grinding wheel balancer

[Casey Carr]

Got a few questions here...

I have a Ryobi grinder that I picked up from HD a few years ago. I've been getting some hand tools that I would like to use the grinder on to put a hollow grind on them. I've got a Veritas grinding jig along with a Norton cool grinding wheel to put on the grinder. Would like to use this, but I can't even use the grinding jig because the grinder vibrates so badly upon startup. It does seem to quiet down at full speed, but it will beat the crap out of my grinding jig if I start the grinder with the jig hugging the wheel.

So I figured I'd get a grinding wheel balancer. What I found was the Oneway system. I thought the balancer was something completely different. I had envisioned a disc you mounted on the outside of the grinding wheel with some ball bearings that float freely in a track to help balance it. From what I can gather with the Oneway system, you actually balance the grinding wheel itself. Basically what you're doing is making sure the OD of the wheel is concentric with the shaft diameter?

So I guess what I'm trying to figure out is if the Oneway system is what I need and if it will work with what I have. I only have the one Norton wheel and left the OEM wheel on the other side. I'm assuming I'd need to balance both wheels, so will the Oneway be capable of balancing both types of grinding wheels? Otherwise I'm going to have to go with a different system. Thanks for any help.

[Dan Lee]

I was going to explain it but heres a linik to the instruction manual.
It works really well makes my grinder run very smooth. I did have to buy new wheels with 1" bores

http://www.oneway.ca/pdf/balance_kit.pdf (http://www.oneway.ca/pdf/balance_kit.pdf)

[Michael Faurot]

I bought the Oneway balancing system for a Delta 8" variable speed grinder. It does seem to work pretty well, but there is a quirk you need to be aware of.

You buy the Oneway based upon the diameter of the shaft on your grinder. However the diamater for the grinding wheel now needs to be larger for the Oneway insert to fit in it.

For my Delta, it has a 5/8" shaft. The wheels that come with the grinder are 5/8", so I could no longer use them, once I got the Oneway.

[dan sherman]

is the grinder it's self out of balance, or just the current wheels?

[harry strasil]

If you are going to be changing wheels frequently, what you need is an old blacksmith trick.

1. using a felt tip or grease pencil, put a line from the center out on the paper center on the wheel.

2. mount the wheel on the grinder with the mark straight up and put the flange and nut on and tighten it up.

3. start the grinder and use a wheel dresser to make the wheel round and therefore balanced.

do this with all the wheels you are going to use. and always put the mark up when changing wheels.

[Jim McFarland]

A small add-on to Harry's suggestion is....if your wheels are out of balance now....(1) loosen (2) rotate the wheel 20 or so degrees, keeping the flanges in the same position (3) re-tighten and try your grinder again. Continue until (maybe) your grinder runs smoothly. Essentially matching imperfections in the flanges with imperfections in the wheel (I told this to another guy and he boiled it down to that!).

I used this technique replacing wheel on my Woodcraft grinder with a Norton wheel and process worked like a champ -- grinder was moving all about the bench when I started!

[Chris Friesen]

What some people are missing is that the wheel is not necessarily perfectly uniform in density, so it could be perfectly round and perfectly concentric to the axle and still be out of balance.

On my grinder this doesn't seem to be enough of a problem to cause me to buy the Oneway balancer thing.

[glenn bradley]

As Chris states, my wheels are dressed and cleanly circular but, out of balance. If I start to use the grinder for other than just rough stuff, I would consider the OneWay but cha-ching!

[Casey Carr]

I don't know what is out of balance. I have it mounted to a 1" thick table, probably 2 feet deep and 4' long. Left to it's own devices, it will walk that table all over the floor on start-up and shut down. I'm hoping the wheels are what are out of balance and not the grinder itself, but it wouldn't surprise me if the grinder itself was out of whack.

I don't plan on swapping wheels out often. In fact, I'd prefer to not swap at all until I need to replace the wheel itself. I'll watch the video and see if I can't get a better understanding of what the wheel balancer does.

[dan sherman]

I don't know what is out of balance. I have it mounted to a 1" thick table, probably 2 feet deep and 4' long. Left to it's own devices, it will walk that table all over the floor on start-up and shut down. I'm hoping the wheels are what are out of balance and not the grinder itself, but it wouldn't surprise me if the grinder itself was out of whack.

This is pretty easy to check, take both the wheels off and then run the grinder. If the grinder is good (I'm betting it is) it will be nice and quiet with no vibrations.

Another potential issue is arbor slop( the through hole in the wheel being much bigger than the arbor). Depending on the slop this can be fixed with anything from a few turns of paper to a custom bushing.

The next possible issue is that the wheel is out of round or unevenly loaded with grinding swaf, this can easily be fixed with a $3 silicon carbide dressing stick.

[Casey Carr]

Well, I doubt it's loaded with grinding swarf as I've only used the one grinding wheel a time or two and the norton wheel is untouched. I'll take both wheels off and see what happens. May motivate myself to get out there some time this weekend. It's been a wee bit hot here at over 110 degrees, and my garage is even hotter.

Wouldn't surprise me if I had some arbor slop, but I doubt it's more than .020 or so. I'll check that also.

[dan sherman]

Wouldn't surprise me if I had some arbor slop, but I doubt it's more than .020 or so. I'll check that also.

If it's off that much, it could definitely make your bench walk across the shop.

[Casey Carr]

So, will this Oneway system even work on my grinder? Sounds like I'll need to buy at least one more grinding wheel to account for the Oneway insert? It sounds like this is what the jig is designed for anyways.

May try Jim's suggestion and see if I can't get the balance worked out by trial and error, but I don't know how easy that's going to be. To narrow my variables, can I remove one wheel so I can balance each one individually? This is the only way I can see of getting this method to work, but I don't know about the safety issues with only one wheel attached.

[Jim McFarland]

So, will this Oneway system even work on my grinder? Sounds like I'll need to buy at least one more grinding wheel to account for the Oneway insert? It sounds like this is what the jig is designed for anyways.

May try Jim's suggestion and see if I can't get the balance worked out by trial and error, but I don't know how easy that's going to be. To narrow my variables, can I remove one wheel so I can balance each one individually? This is the only way I can see of getting this method to work, but I don't know about the safety issues with only one wheel attached.

The Oneway system requires the grinder wheel have a 1" arbor hole. Given this, you also then need to order the Oneway system which fits your arbor shaft (you get a replacement flange with the Oneway system).

Good point on the variable of 2 wheels -- in my case I had a smooth grinder, replaced a wheel and then had a walking grinder. Obvious even to me where the problem was so the incremental wheel rotation happened to be an easy fix.

[Jim Becker]

I use and love the OneWay balancing system...for my HSS and PM turning tools. But I never put my Neander hand tools to a grinder unless it's to repair some severe damage. Grinders generate way too much heat and it's so easy and quick to ruin a tool. Chisels and plane irons get worked on water stones in my shop. No heat damage potential that way and a very keen edge with my 8000 finishing stone.

[Casey Carr]

Okay, I got out tonight while it was a little cooler today and did some work on the old grinder. Took both wheels off and turned it on. Spun pretty cleanly as far as I could tell. No vibration or anything. So I checked the shaft diameter and the ID of the grinding wheel. The ID of the grinding wheel was about .006" larger than the shaft. Took a piece of paper and slipped it around the shaft, put the wheel back on and turned it on. Major difference. Still a little vibration, but it only moves some screws around on the table instead of everything else. Even had a little cardboard box on the table and it didn't move.

So then I put my Norton Coolwheel on and it started jumping all over again. Powered down and watched the wheel. There was a lot of sideplay on the wheel itself. Nothing installed wrong, the wheel is just not flat. Put a straight edge on portions of it and it didn't seem all that bad, but I couldn't put it straight across the middle due to the little paper they put on each side. Tried the paper on the shaft trick again and that didn't help either. I'm not too impressed with the plastic inserts they give you to compensate for the size of your drive shaft.

I didn't try rotating the wheel by any increments and I guess I still need to try that. But will the Oneway system fix this problem, or are there bigger problems with my wheel not turning flat? The other side has a little side to side play, but nowhere near what the Norton stone has. Guess I could try the Norton wheel on that side, see if it's my shaft or the wheel. Thanks for any help with this!

[Jim McFarland]

<snip> There was a lot of sideplay on the wheel itself. <snip>

Casey, this describes the problem I had which the incremental rotation improved significantly (from the grinder walking off the bench to usable but still a hint of vibration). That said, my grinder ran smoother with the original wheels so I ordered a Oneway balancer. It should arrive tomorrow so I'll know for sure in the next couple of days! Mine is a WC slow speed grinder and not a Baldor so it could be that operating with a "hint of vibration" is as good as it gets.

[Casey Carr]

Thanks Jim. Let me know how it works out for you. I've got a few more RPM's than your slow speed grinder, so any vibrations are magnified on mine. I think it's 3600 RPM's, the max that the Cool wheel says it can operate on. I'll try rotating the disc around and see if I can't get it dampened out a bit.

[Jim McFarland]

Casey, I installed the Oneway balance flanges on my grinder wheels today and I'm very pleased with results! The running grinder now passes a "nickel" test! Kit includes balance flanges and inside washers for 2 wheels (these replace the 2 interior/exterior stamped flanges and arbor bushings on the Woodcraft grinder), the balance stand and an adjusting tool. I spent 10 minutes incrementally adjusting the balancing screws&nuts but nothing complicated.

[harry strasil]

I hope you guys never have to change a big wheel, 2 inch by 14 diameter, LOL. of the hundreds of wheels I have changed, you might find 1 in 40 or 50 that will run true first time turned on.

[Jim McFarland]

I'm 0 for 2 on the 8", Harry so no intent to try bigger!

[Casey Carr]

Awesome Jim! That's what I was hoping to hear. Thanks a million for the update!

I have no need of anything bigger at home Harry. I have machinists at work that will do that kind of stuff for me. Course I have to pay them...or rather bring them a charging object. But not required out of me thankfully! Just not something that I've ever needed to know. I wish I knew how to dial in a mill like you guys, that one could have proved useful to me a time or two. Like when I was trying to mill a 1/16" set-up block. Not exactly square, lol! But I think I got it within .010". I'd have to check.