killing bugs

[Greg Crawford]

I got some white oak from a barn that was 150 years old, and lots of it is still solid as a rock. I have a bunch of old tools that need a home, and this seems like the perfect wood to use. Before I put it in my shop, I want to make sure no bugs are in it. I've read about using heat, CO2 and nitrogen.

For the heat, the Texas sun should get the right setup above 140 degrees, but I don't know how high I can get it and how long it will sustain it.

I don't have either of the gases on hand. I know nitrogen is a heavy gas, so an absolutely airtight seal on the top isn't critical. I'm not sure about CO2.

It seems to me if I build a 2x4 frame a little bigger than a bath tub and line it with plastic, load the wood, put nitrogen in, then tape a plastic lid on, it should work.

Any experiences or thoughts? I couldn't find a great deal on using gas to kill the bugs on SMC or Woodweb.

[Jerry Murray]

dont forget about cold either. That's how we deal with tobacco beetles in cigars, freeze them for a few days and allow for a slow thaw.

[jeremy levine]

I have no real experience at this , just one thing nitrogen is just about Neutrally buoyant CO2 is heaveier then air.

[Lee Schierer]

I have no real experience at this , just one thing nitrogen is just about Neutrally buoyant CO2 is heaveier then air.

Jeremy is correct. Air is 78% nitrogen with just under 21% oxygen and slightly less than 1% argon, so you will need to seal up your container if you plan to keep it filled with pure nitrogen. I would think that it will take some time for the lack of oxygen to have an effect on any bugs inside the wood or still in egg form.

[Todd Burch]

Greg, you could do what some of the Mesquite dealers do in Texas to kill the borers - throw the wood on a fire ant mound. Dang fire ants will find any bugs and kill them. ;)

Todd

[Greg Crawford]

Thanks for the answers. If I use gas, I'll go with CO2 for a week or so. I also didn't know fire ants would get those bugs. I knew they eat termites (weird way to get rid of termites if you have them), and would clean bones better than sun bleaching. I use that Over-N-Out, so I don't have any of those right now, though.

[harry strasil]

how about just putting the lumber up on a couple of saw horses, covering with a cheap plastic tarp, weight the edges down and set off some bug bombs under the tarp in old cans, bug bombs are nerve gas so be careful. that's what whole house exterminators do, cover the house with tarps and set off bug bombs or pump gas in.

[Greg Crawford]

Harry,

I thought about that, but there was some discussion I found on various forums about the chemicals remaining in the wood. If any of it does, when the wood is machined, it will release those chemicals into the air. This may be overcautious, but I don't want to take that chance.

Greg

[Wes Grass]

CO2 will kill the bugs, but may not take care of any eggs they've left behind. I don't think freezing will do it either. Heck, they grow people from frozen eggs and embryos. Poison or heat is the most effective from what I understand.

As for heat, laying it on the dash of your truck with the windows up on a summer day in Texas should do the trick ;-)

[David Keller NC]

And something related to what Harry said - ammonia fuming. One buys some 30% Ammonium hydroxide at a chemical supply store, puts up a plastic enclosure, and puts a small pan of it underneath. The ammonia is 100% guaranteed to wipe out all life in the wood - bugs, eggs, fungi and bacteria, and once the wood's aired out for a few hours, it leaves no residue.

It will darken wood with tannins in it, but for old oak, that might be desirable.

[Greg Crawford]

David, the amonia may be just the ticket. I do know it won't hurt the look of this stuff. It's old and weathered and grey. It still has the ax marks in it, which I'm hoping I can keep on the outside. I think the old planes with the old wood will make a nice addition to my plain white wrapper walls.

[Dave Mura]

Great tips here, good luck! :)

[Greg Crawford]

Dave,

All I'm getting are X's. Could you try again? I'm logged in and even tried with my ad blocker shut off.

Thanks,

Greg

[Scott T Smith]

Greg, when I kiln dry lumber I'll sterilize the load at 130 degrees F for 24 hours at the end of the cycle.

What I would suggest is that you put the boards up in an attic for a week or two (or just leave them stored up there). In Texas, that should sterilize the wood w/o any problems or chemicals.

[Peter Scoma]

Off topic but I kill bugs anywhere in my house with a small propane torch used for cooking. A quick hit with a blue flame burns off their legs in an instant and leaves no marks on the walls.

Be careful on carpet.

PS

[Dennis Thornton]

You may want to do some research on the ammonia. Doesn't heating ammonia create ammonia fumes which, with oak, results in fumed oak?

[Mark P. Brown]

Dry ice and an old chest type deep freeze will do the job for you. The co2 in the dry ice is much heavier than air. Put in 3-4 pounds then stack in the wood leave about 6 inches of free space at the top of the chest. The bugs will die in less than 24 hours. The dry ice will not discolor the wood or leave a harmfull residue. The co2 will stay in the chest as long as it is kept from litterly being dumped out. Not good if pets can get in. Also works great on electronics or other items from questionable areas befor taking them into the house or shop and yes eggs do breathe.;)
Mark

[jim carter]

wrap in black plastic and leave in full sun for a week. the temp will get above 140 during the day.

[Greg Crawford]

Scott,

I thought about my attic, but then started thinking about termites. I know I've had carpenter ants in my facia boards on a house, and I think they were going in to the attic. I'm just not sure an attic gets hot enough to kill everything. I've been told that the mesquite borers take about 140 degrees. I can't remember the time.

I think I'll try the amonia. It will help to oxidize the newer cuts to match the weathered wood.

[Cody Colston]

wrap in black plastic and leave in full sun for a week. the temp will get above 140 during the day.

That would be my recommendation also. If you don't think it will get hot enough then take it somewhere and have it kiln dried. That would be certain to kill all the bugs unlike some of those esoteric and questionable methods suggested.

[chris beserra]

Covering the wood with clear plastic in the sun will get it extremely hot. If it's 100 degrees outside, you can probably get 140 or more under the plastic. It's just a little greenhouse :p

[David Keller NC]

"I think I'll try the amonia. It will help to oxidize the newer cuts to match the weathered wood."

Greg - A couple of other thoughts on the Ammonium Hydroxide you need to do this - if you still have a traditional blueprint shop in your town, you may be able to get blueprinter's ammonia, which is essentially the same stuff but cheaper. Otherwise, ask for the "technical grade" at the chemical supply store (Thermo Fisher is a common chemical supply store, BTW). The technical grade is the most impure, but also the cheapest, and you don't need laboratory reagent grade for this purpose.

One caution - ammonia in this concentration will burn both skin and mucous membranes (your sinuses and lungs). So be cautious, wear a respirator from one of the big box stores with carbon cartridges, and use a face shield and rubber chemical gloves (the re-usable dishwashing gloves from the grocery store are fine - latez and nitrile disposables are not). And obviously, this is not to be done inside.

This is a worthwhile technique to learn besides killing bugs - it's a great way to oxidize and darken wood without fear of blotching, runs or drips.