When building boat out of a text....+

[Mac McQuinn]

Thought I'd run this by you guys, I'm sure you've seen this before. You come across a boat design in a publication in which all needed details are shown to actually build the craft. They're really just small copies of the full plans. The article fully encourages you to build said boat from provided information. If you build the design according to the designer's specifications which are clearly shown & provided, Are you required to pay some type of Royalty to the author or since you've payed for the publication, is this the price paid for using the design?


On another note, I'm sure most of you have given some thought to the idea of building boats for a living. What's your take on actually jumping in with both feet and doing so even if it's only to supplement your present income, is it feasible?

Thanks for listening,

Mac

[John Bailey]

It's my understanding that when a book publishes the plans in enough detail to build, and encourages you to do so, you are not required to pay another fee. I believe in George Buehler's "Backyard Boatbuilding," he tells you that upfront, with the caveat that you would be better served if you did buy the plans.

At one point, after retirement, I was going to build boats. I didn't plan on making my living doing this, but, just a means of some added income. I built a shop, outfitted it with machines, put in a nice stereo and went to work. I loved the time I spent in the shop and I loved working on the boat. Unfortunately, I found I couldn't be in the shop all day with only myself. I missed the human interaction that was part of my career. So, after a couple of months, I found a job a liked and went back to work. It's just the way I'm built, I guess. Of course, I also found that I may not have the talent required to build boats for hire.

The only thing that I worried about while thinking I was going to be a boat builder was the liability. If a built a new boat, sold it as new, and something broke, would I be liable. That worried me.

If you have the patience and talent, it would be a great way of spending good time in the shop and making a bit of money.

Good luck if you try it.

John

[Nate Carey]

Good morning Mac, I'd like to know what the design type is and who designed it; the question of fee could then be answered with some degree of authority.

I built my first boat 44 years ago and have built several since. Within the last 15 years I have built and sold 12 of the same design. For this particular design, I've got the routine down (at this point in my part-time boat building venture) to where I actually make a little money on each boat sold.

If you want to build boats for the "fun" of it, supporting yourself financially in other ways, give it a whirl. Take your finest boat to as many boat shows as you can and see what the "boat buying public" thinks of your work.

As to John's liability question - Sam Devlin said to me many years ago "if I thought much about the liability and insurance issues, I would have gone into another type of work".

[Mac McQuinn]

John & Nate,
thanks for the comments.

John,

I fully understand the concerns about liabilities, it is a real world out there with potential for litigation at every step. I do feel some of the liability could spread a bit by building from a known designer's particular design. Royalties would be involved although for me this would be a good thing with the benefits included.

Nate,

There's several boat building publications out there which provide a reasonable amount of info to build from. The last book i purchased was by Dynamite Payson in which he goes over a Phil Bolger Design I was interested in. I like your idea on taking your best work to a show for a reaction of interest. Might be something for further thought.

Thanks,
Mac

[Nate Carey]

Harold Payson and Phil Bolger enjoyed a long and mutually beneficial relationship right up until Phil's death on May 24th.

The Gloucester Light Dory is a most successful and popular design because of the relationship these two men had. I have built two Gloucester Light Dories, one for myself and one for a customer, and paid the design fee for both. It's how designers make their living. Each time I built one of my rowing shells, I pay the design fee (the equivalent of 1.6% of the price I get for the boat).

If the design in question (the one you're thinking of building) is still offered for sale by the designer; after building the boat I would offer the design fee...unless it is specifically stated that the cost of the book or magazine, in which the design appears, is considered the design fee.

At the WoodenBoat Show in Mystic, CT just a month ago, Harry Bryan was selling plans for his Ladybug Wheelbarrow Boat. The complete (or nearly so) plans had appeared in both WoodenBoat Magazine and Boat Design Quarterly prior to the "show" in Mystic. From the plans that appeared in Boat Design Quarterly, I had already started the construction of my own Ladybug, so on seeing Harry at the "show" I was pleased to have the opportunity to pay for and receive (directly from the designer) an official set of plans.

[Frank Hagan]

I have a friend who is building boats in Maine, and he found there were quite a few requirements placed on him by the CG for powerboats. Sailboats don't have quite as many restrictions, so that's what he builds for clients.

Business has been extremely slow lately; I guess people stop buying things like custom built boats during recessions.

[Nate Carey]

Good morning Frank, I would use the term "safe guards". Naval architects and marine regulatory agencies understand the inherent dangers of being on the water (especially open water) in boats, and they take their responsibilities seriously. The casual boat buyer may have the disposable income to purchase a boat, but common sense is sometimes lacking.

Because I only build small boats (under 30 feet) powered by oar, sail, and electricity (occasionally 4 stroke outboard power), I am not overwhelmed by marine regulations. And fortunately for me, all my customers have been boat savvy.

[Mike OMelia]

As someone who does not build boats (I build guitars) I would like to add another dimension to this thought. I see the same kind of questions in lutherie. People want free plans to make things they want to sell for profit. If you stop and think about that for a moment, it sounds a little unfair, does it not? The plan maker (designer) is in it for a living also, presumably. IMHO, one short circuits one's own plans for profitability when one goes down this path.

But if you invest in another's work to further your own goals, you are encouraging the system as a whole. And you will feel better about what you are doing as well.

Just a thought.

Mike

[Nate Carey]

What you said is much more than "just a thought" Mike; it is tangible support and encouragement with a little self-preservation tossed in...

...thank you for the support and encouragement! ...wanna buy a boat? ;)

[Mike OMelia]

What you said is much more than "just a thought" Mike; it is tangible support and encouragement with a little self-preservation tossed in...

...thank you for the support and encouragement! ...wanna buy a boat? ;)

Nah, but I would love to buy an excellent set of plans for a wooden canoe. Not for me, but for a friend who REALLY wants to build one. BTW, do some suppliers provide "serviced" kits? In guitar building, one can buy kits at various levels of servicing. If one does not want to bend guitar sides or install rosettes, one can purchase that stuff already done. Does this exist in the boat building world?

Mike

[Nate Carey]

Yes it does Mike...check out these two suppliers...

www.clcboats.com (http://www.clcboats.com)

www.newfound.com (http://www.newfound.com)

...and for plans only Paul Fisher has some interesting designs @ www.selway-fisher.com (http://www.selway-fisher.com)

[Gary Kvasnicka]

Mike,
Here is another link for canoe plans and kits.
http://www.bearmountainboats.com/

and

http://www.noahsmarine.com/

Good Luck

[Mike OMelia]

Thanks so much guys!

Mike

[Lee Gallion]

Mike,I found several sites with free plans for canoe designs.One was found under the "wackless lassie",just do a search.It is a simple plywood model for kids that can be stretched for adults.If you do a google search you will find many different sites .

[Peter Benders]

hey guys thank you very much. finding about boat building publications is pretty difficult. thanks for the links and the information. looking forward for more