Finish questions for African Mahogany and Bubinga Table

[Ryan Sparreboom]

Hey folks.
I'm currently making a hall table (42"L x 34"H x 12 3/4"W) for a wedding gift.
The top of the table as well as the lower shelf are QS Bubinga. The aprons are QS African Mahogany, and the legs and top supports (it's a floating top) are flat sawn African Mahogany.

My goal is to show the color and figure of the Bubinga off without darkening it too much. I find BLO or Tung oil darken more than I want it to.
I also want to darken the african mahogany, while preserving the beautiful chatoyance in the QS wood.
I would like all parts to have a clear, hard, wear resitant finish.

To darken the African mahogany, I tried a sample with dark walnut Danish oil and really like the look. So I think I have that figured out.
I will likely top that with a seal coat or two of dewaxed shellac, to add some depth.
But what to use as a hard finish over that? What about keeping the bubinga from darkening too much yet provide some depth and hard finish?

I was considering using Don Kondra's recipe (Tung oil, Mineral Spirits, and Spar Urethane) but I'm afraid that will darken the bubinga too much. What about Water based Poly? Spray cans of Laquer? I do not have access to spray equipmant.

I always do practice tests of finish but will have very little of the QS bubinga to practice on so I need to try the best suggestions only.

Suggestions please?

Ryan

[Prashun Patel]

If it were me, I'd spray the whole thing with Zinnsser Sealcoat and then follow with a wb lacquer (sprayed).

Easy and will achieve what yr looking for.

I personally find shellac to give adequate grain pop. I have also experienced BLO to muddy the grain of at least walnut, so I use it sparingly.

If you don't want to use danish oil, you can also use medium brown aniline dye (Transtint). Worked for me.

[Scott Holmes]

Ryan,

"...considering using Don Kondra's recipe (Tung oil, Mineral Spirits, and Spar Urethane)"

IS a VERY VERY soft finish that will not build.

That is actually not a good recipe for "danish oil" the spar is already soft and most are made with BLO, so it will darken quite a bit. Most danish oils are 1/3 oil 1/3varnish & 1/3 MS.. So you can see where adding a soft varnish will make the mix VERY soft.

To preserve the color use an alkyd resin/soya oil varnish. e.g. Pratt & Lambert #38

For the darkening or the AM try a garnet shellac skip the Watco it has pigment stain that will hide the grain.

[Don Kondra]

Greetings,

A correction, my finish recipe is pure tung oil, paint thinner and spar varnish.

Of course it "builds" and it does provide good wear resistance and ease of repair, enhances the grain/color of the wood and has a nice semi gloss sheen.

I recently heard from a client I made a table for out of ash. This couple has two small children and they eat all their meals on my table.

After six years they felt they would like to renew the finish. A quick wash to remove the dried milk drips, etc. a light sand with a foam sanding pad and two more coats rubbed on and off and it's brand new. No stripping and done in situ by the client.

Cheers, Don Kondra

[Charles Neil]

here is a link to a bubinga top a friend of my did , he used general finishes Arm r seal and its in a bathroom, it does a super job and is compatable with your danish oil under it, it will build well and give you the chatoyance you are seeking, the top has about 5 coats , light sanding inbetween...the final sandin before the last coat was done with 800 silicon carbide using some soapy water , then the final coat...hope this helps

http://www.freeforum101.com/charlesneil/viewtopic.php?t=998&highlight=bubinga&mforum=charlesneil

[Cliff Rohrabacher]

I would like all parts to have a clear, hard, wear resitant finish

I'd say that your requirements eliminate all the finishes except alkyd poly maybe over a de-waxed Shellac or maybe some of the higher priced water based finishes which would not be found in the BORG.

[Ryan Sparreboom]

here is a link to a bubinga top a friend of my did , he used general finishes Arm r seal and its in a bathroom, it does a super job and is compatable with your danish oil under it, it will build well and give you the chatoyance you are seeking, the top has about 5 coats , light sanding inbetween...the final sandin before the last coat was done with 800 silicon carbide using some soapy water , then the final coat...hope this helps

http://www.freeforum101.com/charlesneil/viewtopic.php?t=998&highlight=bubinga&mforum=charlesneil

Charles, thank you. That is exactly how I want it to look. I'll look for that finish here in Canada. Is it WB?

Ryan

EDIT: I found a supplier in Calgary (about 3 hrs south of me) I happen to be going there this week so will pick up a can or two.

Ryan

[Scott Holmes]

Since there is disagreement on whether or not this finish will build... let me re-state my position.

AN oil/varnish blend will produce a soft finish when compared to a varnish finish.

Do a little test on your own; then you decide which finish is HARDER.

Put a few drops of varnish on a piece of glass or plexiglass along side a few drops of an oil/varnish blend. Let it dry for a week then test which is harder. The oil/varnish blend can be gouged and scraped with your fingernail. The varnish will be hard.

To give you even more evidence, test the spar varnish too. 3 samples total; the varnish will be the hardest the spar will be in the middle the oil varnish blen will be soft.

Don you should try the test too. Let us know your test results.

I have such a sample; that I showed in finishing class today. (No spar varnish on my sample).

[Scott Holmes]

Water and oil don't mix.

[Don Kondra]

Scott,

I'm not disputing which is the "hardest" finish.

My criteria for this combination of ingredients is as follows...

Enhance the grain of the wood.

Provide adequate protection from everyday use.

Quick dry time to minimize floating dust sticking between coats and ease of application, ie., no brush marks or drips.

Easy sanding between coats, the finish will not be fully cured for up to a week so a foam sanding pad is all that is necessary.

No wet sanding to level, no need to buff the final coat.

Easy repairs and refinishing without stripping.

The addition of the japan drier will assure each coat is dust free in under a half hour.

Would I use it in a bathroom? Probably not, a pure varnish, poly or urethane would be more appropriate.

On furniture in general, I personally do not care for the look of most film finishes.

This recipe has the look of a fine hand rubbed oil finish but with the additional protection of the varnish.

Please keep in mind, I didn't recommend this finish to Ryan, I was simply correcting his list of ingredients :cool:

Cheers, Don

[Ryan Sparreboom]

Thanks for the help guys. I'm pretty sure I have it figured out what I want to do, pending the results of test pieces of course.

On the African mahogany, where my goal is to first darken it, then protect it with clear hard finish:
- Sand to 320 grit.
-Dark Walnut danish oil ( darkens to the degree I want on test pieces, shows of the chatoyance of the wood really nice)
- 1 or 2 coats of Zinsser Seal coat (dewaxed shellac, to act as a barricade between the danish oil and top coat, plus add some depth) light sand with 400 between coats.
- General Finishes WB Poly (as seen here: http://www.generalfinishes.com/msds-data/GF-High-Performance_%20Data_Sheet-062805.pdf ) several coats to build up protective finish.

On the bubinga top and shelf, where my goal is a clear, non darkening, protective built up finish:

- Sand to 320.
- Several coats of the General finishes WB poly.
- Sand to 400 then 600 and buff as required.

How's this sound?

Ryan