Cabinet doors warping before even finished!

[Art Bianconi]

The intention was to modernize the kitchen cabinets by replacing them with new ones covered in laminate.

I purchased two dozen European hinges and the requisite Forstner bit; measured everything carefully and laid out the entire design before so much as cutting the first panel.

I chose birch veneered 3/4" plywood as I wanted to have a nice, paint-able surface on the interior. The outer face and all exposed edges would be covered with Formica. The thickness was driven by the depth of the pockets needed to secure the hinges.

I hadn't even finished hanging the first three of ten panels panels when the doors demonstrated warping.

The top of a 36" tall door panel would touch the cabinet. The bottom would stick out a quarter inch or more.

The intention is to keep the gaps between doors to absolute minimums to give the result a clean, one piece look. That's hardly likely when the doors don't lay flush.

I've considered using MDF instead but aside from the fact that they weigh twice as much as plywood, I'm not comfortable with using the European hinges on MDF material. I don't trust it structurally.

Can some of you offer a solution to a frustrated amateur?

Thanks

Art

[Angie Orfanedes]

Many high end kitchens have painted cabinets that are made almost entirely of MDF. They usually make only the face frames out of birch (or other clear grained wood) and the shelves from plywood edged in a birch (or equiv). So, if you are painting the cabinets, MDF works well. I am surprised that your 3/4 ply warped, presuming it was cabinet grade.

p.s. - Are your sure the door is the problem? Could your cabinet faces be out of square?

[Rob Carlson]

wood needs to absorb and release moisture ( humidity changes) at the same rate to stay close to its origanal form . Laminate the back side of
tte door .Hope this helps . Good luck

[Russ Boyd]

I'm wondering if you put the laminate (formica) on only the face? This would be a VERY likely cause of warping. Also, you do know that your hinges are adjustable (probably) and you might be able to make them look good with the proper adjustment? You could also try a middle hinge and see if that helps. I echo the use of mdf for painted surfaces. It works very well, the cups will hold the hinges fine.

[frank shic]

on my last cabinet project, i built over 30 door and drawer fronts completely out of mdf including the rails and stiles. the blum inserta hinges which use pressure to hold them to the door have worked fine. mdf makes a huge mess btw :eek:

[Chip Lindley]

....I chose birch veneered 3/4" plywood as I wanted to have a nice, paint-able surface on the interior. The outer face and all exposed edges would be covered with Formica. The thickness was driven by the depth of the pockets needed to secure the hinges.
Art

Sorry Art, but your plywood was not the best choice. Ply is famous for NOT remaining nearly as flat as MDF or even lowly PB. Chances are all plywood doors will be warped to some degree, even IF you laminate both sides.

Just getting started in woodworking with only TS and router, I remodelled my kitchen wayyy back in '84. No such thing as MDF easily available back then! I used 5/8" particle board with vertical grade almond laminate on both sides! The rails/stiles of the doors were really banding of 1"x1" red oak with 1/2"R. rounded outer corners and edges, with a slight chamfer on the inside edge, proud of the laminate surface. The back laminate and frame are flush. The doors Survive today flat as ever, but a bit dated!

BTW, 3/4" stock is a bit thick to start, before laminating. I assure you 5/8" laminated on both sides will hold the Euro hinge screws. Just use the short ones!

[chris beserra]

If you have imported plywood, then this is expected. Did you buy it at Lowes or Home Depot or a similar store?

If the plywood is cabinet grade it shouldn't warp.

[Cliff Rohrabacher]

You can get warping from leaving your work out on the bench over night when the dew point cause moisture to settle on it.

Always cover your work with something - anything but cover it

The Ply from the Borg is also a serious problem. It is prone to warp and twist because of the horrible Chinese manufacturing process.

Never buy ply for interior finished cabinets from the Borg. Because it;s like a box of chocolates with none of the chocolate or sweetness. But, you still never know what you goanna get.

[Michael Schwartz]

when working with any laminations involving solid wood (plywood, veeers, etc...) the rule of thumb is to do to the opposite side exactly what you do with the face.

Wood Laminations are a delicate balance of tension in opposing directions and putting any additional force on one side will change the balance. Make sure if you veneer plywood to always continue the pattern by adding any veneers perpendicular to the grain of the face, of course treating the veneer you added as the new face if you added more.

You might still have issues with flatness if you laminated the opposing side of the plywood some one possibility you might want to try would be to rout dovetails across the panel and slide in solid hard wood battens to hold the panel flat

[Robert LaPorta]

Art,
Europeen hinges have depth adjustment with the plate mounting screw. If you got the hinges withe plate already mounted they might not be all centered - Have checked that?

[Art Bianconi]

I've attached some images that show that gawd-awful center cove, as useless and as ugly a design as I've ever seen.

With that ripped out and a new cabinet built within that same space, I started on the doors, using the models I developed in the CAD software (please disregard the color).

I bought the lumber from the Harbour Freight equivalent in home centers: Home Depot. It was the best they had and as is apparent, it was junk.

Thanks all for the generous support and coaching. I'll make the doors from 1/2 inch thick MDF. I've measured the depth of the hinges and while they are almost as thick as the 1/2 inch panels, I think I'll be OK with half inch MDF as they will be covered with laminate anyway. I'll do a test piece first.

The existing cabinet structure is built like a bank vault having been constructed in-place, one stick at a time by some artisan in the 20's. It's square, it's flat and it's plumb. The problem is entirely in the new doors. Ironically, the old half inch plywood doors lay flush and are as flat as a billiard table even under 90 years worth of paint. They'll be recycled for sure.

I learned a lot with the first effort and while the results are frustrating, I do have other use for those doors, junk wood though they are.

The project will not likely come alive again until after Thanksgiving. I've major landscaping and outdoor painting to do too. Or I may simply do one door at a time as surplus time surprises me.

I'll likely finish the cabinet doors when it's turning cold outside. I'll take pics when I do it and share them.

Thanks again, everyone!

Art