things I hope to grow into:
10. Plow plane - I'm in the market right now for something that will do drawer bottom grooves.
11. Side rabbit planes. LN are prettier and have long blades. LV is affordable right now. Ah, decisions..
12. LN 51/2 - as a cambered super smoother, in the David Charlesworth fasion, which I have yet to try out.
13. A set of moulding planes - old woodies found for nothing at a garage sale -- dare to dream!
14. LN 10 1/2 rabbit plane and LN miter plane - just for the heck of it.

Well that was fun!