Another downside to digital TV

[Brian Elfert]

One of the upsides of digital TV is HDTV, but it is also a downside since a lot of shows are now shot in HD which is also widescreen.

With the transition to digital TV, many shows are now broadcast in widescreen regardless if you have a widescreen TV or not. Those of us with old 4:3 TVs lose a fair amount of the picture.

I suppose maybe there is no longer a way to differentiate between wiade and normal screens since there is only a digital signal now instead of seperate analog and digital signals. Besides broadcast TV, some cable channels are using the HD channel to feed their analog subscribers.

With the economy affecting my job I can't afford $800 for a new TV and an extra $40 a month for upgraded cable TV right now. I would rather have black bars on the top and bottom of the screen than miss out on parts of the action. Oh well, I guess technology moves on.

[Leigh Costello]

HD is a pain in the rear-new technology is not always optimal. I don't like the way the shows look in HD. Too much detail in my opinion. And the pricetag to switch is way too high. My guess is the electronics world had a great deal to gain from the switch. Since we are so busy now-thank you God for the customers-we don't watch nearly as much TV. We will change at the last minute no doubt. Progress...I think.

[Bruce Page]

The transition to new technology can be slow and painful, but once there, most people are happy with it.
Now days, most of what I watch is in HD, and I cringe when I want to watch something that’s not.

[Greg Peterson]

I'm torn. The sensible side of me, or that which I consider to be sensible, instructs me to ignore the HD wave, stick with my old CRT television, and when it dies, don't replace it.

The addict in me wants HD programming and wide screen, but is willing to wait for prices, products and offerings to find a happy medium.

A little TV addiction goes a long way. It has little to no value. I like to watch football and basketball, the rest of the programming is mostly just hideous commercial driven tripe. Most of the shows I do like are available via Netflix.

Leary had it backwards, turn off, tune out, drop in. TV is the opiate of the masses these days.

[Tim Morton]

Just had to check the dates of this thread...i was thinking this was an OLD topic:cool:

Now to try and answer the question, can't you change your STB to do pass-thru so as not to stretch or change the picture? What cable box are you using?

[Jeff Craven]

I don't see any downsides to digital TV. I have the digital converter which has an option to zoom in on the widescreen shows, to make them look better on my 4:3 TV. The digital conversion allows me to pick up more channels with my antenna, then I could before. Eventually I'll get a widescreen HDTV, but for now, I can enjoy plenty of programming, without paying for cable.

[Brian Elfert]

I don't have a converter since I have cable TV. I also don't have a cable box since my cable TV is analog.

I do have a Replay TV that I actually run the cable TV signal into. I didn't realize the converters help solve this issue.

This wasn't really an issue until Comcast started switching to digital feeds from the local broadcast stations. The analog feeds had everything formatted for 4:3 televisions.

[Brent Leonard]

I pay nearly $100/month to never have time to watch HBO & Starz/Encore and all the HD channels. Of course, TV is a absolutely last thing, with nothing else in the world to do type thing for me. I typically would rather do anything, including wash dishes before I sit down and veg in front of the tube (or is it now call the diode?).

What was said about once you go HD, you'll never want to go back.....
quite true.

I watch a non-HD channel now and I'm cussing that something is wrong with the cable system as the picture is so bad!!

[Eric DeSilva]

Just had to check the dates of this thread...i was thinking this was an OLD topic:cool:

Now to try and answer the question, can't you change your STB to do pass-thru so as not to stretch or change the picture? What cable box are you using?

Probably not. If the native source is widescreen, the STB may down rez it to SD, but its either going to have to black bar the top/bottom, stretch it so everyone looks tall and thin, or do the pan-and-scan thing. OP is right--he is going to be missing something. I think they still try to shoot HD for TV in a way that concentrates material in the 4:3 part in the center, but that is going to go by the by pretty soon.

[Eric DeSilva]

I don't like the way the shows look in HD. Too much detail in my opinion. And the pricetag to switch is way too high.

You are probably in the minority. I like the added detail--movies have a much more impressive, theater-quality to them. I don't watch a lot of sports, but I've heard the most rabid raves about HD from baseball, football, basketball and golf fans.

For "normal" TV programming, I don't really care so much one way or the other--I'm not going to turn off something I want to see because its SD, nor am I going to watch something I wouldn't just because its in HD.

But, when it is properly tuned on a decent HD set, good, uncompressed HD is fantastic to behold.

[Brian Elfert]

Probably not. If the native source is widescreen, the STB may down rez it to SD, but its either going to have to black bar the top/bottom, stretch it so everyone looks tall and thin, or do the pan-and-scan thing. OP is right--he is going to be missing something. I think they still try to shoot HD for TV in a way that concentrates material in the 4:3 part in the center, but that is going to go by the by pretty soon.

Certain TV shows used to have black bars top and bottom so they would appear right on 4:3 TVs when the feed was still analog, but with the digital feeds that isn't happening anymore.

I wish there was some inexpensive way to get HD TV service, but my cable bill would go from $16 to north of $50 just to get HD. I also have to get a new DVR to record in HD.

[Burt Alcantara]

Our TV died around Thanksgiving. It was a tiny 17" Zenith. Sharp as a tack but tiny as an ant. With my old eyes I couldn't read the DirectTV menu. Went to CostCo and got a 32". I really wanted something bigger buy wife objected.

Don't have HD and won't have it until it becomes a standard, the color became standard. But, by the time that happens I'll be looking at the Great Void.

When letter box formats began to become more common, I found I liked that format much better. Probably because my old computer monitor died and I picked up a 21" wide screen. I hate the 4:3 format and will bid it a happy adieu. Now, I wish broadcast TV would go full screen, which a lot of the newer DVDs are doing.

Brian, I understand your concerns as technology seems to zoom by too quickly sometimes. I'm lucky in that department because me and the wife are kind of reclusive so social networking, twitter, chats, etc, pass right on by with nary a blink from us.

Obliviously Happy,
Burt

[Eric DeSilva]

Analog over the air is *only* formatted 4:3. Digital over the air is *only* formatted 16:9. Since networks were transitioning to 16:9, new material generally got shot in 16:9, then downrezzed/black barred top and bottom for transmission over the analog transmitter. So, if you are getting analog over the air, its either shot natively in 4:3 or blackbarred. Cable and satellite set top boxes (STBs) can complicate things, because when you set the output, the STB will reformat things--it may do blackbarring, zooming, pan & scan, or stretch. But, that is the STB, not the broadcaster.

And, there is a cheap way to get HD--over the air. Its free... And, generally, speaking, it hasn't been stepped on by a satellite provider or cable provider to compress it. Over the air HD looks good.

[Cliff Rohrabacher]

just wait till they get a TV that is also a camera - for video conferencing and other computer bases apps. .

The conspiracy theorists will have a party.

[Glenn Clabo]

I wish there was some inexpensive way to get HD TV service, but my cable bill would go from $16 to north of $50 just to get HD. I also have to get a new DVR to record in HD.

There is... http://www.antennaweb.org/aw/welcome.aspx

[Eric Roberge]

Those of us with old 4:3 TVs lose a fair amount of the picture.



Brian,
You shouldn't lose any of the picture. (Your 4:3 TV picture should just shrink basically leaving you with bars at the top and bottom). A 4:3 TV will not show a zoomed picture cutting off the sides unless there is a setting changed on equipment placed before the TV, but you stated that you don't have a cable box, etc...:confused:

Not sure what's going on, but something doesn't sound right...
I worked in the cable communications field for over 8 years and have never seen that. My bedroom TV is still a 4:3 TV and most of my stations have moved to digital and it's not effecting the picture in that way.:confused:

[David Winer]

And, there is a cheap way to get HD--over the air. Its free... And, generally, speaking, it hasn't been stepped on by a satellite provider or cable provider to compress it. Over the air HD looks good.
Put me down as a very happy camper for High Resolution Digital Television.

When the Verizon FIOS (fiber optic system) for TV became available we subscribed to "cable" for the first time. I had really been looking forward to it. I purchased a new HDTV for the occasion and while waiting three days for the Verizon installation, hooked the new TV to my rabbit ear type antenna. The result was simply stunning. So good in fact that after three more days with the FIOS "cable" the picture was not in any way improved. I cancled the service and have been using over-the-air (OTA) since then.

There is a downside to OTA though. Sometimes the signals are interrupted by high winds which (I presume) make the transmiting towers sway. The television picture can go from perfect to zero briefly. There is no in between; either perfect or off. Fortunately this doesn't happen very often.

I have upgraded to a more robust antenna--a simple one installed on the attic floor. In my opinion this is a worthwhile upgrade to the rabbit ear variety. The one I bought has a wide angle of excellent high gain reception, about 75 degrees, and captures all stations of interest in my location without the need to move it. This (http://www.antennasdirect.com/C2-Clearstream-DTV-antenna.html) is the one I got, with some information, now also available at Target (http://www.target.com/Antennas-Direct-Outdoor-Extreme-Digital/dp/B001BRXW74). They offer a larger one at a higher cost. (No affiliation.)

[Eric DeSilva]

Here's an interesting resource--www.antennaweb.org. If you plug in your address, it will tell you what HD transmissions you might be able to pick up, what kind of antenna is needed for each, and the orientation (if applicable).

Edit: Dang. Posted this, then went down a couple posts to find Glenn's reference to the same site. Timing is everything.

[Brian Elfert]

Brian,
You shouldn't lose any of the picture. (Your 4:3 TV picture should just shrink basically leaving you with bars at the top and bottom). A 4:3 TV will not show a zoomed picture cutting off the sides unless there is a setting changed on equipment placed before the TV, but you stated that you don't have a cable box, etc...:confused:


It isn't working like that since Comcast started using the digital feeds from local stations instead of the analog feeds. It appears that for certain cable TV only networks Comcast is using the HD feed for non-HD now. I am not getting any black bars top and bottom when I notice the issues.

On the retrospective for E.R. I noticed that captions with actor's names were partly off the screen. Also on a recent episode of Modern Marvels on History channel the same thing happens with captions for names.

Yes, one can get HD channels for free and I live at most two miles from the tranmission towers all but one TV station locally use, but then I lose the cable TV networks I watch. In the analog days, the transmission towers were actually too close causing all kinds of ghosting and such, but that shouldn't happen with digital.

[Jason Roehl]

Right now, my widescreen is down for the count, so I moved my HD cable box to our 27" 4:3 TV. I can watch stuff letterboxed or zoomed (I don't do this because I don't want to mess with how I have the cable box's software settings). However, if you zoom an HD picture on a 4:3 tube TV, you should not lose any of the picture top or bottom, just the sides. If you do lose parts of the top and/or bottom of the picture, your TV needs to have its picture adjusted. More recent tube TVs let you do this from the menu, older sets usually have adjustment screws somewhere on the cabinet (bottom front, side, back). You can even get calibration DVDs/tapes that display a graph to help you adjust your TV so that you get all the picture you're supposed to.

One thing I have noticed about HD programming is that even the shows/news/sports that are shot with HD camera still are framed with 4:3 in mind. So, while a 16:9 picture may contain more visual information on the two sides, it is not important to the show. News channels may put extra graphics there, or you might see more of the field in a football game, but you won't ever see the anchors or the football in those outer edges.