stabalizing soft wood?

[curtis rosche]

i have heard that you can mix glue with water to thin it and then soak a soft peice of wood to harden it, is this true, if not , are there other ways to do it?

[Roger Wilson]

Don't know about the glue, but Minwax makes a hardener that I've read about people using for your purpose.


MimWax hardener page:

http://www.minwax.com/products/wood_maintenance_and_repair/high_performance_wood_hardener.html

[Alan Trout]

There are companies that do pressure stabilization and it works well. Also I have seen the Minwax wood hardener used and it also works but is also expensive. I have seen it used in a pressure pot under pressure and vacuum which helps the hardener penetrate the wood. There is also a plexiglass glass method where plexiglass is dissolved in acetone and the wood is put in the liquid and put under pressure or vacuum.

Just topical application will not get inside the wood as far as under pressure or vacuum.

Good luck

Alan

[Bernie Weishapl]

Curtis sometimes on punky wood I use 5 minute epoxy mixed up and then mix 50/50 with DNA. It has worked great for me. I let it dry 24 hrs. Oh and a couple demo turners at the Richmond told me not to mess with it. Put it in the firewood pile because life is to short and there is goobs of good free wood.

[David Walser]

Curtis,

Here are several options for stabilizing soft wood:


MinWax Wood Hardener. You should be able to find this stuff at the local hardware store or home center. Depending on the shape and thickness of the wood, I either paint it on or let the wood soak in a covered plastic container. Be sure to have good venilation! The fumes are strong. Wood Hardener dries clear and the wood seems to sand and finish normally. Wood Hardener will stiffen soft, punky wood, but it's not a miricle worker. If the wood won't support any weight before treatment, it won't support much more weight after treatment. Wood Hardener seems to penetrate wood well, but how well depends on the wood itself.
Thin CA glue. Thin CA glue penetrates fairly well -- particularly if the wood has small cracks. The downsides are the stuff is expensive and it may discolor/darken the wood. CA glue does a good job of stabilizing wood -- better than Wood Hardener, in my opinion.
Thinned down lacquer or poly. If you're going to finish the piece with lacquer or poly, you might consider using your finish as the stabilizer. Thin the lacquer with lacquer thinner (about 50/50) and let it soak into the soft wood. Let the lacquer dry thouroughly (over night should do). After treatment, the wood should cut more cleanly, but it may be fairly brittle. The lacquer doesn't seem to add anything in terms of structural integrety. It also doesn't seem to penetrate all that well. CA glue and Wood Hardener do a better job, but are more expensive. The lacquer may affect the way the wood will take a finish, but that's not a problem if you were going to use lacquer as the final finish anyway.
Thinned PVA glue. Thinned PVA glue (Titebond) works well at stabilizing soft wood. Thin it with water (about 50/50) and soak the soft wood and wipe off any excess off the surface. Let it dry overnight. The glue may affect the way the wood takes a finish, but that's generally not a problem unless you allowed the glue to puddle on the final surface of the wood or did not treat the entire area. The glue will stiffen the fibers and will impart some additional strength. Like the Wood Hardener, it's not a miricle worker. My experiance is Wood Hardener and thin CA glue penetrate more deeply than does thinned PVA glue.

HTH

[Allen Neighbors]

Curtis, as David said, I use the lacquer. I stabilized some really punky spalted Maple, by that method. I mixed 65%Lacquer/35%Thinner in a can. Then I carefully placed the blank into the mix, endgrain down/up, making sure that I didn't completely submerge it; I let the lacquer come almost to the top of the end grain, and suspend it there. That way, the mix will wick up through the wood, as the air escapes through the top end grain. I leave it overnight. The next day, the entire piece is wet with the lacquer mix, and I take it out and let it dry a few days. It hasn't failed me yet, except when I dropped it in, and coated the upper end with the mix... it wouldn't penetrate completely, then.

[curtis rosche]

well, i was going to use the titebond2 that we have at school. and the peice of wood is only 3x3'' . and it is full of bug holes, its one of those example of what 90 years outside, sitting in a brick wall, with no protection on one end. but it looks like it might be kinda cool inside. i have 2 blocks, one looks like it should be fine but i would rather be safe. the other probably couldnt be cut into a circle without hardening. if i get a chance i will take a picture tommorow.

[Leo Van Der Loo]

Curtis just like David and Allen are telling you, yes it/they work but the biggest problem is penetration is shallow, things like shellac go on in fast and dry fast so you can do a couple of applications and turn a little between each application.
If it is to get a better surface than that's what I would do, after turning close to finish, just do a couple of applications and fine finish turnings .

[curtis rosche]

ok. so shellac.

now whats this about a vacuum? something i could do once i get my pump delivered?

[John Fricke]

Curtis...I posted a while back my thoughts on using the glue soak method then placing the piece in a vacuum bag to suck the glue deeper into the wood. I havn't tried it yet. Let us know how it works.

[Allen Neighbors]

Leo, read my previous post again... :) I get full penetration of the lacquer mix. Of course I don't have a container to do a very large piece, but a 6" dia x 6" thick piece is simple to do with that method. His 3x3 piece sould be a piece of cake. :)

[Leo Van Der Loo]

Hi Allen :-)), that's what I get for not reading your whole post, so if I understand it correctly, you do the block before started turning ?? the osmosis does fill the whole block ?, I've never tried that one Allen, I normally never have that much lacquer around, but I will have to keep that in mind if I run into a blank that would be worth all of that, that would be worthwhile to try with a small piece for sure, thanks for the heads-up on that Allen :-))
I've done the glue and shellack after having done most of the turning already, and that's were my experience is from, and the very shallow penetration in sidegrain with most woods, endgrain is almost always better, but still not deep.
Learned something new again, Thanks Allen :D

[Steve Frederick]

I recently had a section of Oak Limb.
I found as I turned it, that it was very "punky".
I soaked the soft areas with thin C/A glue after I got close to the finished shape. I then turned it as normal.
This may not be cost effective for a large project though. This one is about 5" at the rim.