First Attempt at Box Making W/ Splines - Comments Welcome

[Todd Young]

OK, so I post these pics w/ some trepidation. After seeing some of the work that’s showcased on this site, I’m not sure I quite fit into that standard of quality at this point. I’m seriously impressed with the work I’ve seen from many SMC user’s and would appreciate your feedback, if you feel inclined to do so.

This is my very first attempt at box making w/ splines. Like many others, I made this from Mahogany and Ambrosia Maple scraps that I had lying around the shop :D. For some reason, I can’t bring myself to dispense of any wood product from my shop w/o internal strife :confused:. After reading about some of you creating boxes in an afternoon from scraps, I figured I’d give box making a try yesterday.

The dims are 7” x 4 ¼” x 6”. The piece here is probably not laid out the best proportionally, but once it’s completed, I’m sure it will serve some purpose. Hopefully more of a purpose than just me cutting my teeth and gaining some experience in box making techniques.

I followed some guidelines from Doug Stowe (in FWW Mag) and also gained some influence from some box work I’ve seen posted here at SMC.

A few things I’d like to ask about technique:

1) What would be the best method to use to cut splines? I don’t have a bandsaw or scroll saw, which I assume would be the best way. Cutting a 1” size triangle spline from 1/8” stock on a 45* TS sled was (let’s say) “interesting”.
2) Do the woods of choice go well together? I know this can be considered “arbitrary”, but wanted to get some opinions.
3) What would be the best finishing to use for this?

It’s still left TBD on the outcome of the piece pending finishing – could be either -- a) no way I’ll post how badly I jacked this up with finishing – or -- b)Hey, I got lucky and it looks somewhat like a finished box. If there’s a ladder scale to reference finishing knowledge, I’d land a rung or two below novice/beginner. I have no idea what to use for finishing or the best way to apply nor much about the differences between them.

For those that make these types of boxes, Doug Stowe recommends using a rip blade to get a flat kerf when cutting spline slots. I used a Tenyru GM25540 ATB blade which created a V slot for the the splines. Looking close enough at the piece, you can see a few slots where I was not able to get the spline to sit flush due to this fact. I also tried on a few slots to use a piece of 220 sandpaper wrapped around a very thin popsicle stick to try and flatten the slot out at the edges. Mistake :(. I ended up widening a few of the slots by doing that so I know not to try that again. I assume an ATBR or ATBFR blade would have cured that. Just didn’t have one at hand. Is that something you guys use when making these?

I probably also need to build a better (more vertical) jig for cutting the slots in the top (plus improve my technique). You can also see by the gaps on a couple of corners where I veered slightly when cutting those slots, causing the gaps at those corners.


Anyways, thanks for looking and any feedback/ recommendations are appreciated.

On a side note, I just got ready to post this and saw Ed Sallee’s most recent post “Call ‘em Done – The Heritage Set”. I’ve only been here for a couple of months and I never get tired of looking at your work and the work of others here. Keep ‘em comin’. I plan to graduate up to some memorial boxes for a couple of dogs that have left us too soon, and I love the look of the Bubinga w/ the BE maple.

[Jim Rimmer]

For a guy who claims to be as inexperienced as you do, that is really nice work. Don't tell anyone about your errors and chances are, they won't notice. Post more pics after the finish - good or bad.

[glenn bradley]

Lookin' good. I'd say you're doing very well. I agree about Ed; I love seeing his stuff (and tips). I use one of my outside dado plates for the key slots as I run TK blades. I rip the key stock just a bit thick and tune it with a block plane. One of the great things about boxes is that the more projects you do, the more your scraps start to look like box-making material ;-)

[sean m. titmas]

Todd,

for cutting splines without a bandsaw try cutting them about 1" wide and 3" long (safe for a miter saw) and glue them in full size. once dry you can use a pull saw to trim them flush and keep the scraps for the next box.

the proportions for the box look specific to hold a certain item but when it comes to making test boxes i like to make them as small as possible ( about 5"x8"x 4"tall) so i can work through my design and construction techniques without wasting too much wood.

deciding what wood species to combine is completely up to the carpenter building the box. Its like paring wine with a dish, there are no rules and its completely up to you to decide what to serve.

when it comes to a finish there are a few things I consider;
end use for the box
desired look
spray booth capabilities
skill of the finisher
in my shop and with my skills im set up for spraying lacquer and C/V so that is what i tend to go to first but im wanting to experiment more with brushing and padding on shellacs, varnishes and oils. experimenting is the key word and when the box is small its easy to build 3 or 4 and do a different finish for each one.

The jig I use is a basic cradle type jig that fully supports the box and rides in the miter slot on my T/S. I use a vise clamp and block of wood to act as a stop block.

As a side note, stop berating your self and your skills. You obviously have the ability to see something and build it without needing someone to help you so while you can be critical of your results, you should make no apologies for your actions. With your post and the questions you are asking I can see that you already “get it” and will quickly learn the skills that box building teaches and than move on to the next one.

[Craig T. Smith]

Todd, Really like how the box is coming along.I agree with Sean about your skills, stop dogging yourself, learn from your mistakes and remember to have fun. I show my mistakes to my wife ( she has better eyes than I do )and she gives me some pretty good constuctive critisism then I try to learn and let it go. Nice work. Craig

[John Keeton]

Todd, the box looks good to me, and you have answered some of your own questions by trial and error on the spline slots. As to the mahogany and maple - to me, maple is like white trim in a room - it goes with just about anything. On mixing other woods, some of the combinations I see are not appealing to me, but as my wife says, "good thing everyone doesn't like what you do, because the price would be so high you couldn't afford it!" She is right! So, I would say experiment and do what pleases you on the pick of woods.

Sean has given you some very good advice. And, the reason the 5" x 8" looks good is because it is derived from the phi proportion of 1:1.618.

And finally, look up all of Ed's posts and review them in detail, along with some of the other fine craftsmen on the creek. Dewey Torres does some great inlay work, and Jay McDougall has posted a few really nice boxes. There are many others, but those come to mind.

[Ed Sallee]

Todd, Very nice..... I think you did a great job with the tools that you described, or lack thereof....

I am currently at work and can't focus too much on what I want to say right now, but will come back later this evening...... I just wanted to acknowledge your work.... Well Done.

And.... thanks to all the comments from you and the other fella's about my stuff.... Box making has been quite an adventure for me.

By the way... I just noticed that this is my 500th post!!!

[Jeff Mohr]

Looks good to me! I haven't braved the spline world yet but hope to someday....just need to decide how/when to build a jig and go for it I guess.

[Todd Young]

Thanks for all the feedback guys. I do tend to dog myself quite a bit and probably need to just relax a little. I guess I just want to come off as humble more than anything else. I kind of equate it to playing music or sports. There's always something to learn as long as you're open to it.

I'll try to condense the response to most feedback here into this post.

I'm not completely new to woodworking, however I am rather new to woodworking with joinery that doesn't involve drywall screws (hidden by molding) or air gun nailers. Trying to step myself up into more M&T joints, rabbets, splines, etc. I know that I just need to keep at it and practice. One thing I have found is that you can't ever read enough.

Sean, the dims were specific when I started to put it together. I'm doing these mostly as practice for the memorial boxes I mentioned in the original post. I have the ashes from a puppy of ours that died of parvo six days after we got him so what I was trying to do was make the box big enough to house the smal urn as well as be able to display a picture. I think I may try to add a bit of length to it instead of trying to compact it down as I did on this one. I'll also make the splines a bit bigger on the next round like you had mentioned.

This box here (upon the recommendation of my better half) will make a nice "Tea" box, so that's what it will probably end up being once finished.

John, I actually did check out Ed's page that had a number of boxes on it, which fueled me starting into it on Sunday. I also have been perusing the site for box work for a while, looking for ideas, wood blends and such. I'll check out the others mentioned as well.

I'm thinking on the finishing, I'll start with BLO and go from there.

The jig Sean put I think is similar to the one that Doug Stowe used in the article. I made one that ran flat on the table top and used a fence jig for it to ride along. I too used a small C clamp to hold the blocks for the splines.

Thanks again for all the feedback guys. I'll post more pics once I delve into the finishing, one way or another.

[John Thompson]

Very nicely done and I am probably going to do some small boxes similar or recipe boxes for Xmas gifts in the near future if I ever get this desk-hutch finished. I lay off large carcass during the hot summer months here in Georgia. Those look great.

I use a spline jig just as the one Sean posted but.... mine has an extra piece that rides over the fence in lieu of the miter slot. That way it slides to and fro and can be adjusted very quickly by unlocking and moving the fence where you need it. Quik-clamps to hold the stock in the cradle.

Again.. well done.

Sarge..

[Larry Fox]

Looking good, I think you are being too hard on yourself here. For me:

1) I just cut the splies full length and cut them off later as other posters have said. I cut them off with either a pull saw or, as I discovered over the weekend, a bladsaw works just as well only quicker. I them plane them flush.
2) For the stock, I rip them a bit oversized on the ts and run them through the planer to get them close. I put a piece of 3/4" MDF on the bed so they planer is not near the bottom of it's range. For fine-tuning, I either run them over a sanding block a few times or hit them a few times with a hammer if they are close.
3) Finish - sky is the limit. Can get as simple as oil and wax or as complicated as you like. I am a shellac guy so I either go that route or French Polish if I am feeling ambitious on a project. Spray lacquer or Waterlox would also be nice.
4) You asked about the woods. I think they look fine together. I tend to like darker woods but that is personal preference.

[Ed Sallee]

Looks like you have received some pretty sound advice from the folks here already.....

I use two different blades as my work horses... Both are Forrest WWII's - 40 tooth. One has an ATB and the other is the #1 O.D. Grind which provides a perfectly flat bottom - each and every time.

As the splines go..... nobody said they have to be triangular.... although, triangles provide less waste.... I've been known to just cut some lengths and glue them in.... I read somewhere along the line that this is one place that you do not want to be concerned about too much glue. Slather it on...

I'm with Sarge on the spline cutting jig. Mine stradles the fence as well to provide the additional stabilization.

Cutting the splines down.... for me, I use the band saw and then sand them down. I'm sure the other methods described here will work just as well.

Wood combination - well, that is indeed a personal preference. I have had everything I have laying on the bench for days..... just looking at it... to try to picture what the outcome will be. It's purely a personal choice.

Same with the finishing... I'm mostly an oil and lacquer guy.... I use shellac on the trays as they will most likely take a beating and shellac seems to be a very durable finish.

You're off to a good start! Keep 'em coming.... But, be careful, box making can be addictive.... especially when the ladies eyes twinkle when they see 'em.....

[Todd Young]

Thanks again for the great advice from everyone.

I was at it again last night and was planning to re-vamp the slot jig to either or of the ones mentioned. I may end up doing the jig that stradles the fence as the one I'm using now just rides along the fence.

I'll try the non-triangle splines, as well as Sean's thoughts to see which one uses less time and feels more comfortable. I can already see a pull saw in my future.

Probably plan to grab a flat groove blade at some point because I have a feeling I'll be using up scraps in this manner more frequently.

We'll see how the finishing turns out and on to the next one.

[Todd Young]

Okay so I said I'd update as I got to the finishing, so here it goes :eek:.

Finish is General Finish Seal-A-Cell Clear then General Finish Arm-R-Seal Oil & Urethane Topcoat Gloss.

A couple of pics of the box after top was cut and sanded in preparation for finishing:
124813 124814

Then a pic after first coat of Seal-A-Cell Clear.

124815

Still drying tonight.

Pictures could probably be better. Some of the splines darkened a bit more than I thought, but it is what it is.

Plan to continue finishing more tomorrow. I'll keep posting the progression, good or bad.

Todd

[Todd Young]

Alas, finished first box. 5 topcoats Gen Arm-R-Seal and a thin coat of paste wax.

I learned a lot and should move a little (a lot) faster on future projects.

Thanks for checking it out and thanks for the tips to everyone.

[Bill Wyko]

Very nice job on your first attempt. The Fibonacci ratio (1.618) is a great way to get dimensions that are appealing to the eye. you've achieved that here.

[Todd Young]

Thanks for kudos Bill. I check out a lot of the work you post and hope to get to your level at some point.

T

[Bill Wyko]

Thank you as well. If I can ever be of any help please let me know.:)