Box Joint Blade-Tenon Cheeks

[Leo Vogel]

I do a lot of mortise and tenon joints. I usually use my table saw dado blade for the tenons, but I get tired of having to sand the ridges off of the tenon cheeks. If I switch to a box joint blade, will I still have the ridges to deal with? Any other suggestions to get rid of the ridges? Thanks - got to get to the sanding.

[John Thompson]

No Sir.. I have a Freud Box joint set and just cut 64 tenons for a current project. I cut over 30 on a project several months ago and no work is required with that set. The reason is the two blades have a flat tooth grind which leaves a smooth cut on top.

BTW.. if you only need to take off 1/8" you can eyeball it and use a portion of the two combined blades. Or I sometimes do a 1/8" cut with a 24 tooth flat grind rip blade. And ATB blade will leave a cut with an agnle.Just be sure you have a hardwood backer if you do.

And the true 1/4" and 3/8" using the two box blades can produce 1/2" and 3/4" with a double pass for dadoes. Each blade has around 30-40 flat teeth with no gang cutters in the center. I sold my dado set is this is a better way to do a dado IMO.

Sarge..

[Rod Sheridan]

No Sir.. I have a Freud Box joint set and just cut 64 tenons for a current project. I cut over 30 on a project several months ago and no work is required with that set. The reason is the two blades have a flat tooth grind which leaves a smooth cut on top.

BTW.. if you only need to take off 1/8" you can eyeball it and use a portion of the two combined blades. Or I sometimes do a 1/8" cut with a 24 tooth flat grind rip blade. And ATB blade will leave a cut with an agnle.Just be sure you have a hardwood backer if you do.

And the true 1/4" and 3/8" using the two box blades can produce 1/2" and 3/4" with a double pass for dadoes. Each blade has around 30-40 flat teeth with no gang cutters in the center. I sold my dado set is this is a better way to do a dado IMO.

Sarge..

Hi John, I have a couple of questions for you regarding the above;

1) Are you using these with a tenon jig or using them as a dado cutter

2) Do you make the shoulder cuts first with a crosscut blade?

I'm curious because I also own the Freud set and find that for grooving I sometimes have tearout as there are no scoring cutters.

Much different than doing it on a shaper with scoring and hogging cutters.

Thanks, Rod.

[Mike Gager]

leo, have you considered doing the tenons with a router?

[Joe Scharle]

You won't get faster, cleaner tenons than a router with a sharp bit.

[John Thompson]

Hi John, I have a couple of questions for you regarding the above;

1) Are you using these with a tenon jig or using them as a dado cutter

2) Do you make the shoulder cuts first with a crosscut blade?

I'm curious because I also own the Freud set and find that for grooving I sometimes have tearout as there are no scoring cutters.

Much different than doing it on a shaper with scoring and hogging cutters.

Thanks, Rod.

I am doing them with my own simple tenoning jig which is nothing more than a block of hardwood clamped to an Incra V 27. Another piece of hardwood is dadoed into the block that attached to the Incra fence to form a T. The fence piece and the T piece have both been squared to the Incra fence and the blade. The stock stands against the rear block just as the fence on a metal tenon jig and on the T protruding forward. Then Quik-clamped to the T section. Kind of complicted to explain but I can get a picture if necessary to show just how simple.

I "do not" make the shoulder cuts with a cross-cut blade first. But.. I do a test cut on scrap to make sure all alignments are correct along with depth. I did try using a cross-cut blade first but.. found the ATB angle left a ridge in the corner of the stock where vertical meets horizonal. Change blades to the box and getting the exact set up to correspond was almost impossible. I had the take a nib off cleaning that ATB area with a chisel.

So.. I went straight to the box cutter first to eliminate a double cut and the chisel clean-up. Works like a charm as long as you have a backer board to avoid any tear-out on the back side of the stock. Kind of like my military training.. one shot.. one kill.

As far as tear-out on dadoes with the box set... I get none in both hardwood which is 90% of my work or soft-wood. I cannot comment about the use of a scoring device used in conjunction with a shaper and gang cutters as I don't have a shaper nor have seen it done.

What I do get is perfect dadoes with perfectly flat bottoms that require no clean up. I never liked the idea of two dado cutters outside and a host of gang cutters inside punching the stock out as I have gotten kick-back even with shallow passes when knots were encountered internally. I just never liked the results of a standard dado set nor the hidden surprises it could produce with those center gang cutters. I prefer to have sharp teeth severing as opposed to few teeth knocking the wood out.

Hope that helps...

Sarge..

[Rod Sheridan]

You won't get faster, cleaner tenons than a router with a sharp bit.

Unless you cut them on a shaper..........Rod.

[Rod Sheridan]

Thanks John, that explained it perfectly, as you are using the blades as they would be used with a tenon jig.

I wasn't sure from your first post whether you were nibbling them away as is done with a dado.

I agree about one shot for cutting tenons, I use a cutter in a shaper for that, now I need a second cutter so that I can cut both faces simultaneously.

Regards, Rod.

[Mike Cutler]

Leo
I have the Freud Box Joint cutter set, and as everyone else stated, it works great.
If you still need to remove the grooves,and also need to "tune" the tenon for a perfect fit, Try the Lie-Nielsen, 10 1/4 Bench Rabbet Plane ( based on the Stanley of the same model #). It's quick, easy and you will end up with a shoulder and cheek that are a perfect 90 degrees. The sandpaper stays in the box.

[Joe Scharle]

Unless you cut them on a shaper..........Rod.
I agree with that too...I sold my shaper; old, old Craftsman when big hole cutters became scarce. Then I got a Woodrat instead. Same space.

[Leo Vogel]

Sarge - wow, you made my day. After your post, I went through my stuff and found a WoodWorker II with flat ground teeth (#1 grind). I then did a tenon and it is perfect, with no cleanup required at all. Best looking tenon I have made so far. Thanks for the advise.

I just ordered the Freud Box Joint cutter set from Rockler. They sent me a 20% off coupon a few days ago, so that really helped.

I'm starting to get about as many saw blades as fishing lures. Thanks again everyone.