Making a frame for an oil painting on canvas

[Matt Day]

I've made quite a few picture frames for standard size pictures and small artwork, but have not done any large frames yet.

I was asked yesterday if I could make some frames for some large oil paintings - I of course said yes :p. I'm not so much worried about the size (probablyt 4' x 3' or so), but more the thickness of the frame that the canvas is currently stretched over which is about 3/4 thick.

With this thickness existing framing for the canvas, I can simply make a rabbet in the new frame slightly larger than 3/4" to accept the existing frame, which would mean about a 1 1/4" total thickness frame - similar to the standard frames I make.

I usually put a spline at the miters to reinforce it, but with a bigger frame it would be hard and possibly dangerous to do so on the table saw like I usually do. I like the look of the spline using a contrasting wood - for instance my standard is a maple frame with walnut splines. Any suggestions? I thought of just using dowels or pocket holes for added strength, but I wouldn't have the spline look (no huge deal).

Am I approaching this right or am I totally off? Are there any special things I need to do to preserve or protect the oil painting? I would have to cover up a small part of the painting on the edges - I think that would be okay. Any tutorials by any chance?

Thanks

[Lee Schierer]

You shouldn't need dowels for the corners. You do need to use proper glue technique and joint construction. The 45 degree joint is essentially an end grain joint and as such will require more than the normal amount of glue as compared to a face grain joint. It is also essential that you have perfect corners with no gaps. Gaps in glue joints are low strength. To hang your art let the stretchers for the canvas support the painting and the frame. That way your glue joints basically are only holding the weight of the frame.

Another way to build the corners is to do a half lapped miter joint. A lot more work to make, but infinitely stronger. You'll break wood before breaking this joint. Half Lapped Miter (http://www.binkyswoodworking.com/MiteredHalfLap.html)

[george wilson]

Canvas frames have a special,rather complicated joint. You need to go and see a blank frame. You'd probably need to buy a small one to get the hang of the joint.

[Matt Day]

I understand a simple 45 degree joint with only glue is not strong - which is why I use a spline on my picture frames I've made in the past.

As I said in my first post, I think it will be cumbersome to try and use my spline joint jig on the table saw when I have a 4' x 3' frame in it. Therefore, I was thinking of using a doweled joint like the one in the attached picture. Or possibly just some simple pocket screws. The width is not set in stone, just something I put on there for scale, but is probably close.

If the whole thing will hang from the existing frame that the canvas is stretched over, shouldn't this simple dowel or pocket hole joint work? What am I missing?

[Matt Day]

attached picture...

[Lee Schierer]

If the whole thing will hang from the existing frame that the canvas is stretched over, shouldn't this simple dowel or pocket hole joint work? What am I missing?

What you'll miss is extra work. No dowels or bicuits should be needed on a well glued properly fitted miter joint.

[Matt Day]

Okay, I see what you're saying now. I'm perfectly fine just glueing the joints and am comfortable they'll fit tight with no gaps. I'll probably zip a couple pocket screw in the back to make sure, which won't take more than a couple minutes.

Other than that, there's not much too it then right?

Thanks Lee.

[Mort Stevens]

My wife being the painter in the family I have made 100's of stretched canvases. A couple of gotchas you have to look out for...

1) the entire wood face frame needs to be beveled back so that the canvas hits only on the outer edge and not the entire width of the wood frame.

2) anything over 3' needs a crossbrace at the halfway point, again this needs to be held back a good 1/4" so that the canvas doesn't touch it when stretched.

3) for frames up to about 3' I use 1"x2" wide stock, once a side length gets over about 4' I then use 1"x3" the largest frame I have made was 7' and for that I used 1-1/2"x4" stock.

4) don't use a softwood for the frame, once the canvas is stretched these frames are under a lot of tension and can bow or rack. I have switched to use mostly maple because it's hard and strong and resist bowing.

5) the corners will need diagonal bracing to keep from racking, this doesn't need to be anything fancy, 1/2" plywood applied to the back with staples and glue at all the corners and crossbraces will suffice. if you want the bracing in the same plane as the frame - I used to do this way but found the plywood to be a far better solution - remember to hold it back 1/4" from the face.

6) the last 75 or so frames I have made have been with simple butt joints and pocket screws - very strong.

7) when attaching the canvas the more staples the better, I usually do one row of staples then lap the canvas over and do a double row.

[Matt Day]

Mort & all, I should have been more clear. The painting is already done and the canvas is on the existing frame. I'm building the "pretty" frame for show on the outside.

[Barry Vabeach]

Matt, I think I understand your question - but the answer depends on the style you are going for. First, go to a store like Michaels or any other store that does framing and take a look at the different options for the frame ( In Michaels, they have small sample squares that you can look at without being bothered) Sometimes I have been asked to make very thin ( but deep ) frames - kind of a clean minimalist approach. For those, the lumber is placed on edge and you make a rabbit that is very deep and between 1/8 to 1/4 wide, from the back, and the painting fits in from the back and the frame rests against the wall totally concealing the edge of the painting. Yes the rabbitt does cover the front edges of the painting a bit - if you think ahead, you can hold a straightedge to see how straight the edges are ( usually there is bulging at the corners where the canvas is wrapped ) if it is truly straight you can get away with a 1/8 rabbitt, if it is pretty wavy, you might need more than 1/4. If you are going for the more typical wide frame with a detailed profile, sometimes the frame is 2 separate pieces, the inner one is usually pretty narrow ( 1/2 to 3/4 inch) and has a bevel and is wrapped in a white fabric, and then an outer frame - which is usually stained, painted, or gilded, goes over that. When I do frames for myself, usually I go with just one frame, and the rabbitt is sized wide enough so there won't be any gap visible from the front ( again 1/8 to 1/4) and is usually no more than a 1/2" deep. Assuming the frame is pretty wide ( usually 2 to 3 inches ) the frame does not rest against the wall, and does not fully conceal the edges of the painting, but you will never see that because it is so wide, that unless you stand right up to it and stick your head against the wall, you won't see that the painting is only slightly tucked into the rabbitt of the frame. Either way you do it, an 18 gauge nailer can be helpful, and some biscuits can help with the miters. If I am at all worried about the stability of the frame, I will glue some 2 inch by 2 inch by 1/8 hardboard on the back just inside the corners - placed along the miter, and that helps keep the frame together. If you really want to get inspired, go look at museums or art galleries to get some ideas of what you want the end result to look like. Barry