When All The Planets Are Lined Up Just Right...

[steve swantee]

There are probably lots of you cave dwellers out there that can get these results on a regular basis, but for me it does not happen as often as I would like. I consider my sharpening skills to be reasonably good, and I normally get a pretty decent shaving, but after last night's sharpening session I just had to get a picture of the results-it is the full width of the iron, except for maybe 1/8" on each side. The shaving is from a scrap of yellow birch. The plane is my type 4 Stanley Pre-lateral No.8(1874-1884).
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Steve...whose enthusiasm will likely be dashed at the next sharpening session.

[Gary Benson]

Nice job Steve. It is nice when the sharpness of the iron, the setting of the plane, and the wood/grain just work together. Enjoy it, it can be fleeting.
Gary

[Sam Takeuchi]

Very nice shaving indeed. Your plane is really nice, too. I'm not into pre-lateral planes, but that is one good looking plane.

Is that a full thickness LN blade? With it, cap iron looks like just a decoration :D

[Marc Casebolt]

I know exactly what you mean. I am still learning to get consistent results when sharpening, and there are times when it seems so easy and the next time it's a struggle. Practice is what I need, lots of it.

You can read a mountain of articles, books, blogs, etc, but in the end I think it's just doing it over and over to get your method perfected with the stones you have. I have a ways to go, but am seeing improvement as time goes by.

Don't try to rush it.

Marc

[steve swantee]

Thanks guys. Yes Sam, that is a full thickness LN iron (3/16"). If it were not for the need to retract/advance the iron, the cap iron would indeed be nothing more than a decoration. It is used mostly on hardwoods, and has a backbevel which gives me a high cutting angle of about 65* +/-. It has planed everything I've thrown at it without a trace of tearout, even against the grain...it can be a real workout though especially with the steep cutting angle.
Steve

[Jim Koepke]

Steve,

Nice work. Is that a #8?
I have a type 4 #6 and use it more than my #6 with the lateral adjuster. It seems to have a better balance with the handle being placed a little closer to the blade.

jim

[steve swantee]

Yes Jim, it's a No.8. I'm used to the prelaterals now, so I do not find the lack of a lateral adjuster to be an imposition at all.

[Phillip Pattee]

Steve,

That is pretty shaving. Good thing you got a photo of it or no one would believe you. You must have done a truly outstanding job of sharpening. Mostly when I see a shaving thin like that it is raggedy looking. Your shaving is very consistent. Nicely done!

[Johnny Kleso]

As my friend Bob Smalser would say:

A thin shaving like that is use less......

Bob dosen't believe in a cambered blade but if you did have a cambered blade as David Charlesworth uses you would not be able to make a full width thin shaving.....

I'd like to see a big pile of chips with a nicely milled board on top of them, milled in record time...

[steve swantee]

Hello Johnny. You won't see any boards planed from rough to ready in record time with such a shaving, but they are great for removing milling marks from lumber fresh out of the planer and also for flushing up joints in frame and panel assemblies, etc, etc... I like a cambered iron for hogging off lots of material in a hurry but for finish planing I prefer a flat edge with only the slightest curve at the corners to prevent plane tracks.

Steve

[Jim Koepke]

As my friend Bob Smalser would say:

A thin shaving like that is use less......

Bob dosen't believe in a cambered blade but if you did have a cambered blade as David Charlesworth uses you would not be able to make a full width thin shaving.....

I'd like to see a big pile of chips with a nicely milled board on top of them, milled in record time...

A very thin shaving is less likely to produce tear out.

Any one of my planes can be set for a "rank cut." If there is any grain shift, one will quickly learn why it is called a "rank cut."

When there is a bowed edge, deep cuts are useful. If one has wood that is fresh from a saw, then scrubbing and fat chips with a jointer are in order.

If one is smoothing a surface, one usually does not try to do it with 0.010 shavings.

Thin shavings will also give an insight into the blades condition. A thin shaving is not going to be made by a dull iron. Any nicks will become evident.

jim

[Johnny Kleso]

I think thin shavings is all show and no go, thats just my opinion......

If I get tear out I use a card scraper or sand paper...

I did believe at one time that a planes board looked better (had a sheen or glow about them) than a sanded did not but after finishing several projects and reading a several reports with FWW a few years ago being the main one, I tend to believe it makes no difference planed or sanded once the finish is on.......

[Archie England]

Oh, but, there's a huge difference...in the enjoyment of the process. Whereas I love whispy slivers of ever so thinly sliced shavings, I loathe the progressive swirls, dishes, dips, round-overs, and scratch marks of sanding. Hand planes RULE; sanders, DROOL!!!!

[David Keller NC]

"I did believe at one time that a planes board looked better (had a sheen or glow about them) than a sanded did not but after finishing several projects and reading a several reports with FWW a few years ago being the main one, I tend to believe it makes no difference planed or sanded once the finish is on......"

I read through that FWW article a few years back, but I don't agree with the conclusion (I rarely do with FWW tests - they're in general poorly designed). In particular, I disagree when a very thin finish is used, such as shellac or BLO and wax. If one's using a thick plastic coating like polyurethane, then yeah, I certainly can't tell the difference.

But there's another reason I try to leave the surface directly from the handplane - sanding or heavy scraping wipes out the evidence of a handplane's use by removing all traces of the subtle scallop texture on the show surface, and in my opinion that's a bad thing - perfectly uniform, flat surfaces should be left for factory-made stuff.

[jerry nazard]

I
But there's another reason I try to leave the surface directly from the handplane - sanding or heavy scraping wipes out the evidence of a handplane's use by removing all traces of the subtle scallop texture on the show surface, and in my opinion that's a bad thing - perfectly uniform, flat surfaces should be left for factory-made stuff.

Amen, David!!

[Johnny Kleso]

What size work do you guys use these whispy shaving on?

It would not be small boxes would it, Just Kidding :)

I been there and done that, when I moved on to truley using the planes to plane wood and got over its newness of my planes till it was just another tool in the box of many tools... Now I love my planes but its not a scraper or a sander... Its job is to true wood and the finish is just a extra that goes wth the straight surface IMHO

I too felt the same way with Steve's moment but was quicky brought back to real life by some old timers that told me thin shavings just bunch of modern hype..

[Phillip Pattee]

What size work do you guys use these whispy shaving on?


Christmas tree ornaments!;) You just gotta use your imagination.

Obviously you would just tire your arms out dimensioning lumber taking whispy shavings. He can, however, set that same plane to hog off chips. But on the other hand, it indicates a tool that is tuned to near perfection and capable of very fine work.

I like tools that are also works of art, so I don't think that function is all that matters. That an old stanley plane can perform so well (albeit with a LN blade) is just the cats pajamas. I just drool over a Brese plane. He's got those custom made lever cap screws in them that look really nice--and why when any old hardware store bolt would do the job?

[Johnny Kleso]

Phil,
One of these days I need to make myself a infill plane, I don't own even own a infill...

I am quite happy using old Stanleys so far and like you enjoy the art it took to make the parts and they way they look...

Yes being able to set a plane to make a thin shaving is a coming of age kind of moment.. In fact getting the blade flat across is 10x harder than sharpening it with a slight camber...

I just did not want Steve to think he is at the bottom of the slope, in fact I think he is closer to the top than the bottom :)

My last moment was when instead of pulling out my TS I grabbed a hatchet and split a piece of 4S Oak and planed the chunk I split off to size.. I thought to myself wow that took 5 mins and was how a real neanderthal would have done it :)
I am not a big hand tools guys I am a what ever is more easy these days so it was big for me not for most...

[Phillip Pattee]

Johnny,

I basically agree. The tool first of all has to perform its function and a plane's function is to leave prepared surface. The shaving is simply a by product. The condition of the waste says something about the quality and performance of the tool and the user though. Poor tools are frustrating and can discourage learning. A well-tuned tool is a beauty to behold. It's even better when you can see the craftsmanship that went into making it eye catching.

When I look at the work you do custom making parts and work like George Wilson produces, I realize that I am a novice. Some people look at a box I built, or my office built-in furniture and say, "wow, you did this" but compared to really skilled craftsmen its just ham and egg stuff. I have so much to learn.

I use your website as a resource to tune up my planes pretty often --I haven't gotten them to the condition that Steve has though.

[Jim Koepke]

Like Phillip, I am not a master at woodworking.
I do not regularly use power tools. Sanding is done by hand. Having the ability to put a nice surface on the wood with a plane will save time by not having to sand.

Often, the only finish on my book cases and such is stain. My wife and I both like the feel of untreated wood. Many pieces like a narrow trestle table for stuffed animals has remained unfinished because we have not decided what to do with it other than cover it with stuffed animals.

Like a sports car, a plane has a range of abilities. One is not required to use all of the abilities of either, but that is no reason to forgo the abilities when it is not creating a dangerous or unlawful situation.

Besides, if one is shooting a miter or some end grain, they are likely to be taking thin shavings, not making shims for the next door they have to frame.

jim

[Johnny Kleso]

Phil,
Most master dont consider them selfs masters just workers..

Most any one can master a few steps to make some really nice looking items..

You dont need My Skill to make nice stuff, the main thing is to work safe and take care of your eyes and fingers at all times.. Dont day dream, keep you mind fixed on the task at hand and dont let it wonder till you doing something that totaly safe..

Ohh and try to think the job through to the end before you begin.. Think how you will hold or cut the work before you have to do it..


Everyone have a happy 4th of July

[steve swantee]

Wow, lots of action here since I last looked. Been working 12 hr. backshifts all weekend, so not much time to spend perusing the 'net. I guess everyone works differently, nothing wrong with that-to each his own. Like Jim said, the more work I can do with planes the less sanding I have to do. My sinuses don't seem to be able to take the abuse from fine sanding dust that they used to, so finish planing gives me a welcome break from that- can't stand those dust masks.
I don't think that too many of us consider ourselves to be masters of our craft, that's why we are here on this forum, looking at others' works of art, asking questions, and offering advice where we can to others, and the occasional self-indulgent gloat of a new tool, a completed project, or a lightbulb moment. I know I am continually learning things about woodworking-and about tuning planes, for that matter-and this forum has been instrumental in that learning curve. I've also gotten a wealth of info from Johnny's site on handplanes.
In the end, I guess all I can say is to enjoy the process...whichever way you get there.

Steve