In need of a table saw tuning/calibration lesson

[Ryan Melena]

Hey all,

I just picked up my very first table saw today (found it on craigslist). It's a Delta #34-441 contractor's saw with a uni-fence, mobile base, extension table, and home-made sawdust trap.

The saw is in need of some TLC and I've already begun by cleaning out the sawdust trap and taking a Scotch-Brite pad to the table with my random orbital sander to get rid of a layer of rust.

Next up is tuning / calibrating the saw and I could really use some help. I've already found that the blade isn't quite square with the miter and I'm not sure if it is perfectly perpendicular to the table either. I'm also not sure if they uni-fence is properly tightened to the guide rail.

If there are any gurus in the Minneapolis, MN area I'd be happy to pay someone for a tune-up so long as they don't mind showing me the ropes while they work. Anyone around that could help?

Thanks,
Ryan

[Craig T. Smith]

Ryan, Sorry can't help you with the saw but I can say Welcome to the Creek. There's alot of good people and info here. Craig

[Bob Aquino]

Ryan
The best thing you can do for yourself and that saw is to get warm and fuzzy with how it works and get busy aligning it yourself. Contractor saws mount all the mechanicals that make up the saw mechanism to the bottom of the table via two points forward and aft of the blade itself. Aligning the saw so it is parallel to the miter slot is a matter of loosening the four bolts enough that the whole underneath assembly can shift left or right and then tightening it back up once its square.

If you want to get fancy, they even sell a set of alignment tools called "PALS" that will allow you to microadjust the side to side movement with greater precision before you lock it down. http://www.in-lineindustries.com/saw_pals.html Here is another link to a good online article that documents the whole process: http://www.newwoodworker.com/algntruns.html

[Jason White]

Check your local library. Lots of books out there illustrating how to adjust and tune tablesaws.



Hey all,

I just picked up my very first table saw today (found it on craigslist). It's a Delta #34-441 contractor's saw with a uni-fence, mobile base, extension table, and home-made sawdust trap.

The saw is in need of some TLC and I've already begun by cleaning out the sawdust trap and taking a Scotch-Brite pad to the table with my random orbital sander to get rid of a layer of rust.

Next up is tuning / calibrating the saw and I could really use some help. I've already found that the blade isn't quite square with the miter and I'm not sure if it is perfectly perpendicular to the table either. I'm also not sure if they uni-fence is properly tightened to the guide rail.

If there are any gurus in the Minneapolis, MN area I'd be happy to pay someone for a tune-up so long as they don't mind showing me the ropes while they work. Anyone around that could help?

Thanks,
Ryan

[Mark Fogleman]

I'm new here too but here's a schematic of your saw: http://www.toolpartsdirect.com/cgi-bin/schematic.cgi/delta/34-441

Alligning the table to the blade involves loosening (not removing) the 4 hex head screws (#23 in the schematic) holding the top to the cabinet and adjusting it so the miter slots are square to the blade. Use your miter gauge, a spring clamp and a piece of scrap to just touch the front of the blade and then rotate the blade so that tooth is at the back of the blade insert and slide your miter gauge back to that tooth. Whack which ever corner with a rubber mallet until it comes into allignment. I prefer to use 2 large 45 degree drafting triangles like this:
http://www.ncwoodworker.net/pp/data/708/medium/Tablesaw_Top_Alignment_014.jpg

You'll need to adjust your miter gauge to exactly square before this will work well but this is much quicker than messing around with dial indicators and scraps of wood. Suggest getting John White's book on shop equipment if you're just starting out: http://www.amazon.com/Care-Repair-Shop-Machines-Troubleshooting/dp/156158424X/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1242128158&sr=1-1

[Bill Huber]

I'm new here too but here's a schematic of your saw: http://www.toolpartsdirect.com/cgi-bin/schematic.cgi/delta/34-441

Alligning the table to the blade involves loosening (not removing) the 4 hex head screws (#23 in the schematic) holding the top to the cabinet and adjusting it so the miter slots are square to the blade.




Mark, that will not work for a contractor saw, the trunnions are mounted to the top. If you were adjusting a cabinet saw then you could move the top and that would get it but with a contractor saw moving the top will not change anything, you have to move the trunnions.


Ryan, the pals are nice little things to have but you don't have to have them they do make it much easier.

I did buy a Super Bar and plate and have never looked back, it is a very nice tool to have. again you don't have to have it but is sure is nice.

http://www.newwoodworker.com/reviews/suprbrrvu.html

[Ryan Melena]

Hey all,

Thanks for the tips. I got in there today and loosened the trunnions and started adjusting. I wanted to get the blade reasonably square so I could make a few cuts for some shelves (nothing that needed a ton of accuracy). I plan on ordering some equipment and doing a more thorough calibration when it arrives.

I was disheartened for a while when I couldn't get the blade anywhere near parallel using a quick square and the miter gauge. There was at least 1/16" difference between the front of the blade and the back no matter how far I adjusted the trunnions. After a little cursing, however, I found out that my miter gauge seems to be off.

With the miter gauge set exactly at 90 degrees I put one arm of my quick square up to it and found the other arm of the quick square didn't run parallel to the miter slot. It turns out I had to set the miter gauge to about 89.5 degrees to get it perpendicular to the miter slot. Once I got that figured out, I was please to find that I could adjust the trunnions to the point where the blade was parallel to my quick square.

So... is it really possible that the miter gauge is just off? It sure seems that way.

[Bill Huber]

Hey all,

Thanks for the tips. I got in there today and loosened the trunnions and started adjusting. I wanted to get the blade reasonably square so I could make a few cuts for some shelves (nothing that needed a ton of accuracy). I plan on ordering some equipment and doing a more thorough calibration when it arrives.

I was disheartened for a while when I couldn't get the blade anywhere near parallel using a quick square and the miter gauge. There was at least 1/16" difference between the front of the blade and the back no matter how far I adjusted the trunnions. After a little cursing, however, I found out that my miter gauge seems to be off.

With the miter gauge set exactly at 90 degrees I put one arm of my quick square up to it and found the other arm of the quick square didn't run parallel to the miter slot. It turns out I had to set the miter gauge to about 89.5 degrees to get it perpendicular to the miter slot. Once I got that figured out, I was please to find that I could adjust the trunnions to the point where the blade was parallel to my quick square.

So... is it really possible that the miter gauge is just off? It sure seems that way.


I am not sure I understand but what you want to do is forget about the gauge for now and start with the blade and the miter slot. Ones that is correct then you can go to the fence and the miter slot and then the miter gauge.

On my old Craftsman I had to file the holes in the trunnions out a little to get it just right on the one end. With one set all the way to the right and the other all the way to the left is just didn't make it.

[Ryan Melena]

Bill,

I guess the short version is this:

When my miter gauge is set to 90 degrees its face doesn't seem to be perpendicular to the miter slot. It appears to be perpendicular somewhere around 89.5 degrees.

I understand that once I order equipment for calibration I'll be able to calibrate against the miter slot itself but it seems like I'll still have to keep my miter gauge at 89.5 degrees to get a square cut.

[Rob Price]

What I've always done is set the blade parallel to the miter slot first, then set the miter gauge 90 to the blade- that should make it 90 to the slot as well, but either way, what's important is that the face of the miter gauge is 90 degrees to the blade, don't worry about the slot (once it's set to the blade).

[Ryan Melena]

Thanks for the reply Rob.

I guess I was just surprised that the miter gauge wouldn't read 90 degrees when it was perpendicular. I guess once I get my calibration equipment I'll go through the whole process and figure out if the miter gauge's angle markings really are off.

[Kevin Groenke]

Hey Ryan,

Welcome to the Creek.

It sounds like your on track with the trunnion/table bolts. I agree with Bill, keep the miter gauge out of the equation until you get the slot parallel to the blade. I've mounted a dial indicator to a miter bar to do this easily.

What kind of miter gauge do you have? I would not expect a "traditional" miter gauge to be at 90 without calibrating it with a machinist's square or the cut/flip method. http://www.tablesawalignment.com/images/miter-gauge-2.jpg
An "improved" miter gauge that one can expect to be consistently accurate is a very worthwhile investment. The best such gauge is an issue of much debate, there are many good choices. (Incra, Kreg, Osborne, Woodhaven, etc...)

I'm near Powderhorn Pk in S.Mpls. If you're in the neighborhood, I may be able to stop by sometime though the next couple weeks are rather stuffed.

[Rob Price]

Okay, now I see your issue. There should be some way to adjust the indicator on the miter gauge- set it square to the blade, and then adjust the indicator to line up with 90.

[Ryan Melena]

Hey Ryan,

Welcome to the Creek.

It sounds like your on track with the trunnion/table bolts. I agree with Bill, keep the miter gauge out of the equation until you get the slot parallel to the blade. I've mounted a dial indicator to a miter bar to do this easily.

What kind of miter gauge do you have? I would not expect a "traditional" miter gauge to be at 90 without calibrating it with a machinist's square or the cut/flip method.

An "improved" miter gauge that one can expect to be consistently accurate is a very worthwhile investment. The best such gauge is an issue of much debate, there are many good choices. (Incra, Kreg, Osborne, Woodhaven, etc...)

I'm near Powderhorn Pk in S.Mpls. If you're in the neighborhood, I may be able to stop by sometime though the next couple weeks are rather stuffed.

Hi Kevin,

I believe the miter gauge is the original Delta that came with the saw. Perhaps I'll have to add a miter gauge upgrade to my "to purchase" upgrades list.

I guess I wasn't aware that there was any calibration you could do to the miter gauge itself. It appears I've got some more reading to do. :)

As for my location, I'm afraid I'm on the North side of Mpls in Columbia Heights so it would probably be a bit of a trek for you.

Thanks for all the advice!


Okay, now I see your issue. There should be some way to adjust the indicator on the miter gauge- set it square to the blade, and then adjust the indicator to line up with 90.

Thanks for the follow up Rob. I'll have to look into the procedure, especially once I calibrate the blade more accurately.

[Andy Bardowell]

Ryan there is also a couple of very good videos at Marc Spagnuolo's site, check out 55 and 56, although he's tuning a cabinet saw the process is the same, you'd loosen your trunnion rather than the top.

http://thewoodwhisperer.com/

[Mark Carlson]

Ryan. Welcome. I got a lot out of video called "Mastering Your Tablesaw" by Kelly Mehler when I was starting out. It shows how to setup and use a tablesaw. He tunes a contractor saw at the beginning if my memory is correct.

~mark

[Stephen Edwards]

Welcome to the Creek! You can learn a lot here. I certainly have!

As others have said, most miter gauges do have an adjustment mechanism for calibration. Take the time to thoroughly examine it, top and bottom. I bet you'll find an adjustment there.

But, as Bill Huber said, the miter gauge is the last part of the tune up. I wouldn't spend too much time worrying about it until you have the blade square to the miter track and then the fence adjusted square to the track. THEN deal with the miter gauge.

Recently, I spent several hours tuning up my saw, following advice and tips learned here at SMC. A properly tuned TS will make your woodworking experience much more enjoyable and a lot less frustrating.

Regards,

[Brian Walter]

Hi Ryan, I live on the other side of town, in Eagan, but I do have some of the setup equipment that you need to adjust your table saw. I'm certainly not an expert at aligning things, as a matter of fact I spent most of last Saturday changing the face on my rip fence and re-adjusting everything (most everything any way). If you are interested, I could probably stop by and help you setup your saw. I have parents that live in Roseville, so I get to that side of town fairly regularly. Send me a PM if you would like to get together.

Brian Walter

[Grant Morris]

There are a couple of table saw setup videos on this site worth watching.

Videos (http://www.woodworkingonline.com/category/podcast/)

[Jeff Monson]

Ryan,

I'd make a trip down to your woodcraft store and pickup a set up PALS its the best 30 dollars you can spend on a contractors saw. I had a delta contractors and used it for a year, when I was in MPLS I went to woodcraft and bought a link belt and PALS for my saw and got the blade and the mitre slot lined up and installed the link belt and I thought I had bought a new saw, completely different machine after those 2 simple upgrades.

[glenn bradley]

pickup a set up PALS its the best 30 dollars you can spend on a contractors saw.

Pals on sale right now at Woodcraft for $20. HTH